Large capacity, slow revving 5-700hp engines

[Landlubber]

Hey fellas,

I am looking at building a 100 foot steel expedition vessel, I would appreciate info and web sites on diesel engines running under 2000rpm, continuous rated, and appropriate gear boxes to suit such a condition.

I know a lot of folks would recommend Luggers and MAN type of engines, but I am looking for direct injection, KISS type motors, and am having trouble locating these dinosaurs.

Would prefer in line too, fussy eh?

My last boat this size had a MAK direct drive in it, I loved the ol girl, 1.5 tons a day at 10 knots! And she was 160 feet.

[lazeyjack]

IMO, the best engine for your boat is the Cummins 855m
or the Kt 1150, (both mean cu /inch Forget Lugger they are just a Nippon moter converted in Seattle
Cummins and twin disc
the trouble is with slow diesels is they cost, lots But if you want google up, Duetz, some of their engines, 400hp at 300 rpm, and they weigh like tonnes,
Also google up Lister Blackstone
I love these slow heavy engines, but they are all iN Europe, where small ships ply the Rhine
http://www.dieselenginetrader.com/in...gine_find_menu.
oh and by the way all cummins and emd, and gm are direct inj. have been for eons
http://www.dieselenginetrader.com/index.cfm
also you shud understand that slow engines , are 75-200 revs, medium speed engines are under a thousand (roughly ) all the rest are high speed to very high speed

[Landlubber]

"all cummins and emd, and gm are direct inj. have been for eons"
Not quite mate, they are common rail in the QSB electronic series, and yes of course you are right about slow speed, I should have said slower speed, but I did say my old boat was a MAK, it did 575rpm, so I do know what you mean.
Thanks Lazyjack for the starter, I appreciate youy help.

[Landlubber]

I need 500 to 700 hp, the Cummins 855's are too small.

They are to be continuous rated at these speeds, no use intermitant ratings.

[FAST FRED]

Don't know how they push trains in your area , but the EMD is common and might be had used.

These engines are designed for rebuilding , so a used engine is worth considering.

http://www.emdiesels.com/en/pmi/dies...ines/index.htm

FF

[Landlubber]

Lazyjack,

While looking for the info on the Cummins 885's, I found Cummins India. What a great assortment they have, I have emailed them just now for more details. Thanks again mate.

[lazeyjack]

Originally Posted by Landlubber;

I need 500 to 700 hp, the Cummins 855's are too small.

They are to be continuous rated at these speeds, no use intermitant ratings.

so what, if they are commom rail they are direct injection, the comman rail deiveries low press fuel to the injector, then the inj squirts at up to 1500 bar
the older non electronic engines, took fuel, (in a common rail) thru the heads, and supplied at 150--200 psi to the inj, and then the injectors ran off the cam shaft and t as far as I know still do
Ok try kt1150 cummins or 2300 cu inch vee, or up,
still what the heck do I know I only worked for cummins in the 70,s)
ps I am not up with current models


T = Turbocharged , TA = Turbocharged Aftercooled.
sound like you need go the vee way, they do make some bigger stuff, thing with Cummins is the worlwide backup and they do not overate the engines, unlike say volvo,(hand grenade rating)

[RANCHI OTTO]

Thanks lazeyjack for the infos...

[lazeyjack]

Originally Posted by Landlubber;

Lazyjack,

While looking for the info on the Cummins 885's, I found Cummins India. What a great assortment they have, I have emailed them just now for more details. Thanks again mate.

it ok, I guess I love Cummins
I am sunshine coast, dont do much building now
i was with Cummins newcastle, helped start the branch in 72
those big v engines are mainly in locos, mines, marine, cessnas) Once years ago there was a tug, Straits Winner, taking tow Syd to Singapore, ex ferries from Syd, she had the V12 and it was giving trouble off Coffs Harbour, I went out, could find nothing wrong, the eng packed up by Cairns, turns out it had been overrated, and did not have the piston oil cooling Cummins just bunged in a new engine Another time a man was building a 55 cruiser in Newcastle, he bought the engines 7 years before the launch date, On launch date Cummins went down, stamped the engines date in service, and his warraty started then!!

[StianM]

maybe a 3 cyl Wichman AX?

they are hard to come by since production is stoped and some shipowners buy them second hand and restore them.

If you buy a 3cyl wichman you can have it upgraded to latest specs and get a 6cyl block and crank using the exsisting engine number and just call it a overhault, since wartsile officaly no longer want to produce this engine.

[FAST FRED]

The "old" common rail was simply a fuel source to the injector , and the injector created the pressure, as a rocker timed the injection..

The Modern "common rail" is pressurized to 20,000 to 30,000 psi and a computer will fire the injector 2 to 4 times during ONE power stroke.

The first tiny squirt gets the fire started , the next is for power , the last cleans the up exhaust , and gets more power.

That is why the newest diesels make auto type noises , the first tiny squirt doesn't ring the cylinder like a bell , making all that "diesel" noise.

And the expensive new stuff is claimed to be 20% more eficent than the non electric injected engines.

FF

[Landlubber]

Fast Rred,

Yeah, that is correct, there is one real bad problem with the electronic injectors, they cost AUS$ 6000 EACH! This is from Yanmar......
Soooo, a six cylinder ebgine is 36,000 for a new set??????????

I remember when the whole engine cost that much!

[lazeyjack]

Originally Posted by FAST FRED;

The "old" common rail was simply a fuel source to the injector , and the injector created the pressure, as a rocker timed the injection..

The Modern "common rail" is pressurized to 20,000 to 30,000 psi and a computer will fire the injector 2 to 4 times during ONE power stroke.

The first tiny squirt gets the fire started , the next is for power , the last cleans the up exhaust , and gets more power.

That is why the newest diesels make auto type noises , the first tiny squirt doesn't ring the cylinder like a bell , making all that "diesel" noise.

And the expensive new stuff is claimed to be 20% more eficent than the non electric injected engines.

FF

fred I neevr knew that, I thought all worked off camshaft, how does electronic squirt 1500 bar, 25000, (which I already posted)?

[FAST FRED]

how does electronic squirt 1500 bar, 25000, (which I already posted)?

Many use an ELECTRIC fuel pump to get that incredible pressure.

The fancy injector is just a piezo valve (works faster than a solenoid) .

FF



FF

[lazeyjack]

Originally Posted by FAST FRED;

how does electronic squirt 1500 bar, 25000, (which I already posted)?

Many use an ELECTRIC fuel pump to get that incredible pressure.

The fancy injector is just a piezo valve (works faster than a solenoid) .

FF



FF

in my way of thinking a common rail is a fuel supply running past all inj. at very low pressure, then the inj timed off cam, and the plunger with return spring drives down the needle
ok I see i was wrong, I looked it up, and suprise suprise, its multi stage and all that, well i,m buggered