Taking the lines of an existing hull

[Caldera Boats]

Screw all you anti-splashers! I can and WILL steal every design you self centerd pricks have, and make them available for FREE on the web.

The end to copyright is near..............

[Chris Ostlind]

And that's exactly why you never saw a set of plans for the nice little daysailing monohull I designed.

You're not a person of character and owning $5000 software isn't going to fix that issue in this lifetime. I wonder what your parents think about your sorry state of integrity?

Chris

[Caldera Boats]

I posted that to prove a point. The global business world does not respect morals or copyrights.
I know first hand when I worked for the Chinese. Every single piece of software was pirated and every idea was stolen from some else. Eventually they were able to undermine all overseas competition. This is how real business world works. It is dog eat dog, survival of the best swindler.

So, if you want to protect your intellectual property, you must do it yourself.
No person or government will protect you from the global pirates. Anything that can be digitized can and will eventually be stolen.

[Caldera Boats]

I must apologize to 'waterman' for hi-jacking your thread, I just get pi$$ed off every time the "Moral Design Police" make posts about copying other boats when most of their own designs are no more than copies of others.

[Chris Ostlind]

Then say that, dude.

Every emerging economic culture does that routine until they get themselves to a more mature state of production. The USA did it to the Euro's when we were trying to get something going as a new nation. So, what's the beef?

Chris

[Chris Ostlind]

There's a very sharp distinction between an adaptation of a design and flat-out copying the form. If adaptations are out, then the whole boat business collapses for the reason you inferred. While too much of that direct snatching/splashing goes on to suit my tastes, it's inevitable that good ideas will serve as jumping-off points for further explorations of a form.

Chris

[Caldera Boats]

My beef is:
Every time a person is seeking information about taking the lines off an existing hull, there are numerous posts from the "Moral Design Nazis" discouraging them to do so....

If you want to take lines of an existing hull, do it!
If you want to design a copy of a similar boat, do it!
If you wish to take someone else’s lines and change then into your own, do it!
If you want to build a boat, just do it!!!!!

Stealing each others designs actually increases creativity.

I would be flattered if somebody stole one of my designs.

A good designer/builder will always stand out from the rest!! period!!!

[Guillermo]

Originally Posted by Caldera Boats

...I would be flattered if somebody stole one of my designs...

Most unlikely. I don't think that will happen.

[SamSam]

http://www.loc.gov/folklife/maritime/linesb2.html
Techniques are discussed by John Gardner in his articles "Taking Lines Off Bigger Boats," "Taking Off Lines Allows Duplication of Existing Boats," and "Triangulation Method is Well Suited to Lifting Lines," by Walter J. Simmons in his book Lines, Lofting and Half Models

Gardner, John. "Taking Lines Off Bigger Boats." National Fisherman 67, no.1 (May 1986): 58.

_______. "Taking Off Lines Allows Duplication of Existing Boats." National Fisherman 66, no. 12 (April 1986): 44-5.

_______. "Triangulation Method is Well Suited to Lifting Lines." National Fisherman 67, no. 4 (August 1986): 65-67.

[tom28571]

When I was trying to develop an understanding of planing boats, I took the bottom lines of several boats. It had absolutely nothing to do with copying, splashing or any other kind of cheating. I was trying to relate performance to design from imperical data and think I learned a lot. I mostly learned why some boats are so bad in some respects. My own designs owe something to that work but are not very close to any of the boats I measured. Perhaps that is the issue with many who ask about taking lines.

There are lots of reasons other than splashing for taking lines from an existing boat. Realistically though, I expect Caldera is more right than wrong in his asessment. Still, we ought to respect the originator of a design around here.

[CapKos]

I would be flattered if somebody stole one of my designs.

Did you have something to be stolen?
CapKos

[wdnboatbuilder]

I have said it is wrong to copy a design " splashing" But I usually find it funny and just wonder if these people have the skills to draw a lines plan. Have they ever made a half hull? have they ever taken the half hull and see if it matched the lines plan that they made it from? I will have to say that if you can do that then WHY THE HELL ARE YOU ASKING HOW TO TAKE THE LINES OFF A BOAT? IF YOU CAN'T THEN PAY THE DAMN MONEY AND BUY THE DESIGN!!!

[safewalrus]

Woody you got the right idea "if you can do if you can't . . .
Caldera methinks you too have it - plagarism is the most serious form of flattery ever!
And if anybody steals any of my ideas enjoy 'em cos man you'll drown, one way or another (think about it!!)

[Tim B]

In my opinion, there is very little point in actually stopping people from copying a design (we all know that all the ACC keels are pretty much EXACTLY the same). After all, if someone wants to copy, they'll just wait for it to be build and take a load of offsets, you need a ruler and a square, it's not hard.

The good designer, however will have progressed from that design by the time anyone realises it's worth copying. Also, you often find that the people who go out and "copy" hull-shapes are not designers themselves, they may be builders (or amateurs), but it's not hard to design something that will out-perform a poor copy of an existing design.

Further, the hull design for most boats does not actually a large part of the design. True, the hull (and rig) defines the handling charateristics and performance, but it is the interior that really takes the time, and that is the test of a good designer... does everything fit?

Tim B.

[grahampace]

Can you tell me why you need these drawings ? i do such work but normally am asked to do it by the surveyors in the name of the manufacturers to get the ce certifications prior the boat is built.