A-Frame Mast

[ancient kayaker]

Thanks for saving the pics for us! What a collection of neat ideas!

Not strictly a lateen - more of a leg o’ mutton sail, considering the sprit and near vertical mast.I would worry about the wear on the mainsail through the mid-boom support ring, if it is a ring, and if it is a ring then how can the sail pass through it for reefing/sailing? Must have a sail gap with rollers. Pity the original site has gone.

[Angélique]

Originally Posted by ancient kayaker

Thanks for saving the pics for us! What a collection of neat ideas!

Not strictly a lateen - more of a leg o’ mutton sail, considering the sprit and near vertical mast.I would worry about the wear on the mainsail through the mid-boom support ring, if it is a ring, and if it is a ring then how can the sail pass through it for reefing/sailing? Must have a sail gap with rollers. Pity the original site has gone.

The 'mast/luff' on which the sail rolls is not anything near vertical (pic). But it's also not as much angled as a traditional lateen.


About the 'ring'... it looks to me like somthing like this... (example)

Don't know if I used the correct names when I said.. ‘‘The lateen is hanging in the A-frame in with what seems to be a reefing claw.’’

About the wear; an extra layer of cloth on both sides of the sail where the rollers go..? and bigger diameter and wider rollers..? (see twin rollers for a start)


I think this is a leg of mutton rig... (pic source)

Calidris' main looks more like a lateen to me.. with the addition of a roller reefing system and a swiveling boom at the bottom to set it better to the wind and makes it easier to tack then a traditional lateen.

Yes, a lot of neat ideas in it

Cheers,
Angel

[ancient kayaker]

Yes, I think you are right about the ring, whatever it is called. It must get a lot of strain put on it in a breeze.

The sail in your last image is a type of leg of mutton as you say, but it is more commonly three-sided without the club at the end of the sprit. The reefing system is not relevant to the type of sail IMHO. I've never seen or heard of a lateen with a sprit whereas LOM's usually have one. The loose-footed three sided sails I have seen are more or less horizontal along the foot - presumably to keep the clew low - not a problem with a sprit.

I found this definition of a lateen "A triangular sail, extended by a long yard, which is slung at about one fourth of its length from the lower end, to a low mast, this end being brought down at the tack, while the other end is elevated at an angle or about forty-five degrees ... Some lateen sails have also a boom on the lower side"

That last bit is getting awful close to a crab claw. Perhaps we should split the difference and call it a calidris sail ... it's unique enough to have its own name.

[Angélique]

Right, a Calidris sail it is

Cheers,
Angel

[ancient kayaker]

The Mastless Crab Claw ? discussion is related

[Angélique]

Just for info... the discussion about Calidris' rig continues in the ‘‘Reefing a lanteen sail’’ thread from post #58 and beyond...

Cheers,
Angel

[upchurchmr]

Try this thread WishBone Sailing Rig
Lots of similar ideas.

[Lister]

Jean Merrien a French sailor and designer in the 1960 built several cruisers with A frames masts and two keel.
He was quite successful for a while with the A frames.
I find it odd and not very appealing.
but it's me
Lister

[brian eiland]

Originally Posted by Angélique

Hi, here a A-frame mast with a lateen rig with a boom at the bottom which front swivels. The lateen is hanging in the A-frame in with what seems to be a reefing claw.

The original forum is not always on line and some pics are gone. So here what I once saved from the Google webcache with the original links...

Cheers,
Angel

Good find Angelique.

I added a link to your posting here to this much bigger discussion of A-frame related discussions:
WishBone Sailing Rig

Edited: Opps, 'upchurchmr' bet me to it with the cross reference. I hadn't got to the second page of this discussion before I made my posting

[Angélique]

Originally Posted by brian eiland

I added a link to your posting here to this much bigger discussion of A-frame related discussions:
WishBone Sailing Rig

Edited: Opps, 'upchurchmr' bet me to it with the cross reference. I hadn't got to the second page of this discussion before I made my posting

Well it's to your credit for making a post and posting the link there which makes Calidris a widespread topic on the forum, she and her rig are in three threads now, and all on topic, so lets wait for a spin off . .

Cheers,
Angel

[upchurchmr]

Angel,

Calidris was a very limited part of the link posted by Brian and myself. And it applies to this thread, so why should we wait? And for What? Did you look at the whole linK? there are multiple different boats in the link. the only thing I didn't like is the people who say an A frame is terrible, and those who say it isn't with no facts. Fortunately there are some who have enough detail to lead one to make their own decision.

Like the people interested in this thread.

Do you not like Calidris?

[Angélique]

Originally Posted by upchurchmr

Calidris was a very limited part of the link posted by Brian and myself.

I wasn't talking about the links posted here (although they are very welcome too, so thanks ) but was talking about the links posted there . . . . (note the word ‘‘there’’ in the post you replied to)

And it applies to this thread, so why should we wait? And for What?

The waiting part is for the ones, like myself, who aren't experimenting themselfs but are very intrested in the results of what others will come up with, I'm very greatful they share their knowledge and what they are doing

Did you look at the whole linK? there are multiple different boats in the link.

Yes, so I've seen.

Do you not like Calidris?

I like the whole concept of Calidris and I would like to know if the reefing claw handles the strain well that's put on it in a breeze and about the wear of the sail in the claw.



Cheers,
Angel