A junk in the making? Can I make a 65ft circumnavigate vessel?

[Wellydeckhand]

Hi,

Yup, the more I read into the old thread with great post by the amount of people who love boat design, I began to realised how much I lack understand about the boat building industry.......after alots of month reading and communication, with boat builder and shipwright, I began to enlighten and had a need. That why, I deciede to make my own first boat from a designer and real NA. It is not expensive compare to my sanity.

This thread reveal not a spur of hot air, but a calculated mean of redesign Bruce Roberts Trader 65 ft to fit my junk need. I would want to outfit it for circumnavigate but rather I think I would private charter it until I am near even before venture sailing and cruising from inter island Indonesia and later to the world.

I have bought study plan of the Trader 65 and would want to explore the possibility before I buy the full plan and start my Max. 3 years hammering of my wallet and other resources.

I have a rendering guy coming to work for me but still in Surabaya. He did not get any spec from me, except the weblink of Bruce Robert and the model. He would do a detail rendering of the Trader 65 later from the study plan with my modification. Cosmetic only.

If anybody, have owned a Trader 65 or have any idea what I need to include in this boat, pls dont hesitate to contribute your ideas into my boat as a friend.

I am a beginer and I hope to start from here.

Wellydeckhand

P.S. the ugly pink is my initial upgrade the look and simple deck appearance compare to the green original picture.

[Guillermo]

Hi, Welly!
65' are big words...! And even with a cargo space!
What (and where) are you going to trade?
All of my best wishes to you in this project.

[Tad]

Welly,

Three masted junk rig? Absolutely!

I would eliminate the central external keel, cut the tip off the vee bottom and create a wide flat center section. Build it of 3" plate so it also becomes part of the ballast. Then have one or two centerboards or lifting (ballasted) keels. This will allow loading and unloading in areas that normal freight vessels can't get to.

Forget yachts and think commercial vessel, and you can do it.

Tad

[Wellydeckhand]

I am not really trading, it is the name of the design by Bruce, I think there are so far 200 this model floating around. I choose 65 ft for not-so-cramp situation, more spacious interior taste and equipment placement, more guest for dinner, able to bring better kitchen nessecity and stock FOOD,WATER and FUEL........ of course bigger engine.

[Wellydeckhand]

Gentlemen, This is a Bruce Robert design, the cargo space maybe for drug-runner or die-hard fisherman. I have already 7 wooden 70-90ton cargo vessel, so now I am looking for sail.

This is an early stage for my modification, just see how this thing goes, it will be interesting.

The junk is a cargo carrier of gift and goods in the olden days, so that is a good feature to incorperate within the design. The cargo space also help if you do alot of big furniture shopping abroad.

All ideas contributed will be seriously consider for the final making of the vessel , Thank you.


Wellydeckhand

[Poida]

Wally

Another great use for this fine vessel would be bringing illegal immigrants into Australia.

If you get caught they do confiscate your boat, so don't throw your plans away.
Poida

[Wellydeckhand]

I would not try to carry too much people. Sanitary problem would kill the boat. But ventilation would be a good thing to remember, air-condition in 2 main room with 1/2 Pk cheap split compressor would greatly incease the comfort, cockpit aircon? would that be a priority?

I would try to make the deck water tight to prevent big wave flooding the hull. The cockpit will be old styled with wiper.......

http://www.beurteaux.com/english/catalogue.html capt seat?
http://www.wynn.co.uk/ wipers

- The facilities is able to hold diving compressor with decompression chamber for 2 person.

compressor
http://www.lw.com.sg/ Singapore diving compressor--- NICE
http://www.yandina.com/hints.htm#Compressor try only if on budget

decompression chamber
http://www.sub-find.com/chambers.htm
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/193...Fencoding=UTF8
It seem I can make my own decompression chamber...... I have gas expert in pressurizing... I can use a expired VGL liquid stainless steel for the chamber. Doable.


- On board 2 RIB boat , one small for 4 person and another for 7 person. Emergency liferaft in barrel form is a must.

The RIB gonna buy with real cash while I can have the white barrel inflated liferaft thing for second, just change the gas...........

- A small cold storage to hold fishing catch.

You wont believe how easy to built your own fish box with a compressor....... this is just like a micro gas plant.( not that cold anyway)

- A hi-PSI pump for rescue fire or pirate chaser.

Must be reconditioned item from a non-working ship. wonder if the same size?

- Satellite mobile BLUESKY later will upgrade to NERA satphone for the world.

I have a NERA like a fax machine protable ( from mydad), the speed of the ship might effect the GPS..... maybe marine option upgrade?

- Office Facilities on -board with fax, PC printer and other needed stuff, is internet possible?

