IOM design blog

[fredschmidt]

I'm inviting you to share yours knowledges about IOM on my new blog in English: IOM & RG 65 design.
Your discordance or concordance will be very welcome.
Only sharing knowing we will grow.

Fred

http://www.iomdesign.wordpress.com

[Gilbert]

Hi,
This looks like an interesting blog.
I would like to know what IOM stands for.
Thanks.

[Doug Lord]

Fred, your blog seems well done-congratulations. My only note of discord is that here we are in 2010 and RC sailing is, in many respects, still stuck in the 1950's. No movable ballast, few square top mains, few if any working spinnakers. Most ,if not all "International" classes outlaw movable ballast and/or spinnakers . With spinnakers there are some classes that "allow" them but have constructed a rule that effectively bans them. I think it is a shame when we see the technological advances in RC flying that RC sailing remains much the same as it was years ago......

[fredschmidt]

Originally Posted by Gilbert

Hi,
This looks like an interesting blog.
I would like to know what IOM stands for.
Thanks.

Hi Gilbert

I do not understand well your question, see if is correct:

IOM - International One Meter radio controlled sailboat.

An article on Seahorse explains well:

" The IOM’s genesis in 1988 started with
the goal of creating a class that would be
simpler, smaller and cheaper than the
Marblehead and other larger boats, with
several key features:
a - Three one-design rigs, each with tightly
controlled sail sizes and profile.
b - A sound method for determining draft
restriction with a minimum and maximum
value.
c - Alloy or wood spars only.
d -i Glass or wood hulls only.
e - Two channels of radio control (RC)
only.
f - A maximum weight for the ballast plus
fin and minimum for the complete yacht.
‘The class was for people who wanted a
yacht that would be restricted to many of the
same basic parameters as others in the fleet,’
explains Graham Bantock. ‘Unlike some of
our other classes, this fleet was not to be a
battleground for highly skilled builders with
better technical solutions.’ No one would
know this better than Bantock, whose shop
has produced amazingly detailed technical
solutions to every component part of RC
yachts for nearly two decades. "

For me IOM is a passion, i have a great delight in do a design, sailing, compare, share knowing,etc.

The IOM design perhaps is more complex in few aspects than a real boat because has to sail in waters similar to real boat with only one meter length.

You already sail an IOM?

Cheers

Fred

[messabout]

Fred; Well done blog. Modelers will appreciate your effort.

Doug: Rc boats are not stuck in the 50s. We certainly have the capacity to build complex models with movable ballast, flat tops, spinnakers, and all the rest. IOM is a restricted developement class. Limit of two servos is one of the main barriers. There is good reason for the rules that limit complexity. Quite simply; too much complexity is off putting to many would be RC sailors. Not only would the technical difficulties disuade them, but also cost factors would keep many of us at bay.

The IOM class is one of the largest classes in the world and it is populated by a wide spectrum of sailing enthusiasts, some very very bright and skilled, others not so much so. We have several classes in the US, similar to the IOM. The USIM for example is a developement class whose only restrictions are LOA and SA. It is almost exactly like the IOM but it has fewer restrictions and the class has not taken hold like the IOM. We have near misses like the 36-600 as well. We are lazy Americans who want to visit the hobby shop, buy a boat in a box, and go sailing. Thus the popularity of Victorias, Sailwinds, Lasers, and that sort of thing. Take it out of the box and sail it.

There are a few nut cases like you and me who are not satisfied with sensible boats. No! we gotta invent, build, sail something better, faster. (somehow we foolishly equate the descriptions better and faster) That kind of thing fulfils our need but they are not commercially viable, or hugely popular. It is just as much competitive fun to race in a fleet of PDRs as it is in FDs or Tornados. Matter of fact slow boats tend to hone the feel and oneness with the boats. Slow boat skippers who pay attention, learn nuances more certainly than those whose only aim is to go fast.

Fred; keep us posted, more than a few of us are modelers interested in fine tuning our toys.

[fredschmidt]

Originally Posted by Doug Lord

Fred, your blog seems well done-congratulations. My only note of discord is that here we are in 2010 and RC sailing is, in many respects, still stuck in the 1950's. No movable ballast, few square top mains, few if any working spinnakers. Most ,if not all "International" classes outlaw movable ballast and/or spinnakers . With spinnakers there are some classes that "allow" them but have constructed a rule that effectively bans them. I think it is a shame when we see the technological advances in RC flying that RC sailing remains much the same as it was years ago......

