Minimum Passagemaker/Cruiser

[mydauphin]

So we all can't afford the perfect passagemaker. What is the minimum level of comfort that we can handle or feel safe in. At the end there will be a prize someone will get to design it...

[mydauphin]

To me depending on a mix of coastal crusing and island hopping. A 35 foot boat with a range of 400 miles. With one room AC, ac inverter, 4kw generator, hot water for shower, dry bunk. I believe a watermaker is essential since I don't trust the water in many places I go to. Also kind of need internet.

[yipster]

o yaeh, anaother boat design competition, ah well, who knows what comes of it

as thrue things were said elsewhere, it also gotta be a liveaboard and 99% a marinabird as well
so today needs grey and black water tanks, yek. i'll check your safety and luxory list above later mydauphin

did you boy's check my rough ladybird design ( in my gallery ) was thinking of minimising that a bit
make some new drawings of her, wont be the most minimal concept tho witch must be a bathtub or so

glad you opened this thread under boatdesign as i ddont think it has to be neccesarely as a motorboat
this boat can be sail, motor or motorsailor alrite? like to see and hear thoughts and samples

here a big water boat doc i dont want to post at the other tread anymore

[mydauphin]

Originally Posted by mydauphin

At the end there will be a prize someone will get to design it...

Clarification, this statement was a joke. I have no intention of building another boat - too poor for that now. I was being sarcastic as a lot of people come promising to build a boat trying to catch a unsuspecting designer or get free advice. I am trying to make a priority list of what is important in a passagemaker separating need from want.

Thanks yipster for your attachment I will read later.

Originally Posted by yipster

a big water boat doc i dont want to post at the other tread anymore

Thanks for keeping it here Yipster! It is so full of flaws, wrong conclusions and misinformation, it should not have been published.

Regards
Richard

[mydauphin]

What is wrong with it?

Originally Posted by mydauphin

What is wrong with it?

In short: All

The guy going from a 40ft boat to a 70ft, being disppointed with the sailing performance (pointing) and then comes his conclusion that "having all this accommodation" was wrong. idiotic......

The chapter on Beebe and Leishman (cheap adverts for Nordhavn) calling that pamphlet valid for Passagemakers. idiotic......

Beebe did create (or used) the word passagemaker for the first time, thats true. But the boats he referred to have never been ocean crossing vessels! These were just fast coastal cruisers. Same is valid for the Nordhavn range. They are NOT capable oceean cruisers as advertised. They are coastal cruisers with a long range.

And so on.
Amateurs drivelling along about stuff they don´t know.

[yipster]

Originally Posted by apex1

And so on.
Amateurs drivelling along about stuff they don´t know.

i take it you esspecially mean the big blue water sailing cats

Originally Posted by yipster

i take it you esspecially mean the big blue water sailing cats

No, of course not. I did say what I was referring to.

[yipster]

mydauphin:
"At the end there will be a prize someone will get to design it... Clarification, this statement was a joke"
as understood, nevertheless this poll also allready shows interesting results

apex1:
"No, of course not. I did say what I was referring to"
i'm not alway's that clear on you but than my excuses for the presumptionous reply

[MatthewDS]

Recently I started planning a trip that I really wanted to make upon retirement. I don't need to live extravagantly, so I felt that a 40-50 ft steel power yacht finished to fishing boat standards would suit me just fine. I started working up basic sketches of my boat, and was having a great time.

Until...

I worked out the distance between the closest two ports with available fuel, and realized that I would have to carry 5500 miles worth of fuel. This quickly put an end to my 40 footer.

My Point? Instead of asking if people can live without air conditioning, perhaps a better question would be what is the maximum length of passage that people feel a passagemaker should be designed for. Otherwise, we are kind of talking apples to oranges.

Originally Posted by MatthewDS

Until...

I worked out the distance between the closest two ports with available fuel, and realized that I would have to carry 5500 miles worth of fuel. This quickly put an end to my 40 footer.

My Point? Instead of asking if people can live without air conditioning, perhaps a better question would be what is the maximum length of passage that people feel a passagemaker should be designed for. Otherwise, we are kind of talking apples to oranges.

Believe me, the 20m ballpark I mentioned so often, is about the minimum size for a ocean crossing motoryacht. No matter AC in the loo or not.
Everything below is just not sensible.

[TeddyDiver]

Again, good reading http://www.kastenmarine.com/ideal_passagemaker.htm ...much like Richard says..

[WestVanHan]

Originally Posted by MatthewDS

what is the maximum length of passage

Curious about Richard's proposed boat....

Originally Posted by apex1

The first roughly calculated

The "Nort Sea Trawler" comes at:
22,5m Loa

Range at 8,1kn 6.500 nm with 15% reserve, incl. aux. systems, average sea conditions
Range at 9,1kn 5.500 nm with 15% reserve, incl. aux. systems, average sea conditions

....I quickly looked up a few nm ranges,these are straight shot runs: NO stopping for fuel,diversions for bad currents,avoiding lows:

Sydney to Los Angeles: 6500
Sydney to Honolulu:4400
Sydney to Hong Kong:5000
Honolulu to LA:2200.
LA to Panama:3200
NY to UK: 2800
Perth Aus to Capetown 4600
Capetown to Miami:4200
Vancouver to Japan: 4200


To make a straight run from Sydney to LA-@ 9.1 knots he wouldn't make it,and at 8.1 he'd be hoping there were no unfavourable currents or winds.

I guess that's why:

Originally Posted by apex1

...... talking passagemaker.....will from time to time bunker at sea, and you can imagine what that can mean.

So if you have 4500 nm and have 15% reserve,with maybe a stop to top off if needed,it should be more than enough to do the common runs.

[waynep]

It's really unfortunate that a boat design forum could be limited because the primary thought in the back of one's mind is "I don't want to give away free advice". This way of thinking makes a strong forum a weaker one. As for me, size smaller than 30 feet OK, so long as I can show it may be done safely. How can I begin the process of proving the design is viable? By researching the tons of great information available on boat design and boat building, and the great advice from others who have been there and done that.