Lamination Schedule

[Gypsie]

I am looking for a Lam Sched for a sailing cat around 50ft, appreciate any assistance.

[PAR]

You're kidding right?

Hey, I'm looging for wing thicknesses for an airplane, say about 50' long, can you help . . .

[Gypsie]

No mate, I am not looging for wing thickness. I am hoping someone would be kind enough to supply me with a Lam Sched for any particular cat around 50ft to use as a bench mark to design my own. Get the picture???

[Stumble]

I will try to expand what Par was trying to get at.

There is no 'normal' or customary laminate schedule, nor can anyone provide you with one. Every boat, designer, and manufactured 50' boat has used a different laminate schedule. And any remotely well designed boat have used different schedules over different parts of the hull. In addition every type of boat, performance expectation, use of core, expected lifespan, speed, weather envelope, hull type, righting moment... ...rigging type, whatever will change the schedule.


In short there is no such thing as what you asked for.

[Gypsie]

Point taken Stumble

[PAR]

Will you be consulting internationally about this Gypsie?

[tunnels]

What about the designer didnt they spec the laminate for the whole boat ??
Its the designers problem to give the laminate specifications and your problem to do what is written down and dont deviate from it !!!!
If you try to change what was specified and if it falls apart its on your head .
Where in China are you ??
I will be returning there in another 10 days time !

[PAR]

Anyone that has purchased a full set of plans for a 'glass boat of any kind, will have seen a lamination schedule, which can be quite diverse, even on a simple, little boat, let alone the complex layup that would be typically found, on a 50' cat. This is the classic reverse engineering thing, from someone that hasn't bought plans and possably thinks they can "design their own". It makes me wonder what type of "international marine consulting", Randall actually does.

[tunnels]

Taking a big risk if the designer hasent got his laminate specs there !! Broken boats can cost lives !! SPECIALLY IF YOU ARE CAUGHT OUT OFF SHORE SOME WHERE !!

[PAR]

I don't think this is the case Tunnels. I'll bet someone is looking to back engineer a production cat, maybe they got some molds, etc. and haven't a clue about any of the rest of it. I've probably scared him off anyway.

[Gypsie]

Guys, great feedback, I am learning more already. Basically I am a fitout guy, design fabricate and fit. I am not reverse engineering anybody's design, I have a design of my own. Now I am entering the "murky waters" of working out the Lamination Schedule, costing etc. Seems like I have encountered a couple of sharks already and I am only up to my ankles. Like I said, I would appreciate any assistance

[daiquiri]

Don't be stingy, pull out that money and get in contact with a yacht designer, naval architect or an engineer who has experience in this kind of calculations. It's anyways a final client who will get the bill.
It is all about assessing the load paths and necessary materials' orthotropic properties. If you can't do it yourself with a good confidence, then leave it to someone else and concentrate on other aspects of design. You would probably found yourself stuck in the muds with layup particulars for concentrated load areas (winches, keel, deck fittings, mast etc. etc. etc.).

[PAR]

How can you have a design without an accurate weight estimate, which happens to also include the laminates? How do you know where it'll float? How did you settle on a hull volume that will trim as you expect, with the gear, stores, equipment you intend to install? Do you have a "design" or do you have a cocktail napkin with some concepts and ideas on it?

[JRD]

Gidday Randall,
If you want a laminate schedule you can trust you are probably, going to have to pay for it. Its a complete engineering job to determine all the loads then apply the right materials in the right places. Even if you find one to copy from another boat you dont know if the loadings will be applicable, and what conditions the designer planned for. These forums are a great place to ask for a bit of advice but any proffesional here is going to want to look at the the whole job in context before putting their reputation at risk by offering detailed advice without all the information. (then there is the small matter of having to pay the rent and feed the kids...)
If this is for a commercial project there would be an allowance for design anyway......

[Gypsie]

Thanks JRD, appreciate your comments and advice. My design is very muchly "in progress" PAR but a note to all who are kind enough to reply to my thread, I am not adverse to taking what time and effort it takes to get my head around the "layup particulars for concentrated load areas (winches, keel, deck fittings, mast etc. etc. etc.)". The final client is me daiquiri..................