Yanmar - How long should it take for oil pressure to come up from a cold start?

Waiting for you to finish typing and post something... CYA later, time to clean up ready for dinner...

 

Frosty,

I think you are right, you can do what you want without a spring loaded reservoir or orifices. On your 3/8" line you will probably have a starter signal operated solenoid valve. You will by-pass this valve to recharge the tank. and

You could try a pressure switch signaled solenoid valve and a non-return valve in line on your by-pass and see how that works. You could also rig up pressure switches so that you know that your bottles are charged before you hit the starter.

Your system will have to be bigger than a spring loaded reservoir as it will only half-empty before the rising engine oil back pressure stops the flow. Maybe you need to add an air bladder in your extinquisher Still, good luck, hope you get a result.

 

Murdo, The solenoid valve will be manually operated, I mean switched by me.

I don't understand why you think that the bottles will charge up before I hit the starter?

Obtained the bottles,-- 4 inch by 17 exactly the same size as the pre lubes suggested size of 4 quarts. Co2 fire extinguishers.

I just released them at the back of the airport it made a lot of smokey stuff. I thought I might have had security running after me. I could have chosen a better place I suppose.

Next job, mountings and valves.

From accusumps pictures,-and pre lube its easy to sea the valve they use. It is a diaphrgm type, this type is of quick discharge ie 1 1inch flow hole making me wonder if yellowbutt is right or not.

 

I did not mean that the bottles would charge up before you hit the starter, you have explained that you will charge them up when the engine is running on its previous run. I am merely suggesting to you that you could have more controls to tell you that the bottles had pressure (i.e. oil) in them before you open your valve.

Valves tend to leak over time, and if that happened and you were not aware of it your alarm would be going again, and your open valved bottle would be taking oil pressure away and not supplying it at the crucial time.

You are concerned about the large valve, and this is why I suggested a by-pass round this valve for re-filling. You could have a mini-bore solenoid valve powered from the engine pressure switch that would remain open while the engine was running. An in-line non-return valve on this by-pass would ensure that you got the maximum pressure in your bottle.

 

Waaaarrrk I was so pleased with your efforts I tried to award some positive rep but "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to apex1 again." seems I gave just recently so am inhibited ....... ....... ....... Have some psuedo points instead .......... ..........

 

Thanks MAS I took them as given......................

 

Lovely pictures --moving as well, very nice, but we were talking about tortional vibration.

You know what torsional vibration is don't you?

That is the frequenecy of the cycles of power from power strokes or compressions resulting in erratic rotating moment of the crankshaft.

I dont think anyone disagreed on the balance.

It is tortional vibration that was making the gearbox rattle.

 

There are no Accessories more than an alternator as standard. Engines are out of the box plug ins.

Engines are separate in every way even fuel.

Yanmar have said that the rattling gearboxes are normal on the 6LP. There is a new drive plate available and is expensive at thier own admission.

It is only when stopping the engines, so if the housing was out it would make noise all the time. The noise is just the crank stopping and rattling the drive because of torsional vibration from the 6 cylinder engine.

There Expert and teacher at Yanmar Australia has said that it is common also for the filters to drain on the 6LP?????? now that I don;t understand as said these engines are Toyota and you would not put up with that in your car.

They don't know and don't want to know, they have my money and warranty is long gone.

They no longer use the Toyota engine for this leasure boat class but have moved over to a BMW derivative. I wonder why?

 

well cant you search a drive plate from another manufacturer same spline same drill pattern, or get a blank, have it drilled?

 

Its a special plate made by Centa, when I took mine out it seemed then 4 years ago to be the right one, ie it was by Centa, Im confused to be honest what it needs. Yanmar seem reluctant to tell me what I need ,i suppose in case it does'nt cure it. The one I have has big rubber bushes in and not the spring type that we are all used to. Yanmar dont know what I have in mine yet they built up the motor for delivery to me.

As you can probably tell I am tired of the whole thing and will have to live with the rattle and tell future buyers that it is normal.

But I will email Yanmar and ask the part number of the Centa that is supposed to cure the prob.

 

Frosty, if you would have read my text (not only look at the pictures) you would have noticed that I mentioned inertia when referring to motion of the piston mass and connecting rod mass generating alternating torques. Though I used the correct term forces.


And I edited my post above

 

Hey Murdo Ive been thinking about what you said. You mean fit 2 valves one slow for charging the bottle and one fast for priming the engine!!! not a bad idea.

Actually over the days that I have been locating parts I have come up with a few mods myself, for instance the valve can be right on the engine not necessarily on the bottle. I even thought of a manual valve for long term storage T'd off to 2 valves.

Maybe getting a bit overboard but thanks for the idea.

Pssst by the way,-- Yanmar are talking again.

 

A separate fill/dump valving is what was suggested way back in post 25...

No need to use a solenoid valve for the input circuit, a simple check valve will work just fine. In fact you could use a 15 psi preloaded check valve (parker makes them) and that would be about right. Then the valve wouldn't crack open until you get 15 psi in the gallery (giving you fast ramp up of pressure to 15 psi) and when you had 30 psi the gallery you would have a half a gallon of oil in the one gallon tank (which should be plenty of oil for the next pre-lube). That way you only need to control the dump, which would be on a momentary switch, and the only time it is working is when it is dumping. To start, hit the momentary dump switch, wait 15 seconds, release the dump switch and start the engine. Forget about it after that.

Much more simple than using different valves, and trying to figure out when to open and when to shut them and what size and restriction you need, more reliable and cheaper too.......

So now we find that your accumulator is twice as big as even I was assuming. Double the size, more than double the time to increase the pressure in the galleries. If you aren't careful here you can do more harm than good....

Well, as Homer Simson would often say.... DOH!!!! :idea:

It's about time you started thinking. Some folks here are trying to help you and you seem to want give all of them a bad time. Sounds more like you don't want to really solve any problems, you just want to gripe out loud....

As you finally noticed, Accusump sytem has a big flow capacity and that is actually good for your particular application. If you don't move a good bit of fluid you aren't going to purge the filter. If you just dribble oil into the gallery upstream of the filter, the filter, being upside down, will still have an air pocket in it and all of the work you are doing won't do you a lot of good. The alarms will go off sooner, but you will end up delivering a shot of air to the bearings just after the engine is running, which may or may not be an issue, but if you are going to all this trouble, why not do it right....

You need to send a slug of oil into the filter to purge the air in it. Hence a good size valve and delivery tube in the dump side of your system, and a smaller restricted inlet side to control filling is the best approach.

 

Yanmar Engines

Hello Frosty,

Who are you dealing with in Australia?? I have just installed a set of 6CX-GTE2 -500hpengines in my boat and have 25hrs on the engines. I read with interest your problems.

Hopefully I wont recieve the same when I develope a problem and go looking for help.
My choice for Yanmar was made because a friend of mine has a set in a boat the same as mine with 6000 hrs with not a spanner on them. I'm looking for the same result. Time will tell.