Submersible Sailboat?

[uber33t]

Greetings!

This is my first post here, so please, be gentle.

While on a recent vacation to Hawaii, I had somewhat of an epiphany. I use to go sailing when I was younger, and was contimplating designing and building my own sailboat for my own recreation.

However, one of my concerns had become how to weather rough storms while at sea, and thinking of a sailboat brought fears of capsizing to mind. I thought of using a catamaran design, and using wing sails, instead of cloth sails, but then I had another really far out thought.

Would it be possible to design such a sailboat that was able to sink itself on purpose, so that surface waves/weather wouldn't pose a problem?

I imagine you could have collapsable wing sails that could fold into the outriggers, and was thinking of using Aluminium as the construction material. I also like the idea of using hydrofoils to achieve a nice fast top speed.

Any thoughts or comments?

[cyclops]

There is no need to design that feature in. It comes with all over confident captains.

I really don't know much about subs though they fascinate me. But the little I do know suggests that making the boat submersible might be heavy and that would affect the viability of hydrofoils for sailing.
But I'm not at all sure about that especially if you don't go too deep.
It's a wild idea but taking a serious look at it could be fun!

[uber33t]

Yeah, I was thinking it might prove to be too heavy, but the idea behind it is to go just deep enough to avoid surface waves in really rough seas. Another reason hit me while reading that pirate thread, in that you could just submerge and hide.

I'd expect to be able to avoid severe storms through simple evasion. But in the unlikely event you did find yourself in troubled waters, you wouldn't have to worry about fliping the boat, or having large waves cause fatal structural damage.

[cyclops]

Stay in sight of land and you will always enjoy your boating.

[sharpii2]

Hi Uber.

A vessel of similer purpose was built by Robert Fulton for the French in 1801. It was called the Nautilus. It was hand cranked underwater and had a callapsable sail rig for when it was on the surface.

Apparently it worked. But not good enough for the French. I, myself, thought of a similer idea as a teenager when writing a story about drug smugglers. My fictional vessel could not manuever under water, but simply disapear under the waves at the sight of a coast guard cutter. It had a specially designed rig that could come down in minutes (and go up just as fast as soon as the danger had passed).

It's a very enticeing idea until someone does the math. Such a vessel will have to be very heavy to not only survive underwater pressures but to carry all the pumps and ballast tanks as well as underwater propulsion system (batters and generators to recharge them). The sail rig will have to be very compact and, therefore, of modest area. Such a rig would have nothing near the power needed to climb up on even the best hydrofoils on anything less than a hurricane (which it is supposeably designed to avoid).

That being said, there may be times when such a vessel may be useful. Such a vessel would most likely be a monohull, so it could best use pendular stability (the only kind that would work reliably under water). The catamaran hull form would be of little advantage considering the modest sail plan such a vessel would likely carry.

Interesing idea though.

Bob

[SailDesign]

If you ever find a book called "The Mother of Storms", there is a boat in there that does just that. Not a good book by anyone's standards (apologies to the author if he reads this), but an interesting boat...

[Filmdaddy]

I don't think that the weight of such a boat (fantastic idea) is a concern. Bathyspheres made out of acrylic dive quite easily and routinely, to thousands of feet. As I understand it, this boat would only have to get down out of the immediate turbulent surface water. using water ballast, a circular cross section for the living area, a moderately triangular hull... sounds do-able. Get down to forty feet, and you're secure almost anywhere except in thirty-five foot water.
Hydrofoils, I don't think so. Sail, why not? Dipping scows used to use a huge chunk of wood... think tree trunk... that pivoted on a post in the bow. Why not consider something like that for surface travel?
Underwater, I don't know enough engineering. But batteries seem a possibilty. Useful in marinas, too...

[Sean Herron]

Hello...

This is unrelated, but I have been looking around for a small aeroplane that apart from flying as it inherently should also has the capability of tunneling through the dirt in some sort of strange way...

I am also hoping to hook up my wifes blender via some sort of belt drive to my motorcycle engine so I can mix 'colatas while cruising...

That and my huge evaporator sculpture that runs off my kitchen cold water tap and air conditions my condo for 'no dollars down' - and functions as a copper Christmas tree on Jesus' birthday - two birds and a .22 ...

A submersible sailboat is the type of thought that truly intrigues yet makes me ask if you might share what you eat and drink with the rest of us - perhaps package it and sell it worldwide...

Hah...

SH.

[Filmdaddy]

Sean Herron - Glad that you could find some laughs about the idea. What does it cost to consider something outside the box? BTW, for those mobile margaritas, there's a blender run off a chainsaw motor, and a kind of cooling system that uses maxwell's demon to carefully separate the hot air molecules from the cold, and send them down different pipes.
Hah back atcha.

[Sean Herron]

Hello...

But really though - lets not be bitter - you see, while vacuuming and cleaning my little condo 'with a nice hardwood floor' I could not help thinking - hmmm...

Things came to mind - one vague thing was a very old article where some guy was playing with a model trimaran whose main hull was SWATH like and it worked - might be in my storage locker somewhere...

That and the possibilty of kite sails - how DO you actually sail submerged without a lot of inter surface drag - hmmm...

You are correct to chastise my shallow and narrow character but hell - I was just having a 'go' - it's allowed - this could be interesting...

I particularily see a controllable submersible on a kite popping out of the air water interface - flying about for awhile - then diving back under the water - sounds crazy - but can you see it - it would be a gas, gas, gas - got the Stones going on my 11 setting...

Below may be interesting to the lot of you...

Hah - and back at you - http://www.midcoast.com/~kittredg/sailing%20UEM.jpg ...

Cheers...

SH.

[cyclops]

Actually any boat with a fully retractable keel weight that can have all openings sealed and have the keel retracted high enough UP into the hull would work. We want to cause the boat to capsize in heavy seas. It then has the bottom up, the strongest and best surface for breaking waves to hit. It will give the safest and most comfortable ride. It needs to have some deal of designing in life with the boat upside down. Doable ? Yes.

[Filmdaddy]

SH - Bitter? Not me. Philosophical. What I understood was that this would be a boat which, in inclement weather, would have the option of sinking under control, as it were. Superstructure would fold into the hull, and bob's your undle. Speaking of which, is Don a relative?
Cyclops - now that is an interesting thought, and a potentially truly weird safety feature.

[Filmdaddy]

SH - sorry. Forgot to Hah you.

Hah.

And, because I don't do commercially available smileys... : )

[Sean Herron]

Hello...

That was some bit from an award winning radio ad - I love it...

So I pulled back on the addie bar for that photo I found - I think the owner of the site is serious - and is military...

Holy crap...

Yeah - holy crap...

See http://www.midcoast.com/~kittredg ...

Cheers...

SH.