Doug

Sorry, I do a response but when I go edit them to add more one video I erased all. Starting all over again

Yes, you are right if you say classes, but we have to see some others aspects.

The great problem is the costs. Actual classes do not want change because will be more difficult to achieve more competitors in cost function. Actual class practically do access to anyone. We do not have much people doing RC sailboats. With classes organization, internet facilities the RC sailing is increasing considerably, today we have state, country, continents (South America), world championships that disclose the sport. Increase in technology is increase costs that discriminate much peoples.

We have in RC sailing some new technologies that in future will permit new classes. See the videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZKkszDWBe0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GtiKPyoNrEhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GtiKPyoNrE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKs0EAxEnXA

This last video led me to organize a work with boys and peoples in underserved communities in function of hight technologies applied and low costs, stimulate the desire to study. Is four hulls hydrofoil (one a glass pet) very cheap.

I will disclose more videos in future with new technologies in RC boats.

Cheers

Fred

[fredschmidt]

Originally Posted by messabout

Fred; Well done blog. Modelers will appreciate your effort.

Doug: Rc boats are not stuck in the 50s. We certainly have the capacity to build complex models with movable ballast, flat tops, spinnakers, and all the rest. IOM is a restricted developement class. Limit of two servos is one of the main barriers. There is good reason for the rules that limit complexity. Quite simply; too much complexity is off putting to many would be RC sailors. Not only would the technical difficulties disuade them, but also cost factors would keep many of us at bay.

The IOM class is one of the largest classes in the world and it is populated by a wide spectrum of sailing enthusiasts, some very very bright and skilled, others not so much so. We have several classes in the US, similar to the IOM. The USIM for example is a developement class whose only restrictions are LOA and SA. It is almost exactly like the IOM but it has fewer restrictions and the class has not taken hold like the IOM. We have near misses like the 36-600 as well. We are lazy Americans who want to visit the hobby shop, buy a boat in a box, and go sailing. Thus the popularity of Victorias, Sailwinds, Lasers, and that sort of thing. Take it out of the box and sail it.

There are a few nut cases like you and me who are not satisfied with sensible boats. No! we gotta invent, build, sail something better, faster. (somehow we foolishly equate the descriptions better and faster) That kind of thing fulfils our need but they are not commercially viable, or hugely popular. It is just as much competitive fun to race in a fleet of PDRs as it is in FDs or Tornados. Matter of fact slow boats tend to hone the feel and oneness with the boats. Slow boat skippers who pay attention, learn nuances more certainly than those whose only aim is to go fast.

Fred; keep us posted, more than a few of us are modelers interested in fine tuning our toys.

messabout

Thanks for the words.

I hope that peoples interested in design, in fine tuning and study RC sailboats help me in this objective. Questions, discordance and concordance are very necessary.

Cheers

Fred

[Doug Lord]

Originally Posted by fredschmidt

Doug

Sorry, I do a response but when I go edit them to add more one video I erased all. Starting all over again

Yes, you are right if you say classes, but we have to see some others aspects.

The great problem is the costs. Actual classes do not want change because will be more difficult to achieve more competitors in cost function. Actual class practically do access to anyone. We do not have much people doing RC sailboats. With classes organization, internet facilities the RC sailing is increasing considerably, today we have state, country, continents (South America), world championships that disclose the sport. Increase in technology is increase costs that discriminate much peoples.

We have in RC sailing some new technologies that in future will permit new classes. See the videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZKkszDWBe0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GtiKPyoNrEhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GtiKPyoNrE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKs0EAxEnXA

This last video led me to organize a work with boys and peoples in underserved communities in function of hight technologies applied and low costs, stimulate the desire to study. Is four hulls hydrofoil (one a glass pet) very cheap.

I will disclose more videos in future with new technologies in RC boats.

