New design of revolutionary boat

[patiras]

It is a real revolution in water transportation!!!

Puts my aim tomorrow of finding a better bolt for a hatch clip into rather harsh perspective.

I look forward to it.

Best of luck, Al.

[vapera]

Originally Posted by patiras

Puts my aim tomorrow of finding a better bolt for a hatch clip into rather harsh perspective

Patiras,

I'm sorry, but my skills for understanding English are in an intermediate level, I couldn't understand the meaning of what you said above. I even searched for a meaning in google, with no luck. Google is still not unfallible.

Thank you anyway.

[portacruise]

Thanks for posting about this clever and unusual design.

Originally Posted by vapera

The title of my patent as the world's longest watercraft is indubitable because the Tequila has a connection system that works like a drawer, it is made in the shape, it is made in plastic, and it is rigid. My invention has beam(s) (it is possible to make beams with all sorts of the best materials to resist the mechanical stress in torsion, flex and compression), and these beams can pivot between modules, like a snake spine.




This is the part I don't quite understand. If you use the beams in the pivot mode, won't a great deal of energy be lost to all this flexing? I don't think propulsion like a snake on the surface is particularly efficient. At least all the surface snakes I have seen are are slow and limited to a small range on the water surface compared to other water displacement animals....

If the beams and modules are made completely rigid, how long can the materials in floating modules endure the pounding from torsion, flex and compression before their material yields? Even a rectangular metal frame of the strongest material will warp and yield to pounding of waves, bumps with floating objects, etc. But I am not an engineer, so may just be overlooking something simple....

Thanks,

Porta





So it is possible to connect "infinite" people, it has no limit, because the structural stress is minimized and it can bend in any way. If you try this with Tequila, it will brake down, besides it won't be able to bend. They are not the same, but this does not reduce the qualities of the Tequila.

[patiras]

Sorry; I guess what I'm saying is that I'm going to be spending today on a lathe, making one bolt for one hatch fastener for one hatch for a specific boat within one sector of the personal watercraft market.

"Revolutionising water transport" is quite a project.

I've been involved with kayaks for the last 30 years, and every year there are a couple of inventions that are going to revolutionise the kayak industry. By contrast, I, as most serious kayakers, use a kayak that has been hundreds of years in the evolution; everything about it has a purpose that has been developed over generations.
I think if you can get an investor, and produce them cheaply enough then they will sell; I like it, its quirky and I can see our guests playing with it down on the shore, but I am worried that investors will not take you seriously untill you identify exactly what your markets are, and it isn't everything to everyone.


All the best, Al.

www.trinitykayaks.com

[NoEyeDeer]

Two suggestions.

1/ Lose the flash intro. Splash pages like that will increase your bounce rate dramatically. People don't want to wait for that to load, or even for it to load enough for the skip link to operate. They want information. Give them the home page first and let them find movies if they want them later.

2/ I second what others have said about the need to identify your market. I looked through the "Models" page and I can tell you that the sliding seat rowing version will never be taken seriously by anyone interested in high performance (or even moderately high performance) recreational rowing craft. It's just not functional for that application.

Those points aside, it is an interesting concept that will probably appeal to some markets.

[vapera]

This is the part I don't quite understand. If you use the beams in the pivot mode, won't a great deal of energy be lost to all this flexing? I don't think propulsion like a snake on the surface is particularly efficient. At least all the surface snakes I have seen are are slow and limited to a small range on the water surface compared to other water displacement animals....

If the beams and modules are made completely rigid, how long can the materials in floating modules endure the pounding from torsion, flex and compression before their material yields? Even a rectangular metal frame of the strongest material will warp and yield to pounding of waves, bumps with floating objects, etc. But I am not an engineer, so may just be overlooking something simple....

Hi, Porta.

Thank you for your comments and questions.

