Deck-Hull Joint

[sail]

Hi All,
Thanks for your interesting answers.
Yes I think plexus looks like an ideal compound.After joining the two vertical halves and glued them, I will glass-epoxy a 100- 150 mm wide tape all around the joint inside out, fare it and paint it. I don't think there are many different ways to go if one wants to use the "vertical halves" system.
I prefer it to the unesthetic interlocking glued edges.

[NV5L]

I have a 1971 Luders-33 that needs new toe rails -- several splits, leaks, and some rot. I haven't taken it completely apart, but the joint appears to be glued with some sort of epoxy, and bolted every 8-12 inches, with the massive teak toerail bolted on top and sealed with caulk. Also, all the leaks appear to be coming through the bolt holes. As far as I can tell, every Allied boat leaks like this, so instead of just fixing/replacing the toerail and recaulking, I'd like to remove it all together glass in the joint.

My questions are:

- will this weaken the boat?
- should I build up a new toerail with glass?
- should I replace, remove, or just leave the original hull deck fasteners?

Part of the issue is that the toerails are so big they hold water on the deck, which seems to make maters worse. Any advice would be appreciated.

[tunnels]

Originally Posted by NV5L

I have a 1971 Luders-33 that needs new toe rails -- several splits, leaks, and some rot. I haven't taken it completely apart, but the joint appears to be glued with some sort of epoxy, and bolted every 8-12 inches, with the massive teak toerail bolted on top and sealed with caulk. Also, all the leaks appear to be coming through the bolt holes. As far as I can tell, every Allied boat leaks like this, so instead of just fixing/replacing the toerail and recaulking, I'd like to remove it all together glass in the joint.

My questions are:

- will this weaken the boat?
- should I build up a new toerail with glass?
- should I replace, remove, or just leave the original hull deck fasteners?

Part of the issue is that the toerails are so big they hold water on the deck, which seems to make maters worse. Any advice would be appreciated.

If the toe rail is big can you make some scuppers in that area both sides to drain it dry . If you have rot then you are better to take the lot off and do the job once and for all replace with new and totally glass over the join with a couple of layers of a double bias glass /epoxy and peel ply over the top . When it hard tear off the peel ply and sand then refit new toe rails with scuppers facing aft .
If the bolt holes are rotting and sloppy drill them big back to good wood and use a dowel epoxyed in place and redrill new holes and completely sealed!! before you fit your bolts .

[NV5L]

I've got rot, and splits, in a few places, mostly where hardware was was bolted onto the toerail, e.g., chocks and jib traveler, and splices amidships where the bend was greatest. About 80% of the toerail is okay structurally. The bolts that leaked were mostly where they were hit by the the bolts from added hardware -- the rest seem fine for now.

Last summer, I scraped out the caulk, glued most of the splits, and recaulked it, but still have a few leaks, and one of the splices has reopened, so I think it's time to pull it off.

I have good access inside, so when I build up the joint, I can do so on both sides. If I do that, I'd like to get rid of all holes, and old fasteners. I can add a new fiberglass toerail on top, or a stringer inside, leaving voids for scuppers and chocks, etc., but really don't want any more bolt holes than are absolutely necessary to mount hardware.

I realize the bolts and toerail added a great deal of strength, but since she's such a heavily built boat in the first place, will removing them and going to a solid joint weaken her to the point of failure?

[sail]

Hi NV5L
Tunnels answered what I would have said but there is another situation to consider:
1-Your boat is 30 years old, probably made with polyester that ABSORBS water and
can bring your unprotected fiber glass to near sponge state.
2-The fiber glass along the toe (take the bolts off) rail should be rinced of its salt
with soft water and dried out prior to any lamination.
3-Bolts should be imbedded is 3M -5000 series compound and then fiber glassed on
dried sanded surface.
Before doing anything, I would definitely get advises from a yard, experienced builder or surveyor to make sure of the usefulness of your work. I don't know the extend of the damage. After 30 years of salt water leaks, you could be looking at structural repairs of the hull-deck joint. If I were sick I would check on internet ..but surely go see a doctor...just to be on the safe side.

[NV5L]

Hi Sails:

Yes, I believe it is polyester. The good thing, is that it's mostly been covered and out of the water for the last 8-10 years, and before that, covered every winter. It's been uncovered now for only a couple months, and only getting rained on.

From the inside, I don't see any damage, and the joint looks solid. The water, whenever it rains, will drip from the ends of about half a dozen bolts. The only damage I can see on the outside is to the toerails themselves.

I'll go ahead and remove the toerail and assess any damage before moving forward.

thanks...
don

[sail]

Hi NV5L
Good luck in your project ;hope everything will turn out OK.