All equipment are ok but internet might be expensive
http://www.mackaycomm.com/ppf/pid/421/product.asp
This is cheaper: http://www.francesatellite.com/world...sat/3064a.html
http://shop.infosat.com/Merchant2/me...ode=msatmarine

- Intercom to all public area and rooms even storage ( storage can be double use for mutiny member of the passanger)

http://www.soros.org/initiatives/jus...bigprisons.pdf
Just remember good ventilation but small size hole with grill, maybe just enough for small kids to cramp through. Most detainee are adult.

- Radar panel, Depth Sonar and night-vision camera, GPS with touchscreen and normal extra GPS for emergency. Any other equipment?

Normal Standard equipment
http://www.garmin.com/pressroom/marine/111405a.html depth & fish sonar
http://www.garmin.com/products/gmr41/ Radar
http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap398/ Chart plotter
http://www.garmin.com/products/gpsmap3210/
http://www.garmin.com/products/gdl30/ weather data
http://www.garmin.com/products/gsd20/ powerful sonar
http://www.garmin.com/products/gms10/ connection port for multi-device

ERR....... Medium to serious equipment
http://www.tmq.com.au/ full aussie tech
http://www.oceantalk.com.au/ Raymarine
http://www.amisales.com.au/

http://www.simrad.com/

Serious Hard-core equipment
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ted/index.html Bridge system
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Gryo Compass
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Satillite Compass
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Multi-display
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Repeater Compass
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Digital repeater compass
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Big Chartfinder
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Black box
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Ship identifying system
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html GPS and Beacon Receiver (DGPS)
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ion/index.html Echo Sounder
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...dar/index.html radar 3 model
http://www.raytheonmarine.de/highsea...ons/index.html communication extreme

Steering equipment My choice
http://www.kobelt.com/products.html full engine steering option


- All stainless steel kitchen with pattern flooring.

: a good example of a stainless kitchen is that of the Shadow Paladin. Someone suggest of outfit the kitchen in Australia, they make stainless steel kitchen cabin by mass production, meaning cheaper. Or try Tangerang ,Indonesia.

- Three bathroom ( 1 master and other public shower)

http://www.raritaneng.com/products/toilets/index.html

: STD nothing funny, fiberglass might be suitable....... enduring of water and would need to change ever 10year anyway.

or make toilet with double leak prevention........ design the toilet would be fun....... rust proof material and cheap.

smell of bad water +rusty steel + old paint = seasick for me.

- for bathing and cooking will be freshwater other will be seawater.

A reasonable good option for saving water.

- A water making machine ( those take moisture from the air we breath)

http://www.airwatercorp.com/detail.aspx?ProductId=6
This baby can produce 220 L of water daily, it can run on solar panel energy, almost free water. ( Thus can build a smaller water cache and save on space)

- Small 2 tank water filteration, just in case........

locally bought YAMAHA filter small bin will do

- marine radio and a extra 2 meter radio for communication with local on land.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/marine/fctsht14.html

I got too many of these thing......... just need to find the right marine antenna...... very salty environment.

- Hi-beam 3 million lux (candle light power) beamcannon and 2 X 500,000 lux seperated portable search light.

Remote external searchlight control option
http://www.colorlight.com/
You can buy protable million lux search light from ACE hardware. I can do lighting locally. It is the marine electric installation that bug me.

- manual kerosen X3 lantern for fuel saving lighting and night fishing of squid.

http://www.get2buynow.com/home-furni..._Kerosene.html
Chinese made kerosen lamp with pressure. Indonesian call it Stronkeng..... can find it everywhere.

- Cheap washing machine ( nothing electric should be expensive cause the salt will get them sooner or later)

Buy the lift the lid model........ save space and humble free operation. Buy reputable discount item.....

- Shinco Flat LCD TV 36' and sound system..... I will design my combo.

http://www.glodokshop.com/detail_kat...36ee5f02d4bf37
The flat wall TV will save spaces and give enjoyable sense of technology, Plasma or LCD your choice. My power system is hand build custom........ not very much for the whole ship to sing....... will be connected for external music and hailing.


http://www.yandina.com/acrobats/SatInstallData.pdf

- 8 monintoring camera will be installed into area, manual deactivation possible for privacy. The whole ship can be visually check for security. Motion detector also applied for security reason.

Small camera on conner, cheap black & White will do....... for security only. Monintor should use small flatscreen monintor, cheap anyway.

