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  #61  
Old 12-11-2016, 02:57 AM
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Unik Unik is offline
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Originally Posted by TANSL View Post
Kerosene, I do not pretend to be negative on this occasion, on the contrary, what I want to do is warn Unik about certain aspects that, apparently, he has not taken into account. When he launches his product to the market, after investing hundreds of hours and resources, and realizes that for a few papers he can not market it, he will feel very frustrated. I intend to save him many sufferings and a lot of money.
If in Spain, for example, there is no market for boats constructed by amateurs, it is not because the Spaniards do not love the sea, but because of the number of obstacles that the administration imposes on the amateur construction of boats.
I have designed boats that are sold, at this moment, as kits in the USA, but I have not even tried it in my country.
CE mark is not only about the materials to be used but also deals with absolutely all aspects to be taken into account in the project, stability, safety, equipment and construction of the boats. See attached the list of ISO standards to be met. (The CE mark requires compliance with all these standards)
Believe me, this time, too, I intend to help.

As I mentioned earlier, all the boats that I design made strictly in accordance with the rules and standards, regardless of whether to certificate or not. In this case, the EC Directive contains a list of norms and standards which are ISO normalized indicators of stability, strength, security, fire safety, flooding and other things. when designing yachts I strictly adhere to these standards.
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  #62  
Old 12-11-2016, 03:12 AM
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Here are some excerpts from DIRECTIVE 2013/53/EU full text can be found on the EC website.

https://ec.europa.eu/growth/single-m...ional-craft_en
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Lion 800 new  plywood yacht-4.jpg  Lion 800 new  plywood yacht-3.jpg  Lion 800 new  plywood yacht-2.jpg  

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  #63  
Old 12-11-2016, 04:08 AM
TANSL TANSL is offline
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Unik, that's a part of what I wanted to know and I'm glad to see that you know what to do. I want to point out that the DIRECTIVE speaks of "watercraft bult for own use", which is not your case, as you contemplate selling boats to other users. These users are likely, as it happens in my country, to have great difficulties for the administration to allow them to assemble your kits. In my country there is the possibility that one builds his own boat, of course, but the requirements demanded by the administration to the amateur builder get very few to risk that adventure.
What I am not clear is what and how you, as designer and seller of the kits, must guarantee in terms of project quality, materials, stability, etc... of the kit that you sell and, therefore, what documentation you must contribute with your kit to demonstrate that all that is fulfilled.
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  #64  
Old 12-11-2016, 04:48 AM
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There are two options, the first kit set and build boats for their own needs, this boat does not fall under the scope of the Directive because a person buys the kit is cut from plywood pieces and builds a boat. The second option, a person buys the finished yacht Lion 800 is built in the yard - it is covered by the scope of the Directive and the buyer gets a boat certified in accordance with all requirements.
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  #65  
Old 12-11-2016, 05:49 AM
TANSL TANSL is offline
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Yes, indeed, there are two options, make one your own boat or buy it from a professional manufacturer.
The problem is that the amateur builder needs to present certain information to let him register the boat and sail with it. It is necessary not only to have a project signed by a professional of recognized prestige, but to demonstrate some skills and minimum facilities to be able to construct the boat correctly. The latter is a problem that must be solved by the amateur builder but the part that should be provided by you, the project signed by an authorized professional, we do not know if it exists.
I do not say that this is necessary in all the countries of the world but in some of them.
I do not need to know the project, I just want, I repeat, to avoid you any unpleasant surprise when it comes to marketing your boats in some countries of the European Union. (Which is not the same as Europe).
I think I can no longer contribute anything useful to this debate. Good luck with your project.
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  #66  
Old 12-11-2016, 06:14 AM
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Thank you for your questions, they were very helpful
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  #67  
Old 12-14-2016, 01:10 AM
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Unik, I wish you every success. I also commend you for the way you've handled all the questions, thus far.
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  #68  
Old 12-14-2016, 03:40 AM
The Q The Q is offline
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I don't know about the other countries in europe, but in the UK, outside of a few restricted waters, there is no requirement to register a boat of that size. Also in the restricted waters I now sail in, there would be no problem registering the boat.

Even most of our insurance companies that deal in boats, are used to home builds and there would be no problem getting one insured.

I sailed a home build for 20 years plus, with no problems and I didn't build it ..

Good luck with the project, I like the look of her..
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  #69  
Old 12-14-2016, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by The Q View Post
....
Even most of our insurance companies that deal in boats, are used to home builds and there would be no problem getting one insured.....
Its the insurance and re-sale aspect that makes it advisable to be built to eu standards. eg.

Q. Will I need to obtain a survey for my boat?

A. Most insurance companies will require a survey for any boat aged 20 years old or more, and then again, every five years or so. Some yachts may require a survey earlier than this if they have sustained serious damage, if they are wooden, or if they have been self-built.

Q. Why do I need third party cover?

A. 2,000,000 Third Party Liability is usually compulsory if you are to sail in the UK and you should always consider liability insurance before sailing. A policy providing third party liability should cover you if you were to cause damage to property or injury to another person, with your yacht.

The industry standard provides a limit of 2,000,000 and should be sufficient to sail in the UK. Marine Law limits the maximum payable on navigable waters.

http://www.noblemarine.co.uk/yachtinsuranceguide.php3
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  #70  
Old 12-15-2016, 02:33 AM
The Q The Q is offline
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You believe the blurb on insurance sites? Insurance companies will always try to claim you need their products....

Insurance is Not required to sail in the UK, Unless:
You are carrying paying passengers,
You are in legally restricted waters, such as the Norfolk broads.
You are racing and all racing authorities require insurance.
You use a marina / port that requires insurance.
You are sensible and don't wish to risk the costs of losing your boat, hitting someone else boat and causing injury or loss.

I've never had a problem getting a non EU standard built boat insured. The majority of boats in the UK were built before the EU standards insituted.
Noble marine and all the other insurance groups must have thousands of home built boats / one offs on their books.
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  #71  
Old 12-15-2016, 02:58 AM
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oops double post
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  #72  
Old 12-15-2016, 07:26 AM
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You quote some compelling reasons FOR insuring a boat better the the insurance companies. Of course spending $30k to build and outfit a yacht, and not insuring it would be an additional level of crazy. And finally, when you come to sell a boat having it certified and insured is a big plus.
I don't mind minimalist approach to boat ownership in special cases, but being unable to pull in at marinas, liability for injuring other people and boats, and of course lack of recompense for loss of your own boat just too much of neck pain to endure.
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  #73  
Old 12-21-2016, 10:25 AM
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We continue to work on lion 550, all the ideas that we planned to use this project was carried out, the boat will be assembled from CNC cut parts in the joints and the grooves of the Stitch and Glue method.

http://unikyachts.com/en/lion-550-adrenaline-2/
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  #74  
Old 12-22-2016, 04:38 AM
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Disassembled the Adrenaline looks like this

http://unikyachts.com/en/lion-550-adrenaline-2/
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  #75  
Old 12-22-2016, 05:57 AM
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This looks very nice. How many sheets of plywood are needed to fit the whole structure? What thickness?
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