Cheers

Fred

======================
Thanks for the videos ,Fred-it would be great to see some of those boats catch on! I understand the problem with cost all too well: about 15 years ago I manufactured a few RC spinnaker boats, a Melges 24 model with movable ballast/asymetrical spinnaker, a couple of spinnaker boats with symetrical spinnakers and a multihull foiler(F3)-the first production RC foiler, I think. Anyway, they cost too much and the wow! factor was not enough to build interest. Maybe someday there will be international or AMYA classes that allow actual development-I can hope that there might be some interest. I think that the AMYA and International Class rules hold back development. Supposedly "complex" things like spinnakers and movable ballast are NOT beyond the scope of those that participate in current development classes. The organizations that administer model sailing do not seem to encourage innovation-at least there is not one single development class currently in existence where any of these boats or their systems would be allowed-and I think that is too bad for all the sailors who don't know what they are missing. Racing an RC boat with movable ballast and/or a spinnaker is one of the greatest experiences I've ever had in RC sailing! These things ADD immeasurably to the fun of rc racing.....

A few of my boats:

[Doug Lord]

Originally Posted by messabout

Fred; Well done blog. Modelers will appreciate your effort.

Doug: Rc boats are not stuck in the 50s. We certainly have the capacity to build complex models with movable ballast, flat tops, spinnakers, and all the rest.

================
M, of course there are those that experiment-there have been for years and years. But the rules under which RC sailboat racing is governed are haunted by outdated technology. No International organization or the AMYA has an active development class rule that allows movable ballast or practical fully gybable spinnakers that set and douse in less than 4 seconds. The two multihull rules limit beam so that a practical "F3" type foiler is not legal.
The AMYA does have an "Open" class where this stuff is legal but I guess there is no interest. And , I think, that is because people have no clue what they are missing.
RC helicopters flying upside down, turbine helicopters and aircraft and helis piloted by video systems and yet in sailing the classes are almost all the same classes and/or the same tech that was around 60 years ago,well, maybe 30 years ago!
What I don't understand is why these flyers are so drawn to "complexity" in greater numbers than RC sailors and spend tons of money yet RC sailors don't seem to be interested in applying modern technology to racing rc sailboats-I just don't get it.
So much incredible fun being missed-but why?!
----
Thanks for indulging me, Fred-good luck with your blog and with the IOM-a great class.

[fredschmidt]

Doug

Great, marvelous boats.

I can say what happen in Brazil.

The great class here is RG 65. Why?
It is little, cheap, the peoples has dozen free design to build and class is very much organized.
For two hundred millions peoples living here, few peoples know RC sailboats and his classes. I think that three hundred people in Brazil do RC sail.
I myself, that love boats in all scales, know the RC sailboats one year ago when by chance I see a 2008 Brazilian IOM championship video in youtube , and I have 66 years old, 40 years respiring boats.
The peoples do not have sufficient knowing in design to develop a canting keel, do a asymmetrical spinnaker or a movable ballast.
We do not have plans to do this and classes are only reals if we have a people contingent asking for them.
If someone want sold a boat with canting keel, asymmetrical spinnaker or moved ballast, what will be the price? I assure that only a half dozen peoples will buy it here.
But I know that in future we will have a class with canting keels, spinnakers, movable ballast, hydrofoils, etc, is inevitable.
The problem is that you was fifty years ahead.
I hope that you can help me in divulge the RC sail showing your work on the blog, furnishing photos, details, design, giving ideas.
If you want I give you an exclusive page to do this.
The work that I am organizing involves a four hull glass pet hydrofoil. I will teach them all theory involved inclusive the foil researches for hydrofoils boats. You are invited to teach us about this.

Regards

Fred

[Doug Lord]

Thanks ,Fred- I had a lot of info on my site www.microsail.com which is now down. I'll post two sketches here that sort of explain both the asymetrical and symetrical setups and you can use them and the pictures above. I'll try to answer any questions but I can't commit more than that right now-I'm out of time. But I will help you as much as I can over time.
You seem to have a first class attitude and you are going to be a big help to IOM sailors in Brazil! And maybe spark a few imaginations. I wish you the best of luck!

click on image to enlarge:

[fredschmidt]

Doug

Thanks very much.

I will open a new page on the blog. Future in RC sail, and I will initiate it with your work.
Thank you very much. The blog is a free channel for you and all other peoples that loves boat and like share knowing.

Fred

[Doug Lord]

Thank you, Fred. I had a little booklet on the website that described the F3 foiler in detail-I'm writing my webmaster to see if he can still access it. If not, I'll do it again over some time....

[fredschmidt]

Doug

I wait by it. Thanks.

The page is already in the blog.

Fred