Kayak sailing

[Stoffeltoo]

Hi

I am a nooby to the forum and a 5 star novice at sailing
I sailed the Vaal dam Round the island race in feb 2011 with a Fluid Bamba kayak fitted with a non furlable leg o' mutton sail and a small rudder.
Sadly I did not complete the race in the allotted time due to severe weather helm as I suspect my leeboards were on the wee side and not able to provide sufficient lateral resistance.
My GPS indicated that I covered 38 kilometers over the 8 hours of which I sailed around the island. I had the added benefit of paddles which assisted in the light wind conditions and even managed to outsail/paddle a mirror in these conditions. The headwind in the latter part of the day made it unpleasant and challenging to maintain a safe course and I had to concede defeat to the race marshalls and take a tow.

I have a 8foot 50mm fibre mast and want to make a balanced lug with two reefs for safety purposes. I need some help with a sail plan and a calculation to determine the leeboard size and length for sufficient lateral resistance

I want to try sailing the bamba again in 2013 RTIR but this year is reserved for my recently built PDRacer

[LP]

I believe Michael Storer (Boatmik) has plans for a drop in sail rig. If I remember correctly, it is a balance lug rig and combines a "board" with the rig.

========================

Found the link.....

http://www.storerboatplans.com/Canoebits/KayakRig.html

[hoytedow]

Welcome to the forum, S2.

[Collin]

A rule of thumb is 5% of sail area as lateral resistance (that's on the PDR site if I remember right.)

I'd make sure to design a leeboard system that made it so you didn't have to haul it up for each tack. I've made a kayak sail before and that gets old fast....and you get really wet, too.

Do some research on the Bufflehead



The sail seems way too complicated, but you could use that design to help figure out what size sail you're looking for.

[Tiny Turnip]

If you haven't come across Solway Dory, have a look at their website. They've a range of rigs, leeboards, rudders. Some of their rigs furl very easily by rolling around the mast.
They're very approachable too.

http://www.solwaydory.co.uk/

[spidennis]

There's a few companies that build sailing kits for canoes and kayaks:

http://www.baloghsaildesigns.com/

http://www.flatearthkayaksails.com/

There's also plenty of blogs out there about doing just this type of boating.
http://gnarlydognews.blogspot.com/

Watertribe races have been doing quite a lot of this btw
http://watertribe.org/forums/

I can understand the desire to diy your gear, but using info like I posted might provide some insight to new ideas and techniques.

good luck and post your results, please!

[ancient kayaker]

The rig in the Michael Storer page seems about the right size for a kayak, although it seems a bit small for canoes which are usually a bit beamier. If you want a bit more performance and better upwind capability you could scale it up to suit your mast, that would give you around twice the area. That might be unmanageable in some kayaks, but a typical sit-on-top kayak has reasonable stability and allows you to hike out.

In my own experiments with sailng a kayak I used a Bruce Foil, which canceled the heeling moment of the sail. It wasn't very efficient because the foil was only plywood and the sail was only 15 sq ft, also the backwind from the sail hit my body when trying to sail close to the wind, but it worked well on all other points of sail. With the SOT kayak you can get out of the backwind, which my snug-fitting cockpit did not permit.

[HJS]

Canoe Helsa 1882 by Carl Smith

http://sassdesign.net/Helsa.pdf

js

[upchurchmr]

http://www.clcboats.com/shop/boats/w...iling-rig.html

This will not suit the purist / old boat lover.

I want one. Really, I want something like it that is more sailing oriented.

Marc

[spidennis]

Originally Posted by upchurchmr

http://www.clcboats.com/shop/boats/w...iling-rig.html

This will not suit the purist / old boat lover.

I want one. Really, I want something like it that is more sailing oriented.

Marc

marc, you want something MORE sailing oriented? have you seen the Kruger and http://www.baloghsaildesigns.com/

and just what does a "purist" want? a strip built canoe or kayak? Lapstrake? cotton packing leaky hull? Today's wooden boats are fiberglass coated so that will not fit the "purist" views?

[upchurchmr]

Spidennis,

A Hobie 16 has about 195 Sq Ft of sail. The max I saw on the Balogh site was 32 Sq Ft.

