Pedal Powered Boats

[portacruise]

Hey, we really appreciate your sharing your investigations whether dumb or brilliant.

I'm not a patent attorney, but only have developed a pragmatic approach to patentable ideas. Is there really any protection from patent infringment for the little guys like us?

My brother in law has dozens of patents in the highly lucrative medical area and we've spent hours considering why they've never paid off for him. Basically, his observation are that the inventor must have huge resources to protect any brilliant idea. First, it's only worth going after someone that has very deep pockets which will get deeper as a result of your invention. Then, only an inventor with deep pockets (or political power) is the only thing that represents a threat and will be respected by the violator. Even then, some will be unreachable, as we have seen with the copycats in Asia.

In his case, one invention was pitched directly to a medical supply company and was rejected to be unusable. Incredibly, they took this one, did an extremely insignificant minor modification of material, and today production grosses 500 million every year. No legal firm would take his case on contingency, not even his own brother's, who is an attorney.... And to top it off, there were implied threats of various kinds when he appealed directly to the supply company's integrity!
Sad story, sort of reminds me of the interval windshield wiper's inventor.

I have other stories, but maybe this should be moved to another section.

The way I see it, nothing wrong with copying, especially since you have given credit from what I read in your posts here. Besides, you have put in a lot of effort in developing the best materials and specific prototype applications. That's really helped all us tinkerer's, saving time and resources. Thanks.

Porta

Originally Posted by Rick Willoughby

Most of the things you see peppered through this thread are the result of me investigating, hopefully thoroughly, a whole raft of "dumb" ideas over the last 7 years. So I consider any comment as a potential source of inspiration.

Some people have offered brilliant ideas that I felt were patentable but they could not be bothered exploiting it. So I shamelessly copy anything that has merit.

Rick W

[I57]

Nearly finished the proa and hope to test it this week weather permitting. I tried the flex shaft but was having problems because of its length (3 metres).
I have made a driveleg using the involute gearbox connected to a 1:1 gearbox
with a 450mm dia prop. The boat is designed to run up onto the beach and I have put in a swinging rudder at the stern, I know its not the most efficient rudder but the whole boat sits flat on the sand. The drive leg pivots on a steel rod fixed to a support frame bolted to the boat, this way I can unbolt the frame and try something else without having to carve up the boat. Hopefully I have done my sums right and I don't go for a swim ( I have a full length wetsuit ).

[Guest625101138]

Ian
Looks neat and functional.

Where are you going to test it out?

Rick

[I57]

Rick
I'll probaly go to the Patterson river as I can park next to the water and its a good launching place ( Melways 97 D 6 ). Maybe Thursday at this stage, see how I go, let you know. I've set it up so different drives can be bolted on and tried out.

Ian

[I57]

Put the proa into the water today and went ok, steel rod supporting the driveleg bent so will have to upgrade it. Driveleg needs to be fixed more rigidly but only a minor problem, how long the 1:1 gearbox will last is another matter. It's taking the load between the involute gearbox and the 450mm dia prop so see how it holds up ( I carry a paddle ). The outrigger sat deeper in the water than I planed but boat handled well and is stable. I am half sitting over the water and half on the main hull, feels strange at first but leaning out each side it still had stability in reserve. Big plus was being able to sit the boat on the beach and slide it into the water, only got my feet wet.

Ian

[Guest625101138]

Ian
Are you doing any testing on the weekend.

Rick

[I57]

Rick
Unlikely to take the proa out this weekend as I have to make a new support frame with a stronger steel rod and put a bigger support tube on drivleg. At least the boat dosen't need any work, the support frame unbolts and a simple matter of bolting on the new one. Maybe the following weekend it should be ready.

Ian

[I57]

Took the proa out again today and boat handled well. The driveleg worked ok for a while and then started to clunk as I had started to strip the gears in the 1:1 gearbox fixed to the prop. I was hoping it would last a bit longer but couldn't resist trying a few sprints, at least I didn't have far to paddle back.
Next step is to go back to a flexible steel shaft attached to the involute gearbox.