You are absolutly right! The design of the shape determines the purpose of the watercraft, in this sense it is understandable that you can´t build a final model with all the possibilities optimised. So, a snake model is only for records or to have fun on a sunny day with a lot of friends, it is interesting for competition only with other "snakes". I believe that after 10, 20 people it will become very difficult to control, it would need a great coordenation among people, it could be used as group exercise (group coordenation), it is fun but not fast. In the same way, this concept would be the best for slalon in whitewater, it could become really fast, with 2 to 4 or 5 people, it would become a new whitewater sport modality.
In a motorized model, the pivoted front is very interesting, because it increases the maneuverability if compared to other boats with same dimensions, the same goes for all motorized large boats. In these situations, this model (pivoted) is really good.
If the idea is a speed record, rigid structure will be necessary, and in this situation, a flat water is important, and the limitation will be the same of any other speed boat, a rowing boat for example needs flat water for a good performance.
A rectangular profile is not the most resistant, the most resistant shape is cilindrical. There are several reasons for that, but my English is not enough to explain this to you, I would have to explain it personally with the help of gestures. To facilitate your understanding, if rectangular or square profiles were the strongest, eggs would shape like dices because eggs perpetuate the species, so for sure they are made with the best design (the strongest, the most thermal insolated and the most resistant to all sorts of stress, be it flex, torsion or compression). Bones and animals' shapes work the same way. If someone in this forum has the knowledge and the English to explain this question, I would be grateful.
The question about the resistance of the boat is difficult to answer because there are a lot of factors that you would have to know. For the moment I would just ask you to have in mind that every vehicle made has endurance limits, these limits determine the purpose of the vehicle. For example, a mountain bike has a tougher structure than a speed bike.

I've been involved with kayaks for the last 30 years, and every year there are a couple of inventions that are going to revolutionise the kayak industry. By contrast, I, as most serious kayakers, use a kayak that has been hundreds of years in the evolution; everything about it has a purpose that has been developed over generations.
I think if you can get an investor, and produce them cheaply enough then they will sell; I like it, its quirky and I can see our guests playing with it down on the shore, but I am worried that investors will not take you seriously untill you identify exactly what your markets are, and it isn't everything to everyone.

Hi Patiras,

Thank you again! By the way, should I call you Patiras or Al?

This invention is not a kayak but it can be understood and work like one. My first concept was an emulation of a portable kayak. So I believe the basic idea and the initial market will focus on people wanting a portable boat/kayak, with a cheap price. In PET it can be sold around 50 to 100 dollars (if you change the size or/and the amount of beams or/and the design the prices change), or less! It is really atractive, transparent, has shining colors, it is easy to fix, you can mix the color of the modules, mix the color of the beams, you can make a mix of colors!!! It is absolutly light (around 10 pounds), made only of recycled plastic, and the connecting beam is made of PVC pipe, that can be easily found. It is possible to reduce the plastic bottle waste in 100% (theoretically).
So I think the biggest market will be of those that never paddled before and will have their first chance because it is a new idea, it is fashion, and even the people that like to paddle (but know how annoying is the transportation of a kayak), and want to paddle in their free time and "coffee break" (but think of how boring and time consuming this preparation is, because the kayak is home. And finally, those that don´t want to worry about anything, they only want enjoy their time doing some sports. These people won´t need a big car (you can put this "boat" on the passenger's seat), don´t need big space (you can take it to work). These would be the first market focus. The other basic focus would be on inflatable kayaks, but this would be made by another segment of enterprise(s).

Good work on the lathe!!

1/ Lose the flash intro. Splash pages like that will increase your bounce rate dramatically. People don't want to wait for that to load, or even for it to load enough for the skip link to operate. They want information. Give them the home page first and let them find movies if they want them later.

2/ I second what others have said about the need to identify your market. I looked through the "Models" page and I can tell you that the sliding seat rowing version will never be taken seriously by anyone interested in high performance (or even moderately high performance) recreational rowing craft. It's just not functional for that application.

Hi NoEyeDeer,

Thank you for your suggestions

1/ To connect to information first, please follow the link bellow.

http://members.libreopinion.com/br/v...cle/index2.htm

I put out the preloader of the flash intro to load the animation faster.
The reason for the initial animation is based on the following idea. Boats have existed for around 300,000 years, catamarans exist since 30,000 years (according to the archeologists opinions). Even though people connect floating shapes in parallel, why haven't they made it longwise? I am asking this, because it was a paradigma. The common sense is to develop what already exists, to break a paradigma you need change it.
The wheel is a fantastic solution, but it is not the only one. Continuous hull is a fantastic idea, but it is not the only one!!! Think about the helicopter, it is not a copy of the nature system, but it works really good.
The concept of the initial animation is based on the idea that I mentioned, it is supposed to be Christopher Columbus that is known, among other things, to have gotten a fresh egg to stand on end. It is the break of a paradigma.

