pump-out free / dry toilet system?

greetings.

as a wholly inexperienced boater, but somewhat experienced RV-er, i'm distraught to find the same haunting condition in boats as there are in RV's... namely, having to pump-out your own waste!

i saw - on tv - a system that seems like it might be a great solution to this problem, and after hours of fruitless googling i'm turning to the forum here to see if anyone has also seen this ... device. i'm speaking of what is essentially a giant version of the airhead toilet (http://www.airheadtoilet.com/).

i don't get the impression it weighs much, but size would definitely be a limitation; the guy on the tv-show was standing next to it and the thing was as big as two refrigerators stacked on top of each other. essentially, it's a self-contained treatment plant. tied to a propitiatory low-flow toilet that gives a true flush using less than a third of a gallon of water, and a positive air-flow setup that exhausts constantly so there is never any odor. this machine supposedly only will need to be emptied twice a year. and the waste is actually almost like dust or ash, and is sterile... and extremely small in volume; around a shoe-box worth. clearly it's using a very similar theory of desiccation that the air-head is, only this system you don't have to empty the liquids separately.

size limitations aside, it seems to be that it would be extremely convenient to not have to worry about pump-out tanks. both in terms of simply not having to deal with it, but also cheaper fees to tie up to port. no sewer pump-out? no problem!

is there already a boating equivalent to this machine? something that you could plumb two commodes to and it would take the place of a black-water tank system? in the show i saw the guy mentioned a retail cost of under $3k... comparatively cheap to terrestrial septic-tank systems, and i would imagine pretty reasonable for a total solution on a boat that would give the comfort of flushing commodes and never having to pump-out.

 

That is called a long drop out here I doubt any toilet can be made completely maintenance free on a boat.

Someone was here told me about a bacteria system, looks like gravel and all waste is processed quickly and odour free. Haven't seen it though.

Nothing is forever.

 

they have a Coast Guard approved model for RVs and boats.
http://www.sun-mar.com/prod.html

 

@fanie, no i would never mean to imply maintenance free... but free of handling a horrible slurry. instead you're dealing with dessicated remnants. until something breaks, of course.

@rasorinc, ah! that's exactly what i was imagening! i figured somebody would have already streamlined the system... boy, now i wonder what the big deal was with the guy's device on the show? it was clunkier by far than the products from sun-mar...

what a hilarious picture though :

hmm. i wonder what this ominous sounding statement means : "All central low flush systems are supplied with a 1" drain hose which should be connected to the 1" drain at the bottom left of the unit. Liquid output should be collected or drained into an approved facility." on the bottom of the page. does the system fully treat the effluent or not???

 

This is the unit going in my 28' cat. It comes with a fan in the vent pipe to help evaporate excess liquid and the fan needs to run during all boat operations. Excess liquid is the only thing that needs an overflow. I doubt I will have any problem but if I had 6 people on the boat for a weekend I would want a small overflow tank for excess and for kitchen water. (gray water) All wastes come out clean when you finally have to empty the tray. Use it on your flowers. Proven system. the coast guard model is all contained in the unit. Above system (picture) is for complete family residential use. Their web site covers it well. I dump some bleach in to my gray water thru the kitchen sink to kill any bacteria before emptying. the waste contained in the unit it moist to dry and is consumed by bacteria and other microbes. No odor either. the first thing the coast guard checks is your thru hulls. If you have a waste thru hull you will have to lock it. They are real fussy about this until your 1 mile offshore in salt water. no dumping in fresh water allowed. my only thru hull is water to cool engines.

 

@rasorinc, you're saying that this system is designed to handle gray water as well as black? i was imagining a required secondary tank system for showers and sinks.

very interesting!

are these new enough to explain their apparent rarity on boats, or am i just out-of-the-know?

 

You are correct. this system is for solid waste and urine. excess urine needs to flow into your shower, kitchen gray water tank. You may never have an overflow of urine but you are covered if you do. been around for years for residential use but sunmar has the only CG approval becaue they designed a unit for boats that bounce around a lot. many firms make composting toilets for use in homes where ICBO approval has been granted. But those don't bump around. they got CG approval 2-3 years ago I believe. Call or email them they will respond. My bath is 30" x 48" with toilet at the end and you sit on it to shower as I have low ceiling. I have a fiberglass shower pan with drain to grey tank so I WILL JUST PUT THE OVERFLOW INTO THAT. It has a trap and vent also. Coast Guard will love you.
Sure beats propane toilets......Use these products on your boat--been around years ( over 50 ) and are biodegradable. http://www.shaklee.net/scotts/getclean/ourproducts/basich2/concentrate

 

Here is a company that may have an answer to your problem. My old boss has one of their incinerating toilets in his hunting cabin in Georgia. He loves it. Two men 10 days, empty less than a shoebox full of odorless ashes. works off propane and a car battery.

They also now make a blackwater incinerator to deal with blackwater from a normal holding tank system.

http://ecojohn.com/ecojohn_sr.html

 

wish i could remember the name of it, but when i was in highschool the folks had 42 hatteras and it had a toilet system that ionized and purified everything back to water that could be dumped in the ocean uscg approved. so it is out there, maybe check with hatteras. system had a turn knob, you'd turn the knob, then flush, then it was gone after some point in the cycle

 

I know of no active system of waste disposal into fresh water or bays that is TODAY approved by the Coast Guard. There have been numerous new laws regarding discharge of sewage by marine craft. If you find a product please let me know.

 

Look here:

http://www.hamannag.com/

Although my knowledge of their system is based on a installation aboard a 55 mtr. boat, they claim to provide much smaller sizes too. The quality is just outstanding high. As is the price.

Regards
Richard

 

Money can conquor all I guess. but, small systems like this on inland lakes and rivers in California and Oregon can not discharge any more than residential systems like this due to the fact they might not use the proper chemicals or forget to use the chemicals at all. Some lakes require County and state approval also water development councils, etc, all have to issue approvals. But that is us out west. I'll stick to a composting toilet. Thanks for the link. PS It takes a lot of propane to use a gas toilet as it all has to evaporate, and that is time and money. and weight.

 

Money rules.............. sometimes.
The system I mentioned did´nt use fuel, electricity only.

Regards
Richard

 

check out "compost commodes"

You throw a handful of sawdust in the tray under everything and a fan vents the vapors off, allowing the solids to decompose.

 

I have not seen the article he his refering to in practical sailor, but if i recall correctly, cat2fold uses the composte airhead and it seems to work well without the smells. I am considering it too, the key to good composting seems to be good ventilation, if you can get the air out up the mast , chances are you will have minimum odors. Would an aluminum (painted black) mast pull the air up ? Food for thought ...