- All upper deck entrance will be steel and water-tight with hydraulic release manually. Window at the hull will be smash proof and extra brass covered when needed.

http://www.maxwellmarine.com/about_u...php?news_id=19
http://www.thomasnet.com/products/ma...7211208-1.html
http://www.kellysearch.com/us-wa-product-170.html
http://www.freemanmarine.com/Hatches3400Series.htm
http://www.yandina.com/acrobats/HatchData.pdf

- Solar panel will be installed in almost all non walking of the surface for recharge, small windmill will have extra charging power.

http://www.siliconsolar.com/flexible-solar-panels.php
Flexible solar panel is better but expensive........ the wind mill can be build form a broken old fan.

- Battery and charger Always use dry battery for low maintaince

Optima CCA 1200 ( how many you need?) I have these in my car
http://www.1st-optima-batteries.com/
Catapiller CCA dry big black thing from dozer n exchavator work the same but cheaper.

http://www.mastervolt.com/ charge solution

- a good lighting rod is essential also..... plus ground.

Lightning protection
http://www.yandina.com/acrobats/GalvOwnManual.pdf capacitor
http://www.yandina.com/acrobats/GalvOwnManual.pdf isolator

- Emergency lighting with red light for powercut and silent journey from chaser.( downlight) low light signature


- good lamp and lighting for those happy parties on board, prefer marine installation lighting with modification.

http://www.environmentalinteriors.co..._datasheet.pdf

- a good siren is vital, also not forgetting signal flag and flag of all nation.

Make your own horn by using an expire big propane gas cyclinder, put valve control and connect to your horn X3 and better SPL quality
http://www.yandina.com/hints.htm#Flag

- sorry stainless cup on-board, try to make everything smash proof.

best Thai Stainless steel equipment.... not expensive
http://www.zebra-head.com/catalog/2005.html
http://www.zebra-head.com/en/profile/profile2.html

- small welding machine and other equipment.

http://www.millerwelds.com/ Any 2nd hand cheap small welding machine will do but check out miller


- bed will be king-coil with anti-back problem.

Eliminate vibration, help seasick, cure sleeping problem at sea. Buy the cheapest model of kingcoil and ask for discount or wait for big fat promotion.
http://www.kingkoil-indonesia.com/index1.html

- Re-check on vibration on the vessel, use vibration free bolt and nuts(rubber laced) and acoustic barieer....... double the engine air need for better life engine, find best option for cooling........ I love engine maintaince.

http://www.polyflex.com.au/ I will need these

http://www.bart.gov/docs/STD_SPEC/203013.pdf for vibration control basic
http://www.buildingdesign.co.uk/arch...nd-control.htm

- Entrapment flooring for night sleep against burglar.

Classified information for private use...... no can disclosed

- A wicked self-made sharp blade, curve for tight spaces and one for open deck spaces. I am a traditional swordsmith.

Too much violent if posted....... you might want one
http://www.angelsword.com/Resources/...rai_swords.php
http://edtech.suhsd.k12.ca.us/inprog...o_samurai.html
http://www.forgefair.org/FIERF/pdf/JapaneseSword.pdf

- bring 2 bugis guys that is good a fighting and sailing..... loyal bunch they are

The one with golden tooth and big mustash........ and killer sense and a patch over the eye......

- a small medical assortment of equipment for emergency and all safety fire precaution like fire mat, fire exstinguisher and fire smoke alert will be installed and checked bi-annually.

http://www.yandina.com/hints.htm#NoFire
http://www.boatwashington.org/carbon_monoxide.htm Real Danger on board with gas
http://www.landfallnavigation.com/carbonmonoxide.html Monoxide detector

-Anchor installation and winch

http://www.muir.com.au/ nice aussie stuff
http://www.maxwellmarine.com/

http://www.yandina.com/anchAlrm.htm
http://www.yandina.com/AnchChain.htm
http://www.yandina.com/hints.htm#Anchor

-Bilge pump circut

http://www.yandina.com/graphics/BilgePumpCircuit.gif
http://www.yandina.com/hints.htm#BilgeAlarm
http://www.yandina.com/hints.htm#Pump

AS a backup think about installing a second bilge pump , and switch , higher than the normal unit.
Hook the second pump to an alarm bell too , so you will know when the first has failed.
Belt & suspenders , if you don't like a wet bunk!

- Water crossbow for scuba fishing........... you know right...........

Research on Water Spike http://forums.deeperblue.net/archive...p/t-59969.html
real stuff becareful http://www.spearfishingextreme.com/i..._railgun_2.jpg
Advance Stuff http://rocknfish.com/Rollergun.html
Patent water destruction http://freepatentsonline.com/4742775.html
Learn the correctway to spear a fish mmm.... http://www.spearfishingextreme.com/

http://www.restech.no/

- Bring an ugly woman, for safty reason............ you believed?