2/ Not exactly, probably you think that there will be a big drag between the modules. This is not the case, because there are a lot of hulls' configurations that improve the water flux, I can´t explain more because these designs are patentable.
On the other hand, if you think the sliding seat shown in the site is a complex system, it isn't. This system is not what I have in mind, it is only to show the idea. What I have in mind is a rowing system absolutly different from what exists in the market (another patent).
To understand, I´ve been rowing for around 30 years, I always think about how troublesome the sliding seat system is. When I first started to row, it was common for the rower to have hard work adapting to himself the boat from a person of different size. It was expensive to fix, and if you broke any piece, and if you were far from the harbour, you were in big problem. So I started to think about this, and developed a new concept, simple, with less moving pieces, lighter and more resistant.
The patents have a deadline, and the strategy is to patent piece by piece, in order to stretch the time of the market domain. All the patents involved in this project are only in my mind, and they will come out in the right time, in the moment that I find an honest investor.
Believe me, what I imagine to emulate a sliding seat is really simple, fast to connect, resistent and light!!

[peter radclyffe]

ecological plastic, who are you kidding

[vapera]

ecological plastic, who are you kidding

Hi Peter,

Good point.

All plastics are degradable, the time of this degradation differs according to the polymers; the molecular stability of plastics is big but not absolut, also there are plastics that have a real short lifetime, there are no commercial use for them. The tests that establish the lifetime of plastics are simulations made in laboratories, it is not a real situation. PET have a very long lifetime, to recycle this plastic there are three methods: mechanical, chemical and thermal (thermoeletric plant, for example). In Brazil, the most common is the mechanical method, it consists in grinding the plastic into powder, which is then heated to melt so it can be molded again.
PET is a big problem in the world, for example, it is common, in the Northeast beaches of Brazil, to find a lot of PET recipients, specially from Europe. These recipients travel along the Atlantic stream that sent the Portuguese and Spanish conquerors to the Americas. Dumping PET just creates a big volume and trouble, the only solutions are to refurbish it or recycle it.
Other plastics are easier to degrade, for example the polypropylene of the supermarket bags takes around two years in the sun to become powder-like, it loses its polymers characteristics. If you give all plastic recipients, like the ice cream buckets for example, other uses, you can see how degradable some plastics are, and how resistant others are.
Most plastics (EPS - Styrofoam -, PET, PEAD, PP, etc.) can be brought back to their original stage to be reused.
So, as you can see, there are a lot of methods to solve the plastics problem in an ecological way.
In my opinion, the enterprises that use plastics in their products or pack them with plastic must take this way, buying their plastic again and recycling it, because they have a profit with these plastics, these plastics have no use to people, but people pay for it, and the enterprises have a social obligation to solve this problem.
And the best way in the case of PET, in my opinion, is to make a durable product with a long lasting use and service, which would also minimize the recycling costs, and a watercraft is an example.

[peter radclyffe]

what would you rather see
a plastic factory or
a tree

[vapera]

what would you rather see
a plastic factory or
a tree

Peter,

You are talking to me through a living tree trunk, using it as a drum, or through a machine of high technology, with a system of wires, and diverse plastics and metals network that to be made killed millions of trees, mountains, biomes, and continues to kill to feed itself through electricity?
What is better, a tree or a wooden boat made of hundreds of dead trees?
I'm here looking for solutions for the production of my invention, solutions for millions of bottles and recipients in landfills, solutions for millions of people that would like to enjoy playing in the water. In case these people decide to build their boats with the same material that you use, learning through your know-how, there will be no more trees in the world in less than one year!!
So, if a plastic factory avoids the death of some more millions of trees, I choose the plastic factory.
I would just like to remind you that to make a tool like a plunge router, a saw, a rasp file, a file (no matter if the tool is manual, electric or of any other kind) millions of trees are killed, because metals don't grow on trees, but trees grow where metals exist!!!
Not only that, a bike (do you know a more ecological vehicle?), a car, even the most ecological, to be built killed millions of trees, earth worms, rodents, insects and all the biome that was devastated so that the metals could be accessed. The amount of plastic in a car, in a house, in a bike is made by plastic factories and not by trees. All our system is destructive, what I'm looking for is to minimize the environmental impact through the reuse of a material that pollutes beaches, rivers, lands around the world.
Finally, I'm not here to argue about ecology, but to discuss about a new watercraft concept and all its social and economic ways.