Ian

[Guest625101138]

Ian
That looks really neat.

What box did you use? Given all the effort in the fairing and the neatness of the set up it seems a pity that you are pulling it apart. I am sure you could get a box that will work with it.

Rick W

[I57]

Rick
I used the involute gearbox at the top and a cheap right angle drill bit at the bottom, other problem was water getting in. I wanted to see how a driveleg would work with the proa layout, when going at speed there was a lot of turbulence as the driveleg was against the hull. It was easy to remove the involute gearbox from the driveleg and the support frame unbolts from the boat. The boat is ready with the involute gearbox directly fixed to a flexible steel shaft mounted on a support frame bolted to the boat. This has to be the fastest conversion I've done, the boat is ready to go again with a different drive system, a bit of forward planning for a change. Wait and see what the weather is tomorrow.

Ian

[Guest625101138]

Ian
What have you used for the shaft?

Where will you test it?

Rick

[I57]

Rick

Didn't get out on the weekend but hope to test the boat on Thursday at Patterson River. Flexible shaft is 8mm dia steel, see how it goes.
Just giving you the update on my latest project, I've finally succeded in making a twisted chain drive that works. That is one where the chain stays on and dosen't slip off all the time. The problem I've had in the past is going from the large chain ring with 52 teeth at the top and then turning it 90 degrees and going to a 13 teeth gear at the bottom. This time I have used a 13 tooth gear at the bottom turning 90 degrees to a 21 tooth gear at the top. This is fixed to a bike front wheel axle with the 21 tooth on one side and a 13 tooth on the other, the 13 tooth gear is connected in-line to the 52 tooth gear at the cranks. I've cranked it up fast and the chains still stay on track although it hasn't been tested under load. Distance from prop to centre of cranks is 650mm, this is the shortest distance where the chain runs smoothly. Gear step up is 6.5 to 1, once the fairing is on I'll try it out on the proa.

Ian

[Tiny Turnip]

How did the testing go Rick?
We've had alternating storms and balmy calm on Gigha.Paul and I have been tuning Fangle, including sea trials in a force 6 today, Which the dart 18 hulls handled well even on the beam. The knocking problem with the damaged drive unit turned out to be the damage stressed ABS prop flexing under load, and I have now replaced it with the spare 12" prop and it seems fine, and probably helps balance the power and fitness differential between me and Paul.
The forecast for tomorrow is pretty good, so we are hoping to attempt a cirCumnavigation of the island- about 15miles. We can't time it so the tide is with us all the way, but we have made easy head way into the tide stream during trials.

[Guest625101138]

TT
The only testing I have done recently is with the electric drive. I have been playing around with toothed belts. It is the drive unit for a model boat but I got up to 11kph on the pedal boat using it. Motor weighs 329 grams.

Nice to hear Fangle is living up to expectations. You will have a sense of achievement after 15miles. It is satisfying how quickly you can cover ground if you are able to hold a consistent speed.

You have to post some photos and more impressions and experiences with the boat. I am quite amazed that not many people are out and about on fast pedal boats. I think the pedalos type stuff has given the concept a poor reputation.

What does Paul think of it? Have the boys been on it?

Rick

[Tiny Turnip]

A pretty successful trip today. 15 mile circumnavigation in 4 hours plus 2x 15 minute stops. 4 knots seems to be the normal comfortable cruising speed. 5 foot swells, even on the beam, were not an issue for the dart hulls. And they cut through head seas beautifully. Very little windage apparent. Some problems with adjustments in the chain tension and the kickup buttons slipping - they are rather fiddly.
not as much wildlife as we'd hoped - just one seal, gannets shear waters gulls and cormorants. Paul is well into it and planning island hopping with the pup tent. and I have to build the kiddy seats! we also ran trips round the bay with 3 adults and four children on board, plus all the gear. And an outing with a very spritely Sally pedalling smoothly at 75. A good day. Photos to post on return to home PC mid August.