Military recon powerboat concept

[kach22i]

Nice first post.

The US Navy back in the early1970's was promoting a 100 knot Navy, I guess that's why they used such thin sidewalls.

I did not know the KNM Skjold design was considered a 'fat sidehull' design....................answers an older part of our discussion.

BMcF, do you have any idea of the Skjold cost/price?

What were the prices of the VT EPS/ABS M10 and Griffon 8000 hovercraft as a comparision?

[BMcF]

Thanks for the prop. I've been a 'Jesus Boat' designer for over 20 years, involved in most all that have been built in that period..and far too many that were not built.

IIRC, the 47m Skjold cost about 73 million USD to build back in the late 90s. But that was entirely without combat systems of any kind..but with (a lot of) non-recurring engineering costs..etc. So..I have no idea what the cost of the 5 series vessels now being assembled might be, espeically when including the 'all-up cost' with all combat systems in place. Skjold herself has been chopped to pieces and rebuilt to incorporate all the engineering changes arising from her trials period; major ones include changing from Allison GT + Diesel propulsion to a 'COGAG' powerplant using PW ST18 and ST40 turbines in tandem power units.

VT's M10 hovercraft cost?..no idea. In fact, being SES designers and the suppliers of some of the specialized SES/ACV equipment 'only', we seldom have insight in to total project cost numbers. I can tell you that the Korean passenger 40m SES shown in my pic earlier cost about 12 million US to build.

To undo my hijack a wee bit..to answer the original question posed in this thread, there is keen interest in some US naval communities (SOCOM for example) in relatively small, very high-speed stealthy vessels. The problem is that the requirements and CONOPS for same seem to be impossible to develop such that acceptance by a critical mass of 'end-users' gets on board with any one concept.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by BMcF

CONOPS ............

I start getting excited when acronyms are used.........ONR, PEO, USSOCOM, the list goes on.

I'm sold, please start a tread on some of your work BMcF so you don't have to worry about hi-jacking a thread from a guy with just a couple of posts.

'Jesus Boat' ............walks on water?

[BMcF]

Acronyms can be challenging and 'fun'..we are working on a project for USN that is only 4 or 5 years along and its already on its fourth acronym..LCAC-H, SSSC, SSC, and now JMAC.

I've been spending most of my time reading back through a lot of the posts on here and probably should continue to do so (I found your own earlier post of a pic of 'Smyge' and the sad photos of an SES that was near and dear to my heart being raped in to a configuration with a large lifting body under instead.. )

My specialty is actually stabilization/ride control/ motion control or whatever terms suits yr fancy these days. SWATHs, SES, cats, monohulls and hydrofoils (sorry..no WIGS yet) I have not seen a lot on here about vessel motion control..perhaps I can rectify that.

[BMcF]

Originally Posted by kach22i

'Jesus Boat' ............walks on water?

LOL..you got it. Coined by an old friend (now deceased) who was one of the old guard at Bell back in the heady days of 100-knot SES's, 80-knot Jeff-B hovercraft, 2K-SESs... Good guess..

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by BMcF

Acronyms can be challenging and 'fun'..we are working on a project for USN that is only 4 or 5 years along and its already on its fourth acronym..LCAC-H, SSSC, SSC, and now JMAC.
.

CDI right?

http://www.cdi-gs.com/index.shtm

You can PM me, I can't PM you as you have it disabled.

I like the low profile thruster, better than the one in my sketchbook.

[BMcF]

No..but good guess! I'm with Island Engineering (www.islandengineering.com) and , before that, Maritime Dynamics. CDI (or that particular part of CDI which I still call Band-Lavis, or BLA, since I'm old ) is populated by quite a few long-time friends/colleagues and we do collaborate on some projects. In fact, we were both involved in the Norwegian MCMV SES program too.

[BMcF]

Originally Posted by kach22i

.

I like the low profile thruster, better than the one in my sketchbook.

Finnish Fontier Guard ACV..first ACV with stealth requirements, hence the cute low-profile thruster. Only one was built and by my friends in southern Norway who built - and are now building more of - the Skjold and the MCMVs.

This thread is hopelessly hijacked..I apologize in advance for bad forum manners. I'll go start my own somewhere.

[RANCHI OTTO]

No problem BMcF...very interesting (for me...)!

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by BMcF

This thread is hopelessly hijacked..I apologize in advance for bad forum manners. I'll go start my own somewhere.

I'm sure the boat guys would enjoy a thread on the MM56CX, that cool tri-hull.

As seen here:
http://www.islandengineering.com/
(click NEWS)

And seen in this Gallery:
http://www.boatdesign.net/gallery/sh...0/ppuser/13291




I like anything which may be termed a "Jesus Boat".

[BMcF]

LOL..I see my partner has posted a few of our pics here already (that's me flying the foil-tri in those pics ). Good on 'im..he's within stone-throwing distance of where I sit here and type. He told me about this forum some time ago. I guess I'm not just old..I'm slow too.

First thing I should do is search his posts and see what he's already bored everyone with...

[RANCHI OTTO]

Nice...beautiful...interesting.....huge...etc.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by RANCHI OTTO

Nice...beautiful...interesting.....huge...etc.

I think it's the testing scale model for a much larger project.

[brian eiland]

Originally Posted by BMcF

Thanks for the prop. I've been a 'Jesus Boat' designer for over 20 years, involved in most all that have been built in that period..and far too many that were not built.

I've talked briefly with one of your working mates Rick Loheed about a RIB project I had in mind.

But, what I'm interested in here is hearing your comments on this 'ridiculous' design and waste of money in my opinion:
M-Hull, M hull, M Ship
http://boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=5687

(probably best to add them to that other threaded discussion)

(BTW I live right up in DC now, but spent quite a number of years in the boat business down there in Annapolis)

[BMcF]

Originally Posted by kach22i

I think it's the testing scale model for a much larger project.

The tri-foiler was indeed a 1/4-scale model of a 56m high-speed ferry. The performance results were rather remarkable in the areas of seakeeping (the human factors/habitability/comfort part of seakeeping) and speed v. powering results. A 26m pax-only proptoype is *trying* to get built in Norway at this time..subject to the vagaries of government funding/support for the project.

Still have the test craft..on the hard awaiting her fate. We will either repower with a single diesel and twin IO drives (replacing the gasoline 460 and twin waterjets) or render her to beer cans. The flight control system and foils are still intact and in good shape and the hull is still perfectly sound..hate to break her up but that is usually the fate of all 'models'.