[magwas]

Originally Posted by vapera

They patented that because the patentary system in Brazil is a bandit structure, and they are the biggest producer of sit-on-top and I am only an individual inventor.

...

If any enterprise produces my patent and if it is not interested in the Brazilian market, I could try to imported to Brazil. And it is important to understand that Brazil is one of the BRICs, and has a potencial market of around 200 million people and a real market of around 50 million people, it is the 5th population of the world.

Can you feel the hopelessness of your words below the dots in the view of those above it?
The patent system is a legalized crime used by big players to kill the small ones in any corner of the world.

[vapera]

Hi Magwas,

Yes, what you said makes a lot of sense. But I think that international enterprises have an opportunity with my patent, because the Brazilian market is closed to foreign investors. The reasons are obvious: have you seen Brazilian products around the world? Probably not (maybe shoes or fruits or who knows?). The reason is that the Brazilian industries are mediocre, they control the market with taxes and laws. For example, to import a car to Brazil you will have to pay 75% over the total price (which includes shipping, freight, port taxes, etc., that is, 75% over every cent paid in the importation chain), the system to establish this price is easy, tax over tax. So if enterprises want to sell their products here with a competitive price, they need to be established here, and according to the law a foreign enterprise needs a Brazilian partner to do this, and if this partner has a monopoly, even better, because this enterprise will have an initial advantage in the market.
So, I have a patent, and I believe there are a lot of enterprises that think it is a good idea to start in the Brazilian market, because it is huge and promising.
I also believe that my patent is very well defended and represents a good business, and I have reasons for that.
One of the reasons is the fact that, In Brazil, I've suffered a lot of sabotage from the industrial property's institute (INPI - which is in charge of patents matter!!!), from the justice, from the enterprises, and they couldn't extinguish my patent. The only thing they can do is virotic marketing trying to keep people from knowing about this crime. If, for instance, I post in Brazilian forums, some members start to put a lot of big pictures of others boats and/or begin nonsense talks, some of my posts are deleted, and these type of things.
Another reason refers to Bic plagiarism. This multinational didn't deposit the original patent (French) of the Yakka in the USA, there it only deposited a design patent (this might be the reason for the troublesome and strange inflatable ring around their kayak, it has no function). What would be the reason for that, even if I didn't deposit my patent in the USA? Maybe because it is known that a good lawyer in the USA could get interested in sueing this enterprise for plagiarism or criminal misrepresentation, specially having all the evidences in hand. It is curious that, in Canada, this enterprise deposited the same patent deposited in France. And worse, in the description of Bic's patent it is writen that its kayak parts can be connected by straps, bolts or even beams, and in the claims they state that its kayak is connected by straps. Yakka is connected with a beam, which can be clearly seen in its manual. The patent is not the same product of Yakka, it is something else!! They won awards with my patent, not with theirs!!!
More proves that my patent is a good business and the Brazilian market is very promising.
After I contacted Bic asking for the recognition of the authorship of the invention and offering the Brazilian market, the answer was only that the multinational had no interest for the Brazilian market. But before and after sending me the reply, Bic navigated through my site, where I mentioned how promising the Brazilian kayaks market is. A while after that, the enterprise bought a Brazilian labels' company which then besides selling the labels became in charge of selling Bic's kayaks (except the Yakka) in Brazil, according to Bic Sports site of that time until a short while ago. Now, Bic Sports site mentions its own Brazilian site as the dealer of its kayaks, but there are no kayaks offered as their products in this Brazilian website. It is important to mention that even though this multinational's kayaks are very expensive here (they are being sold for an average price of US$1400), they are infinitely better than any kayak made by the Brazilian enterprises.
It is also important to mention that, In Brazil, this multinational has been dominating the pens' market for more than 50 years, and is dominating the lighters market; and in the world, it is the largest sit-on-top producer. Curiously, only after my denounce, this multinational seemed to have understood the kayaks' market that exists here.
For the reasons above, I'm sure my patent is a good business and it is very well protected.
Magwas, you are right, but now you see why I have reasons to believe, to hope.
I'm sure any enterprise that joins me will control and dominate the market with unimaginable profits.