Mke u think twice http://www.obesityhelp.com/morbidobe...?N=B1136592409
http://images.google.co.id/imgres?im...&ct=image&cd=1


So ...... what did I missed?



Wellydeckhand

P.S. Misc teak deck maintaince http://www.yandina.com/TeakDeck.htm
Tracker for boat too????? http://mastergpstracker.com/

[Wellydeckhand]

The hull will have optional emergency installable double outboard for fast race out of bad weather horizon. bside the main engine of course. I think........ maybe possible

- Waste containment with special design to prevent the unpleasent to reappear during strong gale storm.

- Good waste pump to transfer.

WDH

[Wellydeckhand]

Can we really put stuff at the ballast area? look at picture

[safewalrus]

Done your homework on this welly me lad! Doubt if you'll have much problem!

go for it mate!

[SamSam]

Originally Posted by Poida

Wally

Another great use for this fine vessel would be bringing illegal immigrants into Australia.

If you get caught they do confiscate your boat, so don't throw your plans away.
Poida

All he has to do is claim he is a pleasure boater and he always travels with a crew of 50 or 60. Sam

[Guillermo]

Originally Posted by Wellydeckhand

So ...... what did I missed?

What about engine propulsion system and auxiliaries?
Also...A workbench?

[Wellydeckhand]

Bruce Roberts Yacht Design
Offices: USA - The Netherlands - Ireland - Australia
Telephone Bruce Mobile / Cell Phone + 34 649 649 542
www.bruceroberts.com design-office@bruceroberts.com

Trader65

-This is an old design, will I get the upgrade version, what is the difference?
ANSWER:
We can do an upgraded design based on the Voyager 650 special hull ... see photos of hull at bottom of this page .... If you go this route than we can only supply as KIT http://www.bruceroberts.com/public/HTML/V655.htm SPEED 10 KNOTS

See http://www.bruceroberts.com/public/H...ffers-kits.htm SAME PRICE AS VOYAGER 655

-This hull of Trader65 can reach speed of how many knot? Sail and engine?
ANSWER:
Regular plans and patterns as is now ... speed under sail and engine ... 8 knots

-How much load can I bring along the trip in this boat?
ANSWER:
Say about 7 tons ... what do you have in mind ?

-Steel or copper nickel or Corten would be the best material? If steel how I can extent the life of the metal ship ? I am expert of hydro and sand blasting and can do welding.
ANSWER:
STEEL ... forget the rest !

-I intent the ship to be STD looking outside but stainless steel wrap inside with leather skin all on the sofa and place. What you think?
ANSWER:
Sounds OK for inside.

-What is the efficient engine range I can install as I might do some cruising with the engine and escape from storm.
ANSWER:
At least 2,000 miles

-will the sail have design on hydraulic and pnematic props? Bruce , yolu said 2 sail design included for reference?
ANSWER:
NEW KIT version can have these things

-This is a 60/50 kinda boat or what? What is your rating?
ANSWER:
This is a 100 / 100 under power or sail.

The New kit look have better speed, space and load carry?
ANSWER:
YES

I would want a lug sail, what is the speed achieved by that sail?
ANSWER:
Do you mean what I call 'Junk rig ? ... If so speed would be 12 knots in ideal conditions ... Same as for other rigs.

What engine and size you suggested for the boat to travel 12 knot?
ANSWER:
135 HP - TO 150 HP ... Any good diesel ... we can supply Iveco ... but any similar ... 2:1 transmission reduction.

My trip would take a 200 km to 600 km return trip. What is you option to my vessel design?
ANSWER:
NO problems ... fuel capacity can do much more.

OK ... look forward to hearing from you when you have checked CD etc.

Regards, BRUCE
R Bruce Roberts-Goodson Chief Designer
Bruce Roberts International Yacht Design

[Wellydeckhand]

I was told to choose between 2 type of hull which you all think is btter for rough sea and good speed..........

Bruce like to convience me on his 100/100, anyone to answer?

Is his engine spec is right for the 65ft Gilly? 2:1 ratio? I only know marinized truck engine and my car engine, pls advise.

I would choose a range of choices for engine from Catapillar, Deutz, Yanmar, .........

Wellydeckhand

[FAST FRED]

"What engine and size you suggested for the boat to travel 12 knot?
ANSWER:
135 HP - TO 150 HP ... Any good diesel ... we can supply Iveco ... but any similar ... 2:1 transmission reduction"

I think this is QUITE optomistic to think this boat will go 12K on only 8 gallons of diesel per hour.

Cruise at 8K or even 9K should be cheap ,(2 or 3 GPH) but 12K is far far above "hull speed" and will require Loads of power, as well as a good sized propellor to create the thrust.