I want more sail for a faster ride.

Balough makes a nice rig and floats for converting a kayak to a sailboat.

The increased sail would require more ama and aka to support the bigger sail.

I want something about the same length as the Hobie which is competitive to a beach cat.

Different strokes, etc, but I am not criticizing others choices, I just want something different.

Marc

[Stoffeltoo]

I am thankfull for the comments

I attach a sketch of my idea for converting a poly prop kayak to a tacking proa. I have shelved the idea of a balanced lug for now and opted for a windsurfer sail with a strengthened mast instead.

The sketch is not quite to scale but as an indication to what was needed and maintaining enough space for a single hand crew



The plastic kayak has some nifty little features such as moulded nuts into the plastic for a transom/rudder assembly. It has a removable forward hatch and has several moulded nuts in the structure for attaching anchor trolleys etc.

I am not always keen to drill holes in a perfectly good plastic yak, but for the purpose of this experiment, it is high on the list of considerations.
The aka's will be lashed to deck mounts fitted to the top of the deck and bolted through the plastic into sub deck blocks to spread the load

Comments on improvement are appreciated

[spidennis]

Originally Posted by upchurchmr

Spidennis,

A Hobie 16 has about 195 Sq Ft of sail. The max I saw on the Balogh site was 32 Sq Ft.

I want more sail for a faster ride.

Balough makes a nice rig and floats for converting a kayak to a sailboat.

The increased sail would require more ama and aka to support the bigger sail.

I want something about the same length as the Hobie which is competitive to a beach cat.

Different strokes, etc, but I am not criticizing others choices, I just want something different.

Marc

marc,
so you want a kayak to sail as fast as a hobie 16? Interesting. Or do you want a sailboat that you can paddle? A paddle craft and sailboat are different animals but there are those that want to blur the line.

I'm interested in the WaterTribe Challenges and lots of entries are a hybrid between a kayak and a trimaran. some have even rafted two krugers together. Search youtube and you'll see some interesting craft.

While I'm mostly a paddler, my design at this is starting with a sailing craft . I have a thread about it here. You might find something in there to inspire you? btw, I am not entered in the 2012 UFC, but maybe the next one?

[spidennis]

Originally Posted by Stoffeltoo

I am thankfull for the comments

I attach a sketch of my idea for converting a poly prop kayak to a tacking proa. I have shelved the idea of a balanced lug for now and opted for a windsurfer sail with a strengthened mast instead.

The sketch is not quite to scale but as an indication to what was needed and maintaining enough space for a single hand crew



The plastic kayak has some nifty little features such as moulded nuts into the plastic for a transom/rudder assembly. It has a removable forward hatch and has several moulded nuts in the structure for attaching anchor trolleys etc.

I am not always keen to drill holes in a perfectly good plastic yak, but for the purpose of this experiment, it is high on the list of considerations.
The aka's will be lashed to deck mounts fitted to the top of the deck and bolted through the plastic into sub deck blocks to spread the load

Comments on improvement are appreciated

sorry, I couldn't read the attachment but ...
have you seen expandcraft ?
It might be a quick and easy way to put together a proa.

[upchurchmr]

spidennis,

I want a trimaran primarily to sail. It might be the most reasonable approach to start with a kayak and a SailRig (clcboats.com) but I doubt I would ever do a straight build of the SailRig. I'm as much of a know it all as everyone else here.

What did you end up with for the Florida Ultimate race? I'm not familiar with the Ultimate race, do people just park their boat and ride or walk the 40 miles?

Marc

Originally Posted by spidennis

marc,
so you want a kayak to sail as fast as a hobie 16? Interesting. Or do you want a sailboat that you can paddle? A paddle craft and sailboat are different animals but there are those that want to blur the line.

I'm interested in the WaterTribe Challenges and lots of entries are a hybrid between a kayak and a trimaran. some have even rafted two krugers together. Search youtube and you'll see some interesting craft.

While I'm mostly a paddler, my design at this is starting with a sailing craft . I have a thread about it here. You might find something in there to inspire you? btw, I am not entered in the 2012 UFC, but maybe the next one?