Enjoy Survival in disaster

[masalai]

G'nite all. Frosty, yew got it rong G drinks, I don't....... Danish has too much coffee & rum? Kay9 on speed? no not really, good at cut'n'paste like me?

[Kay9]

I think thats the guy. 3 solar stills and could only keep one working. Broke his spear gun and hand speared a dorado while putting a hole in his raft. Good book, but I would have to say ideal conditions to be in a raft. Im at 42N Latt so Im with you, if I have to go into the water I dont think I would last long even in my raft.

[Kay9]

lol Speed and RUM have to counter balance Nite.

[DanishBagger]

Originally Posted by Kay9

I think thats the guy. 3 solar stills and could only keep one working. Broke his spear gun and hand speared a dorado while putting a hole in his raft. Good book, but I would have to say ideal conditions to be in a raft. Im at 42N Latt so Im with you, if I have to go into the water I dont think I would last long even in my raft.

Yup, the solar stills ring a bell. That is the guy. Made "friends" with a fish and so forth.

I wonder if one could make a canopy, just like the fighter planes, but the difference being that the canopy could be used as a hard-bottomed dinghy. And just like the tinker (I believe it was) have an inflatable, insulated roof.

No, not really, but it's fun to play. But I'm taking your clue when it comes to fishing float coats. I thought they cost twice or even three times as much. One of those plus a pair of bibs for me this christmas (paying it myself, though).

[DanishBagger]

Originally Posted by masalai

G'nite all. Frosty, yew got it rong G drinks, I don't....... Danish has too much coffee & rum? Kay9 on speed? no not really, good at cut'n'paste like me?

Nah, too little coffee. I have been awake all night, talking to you tossers instead of roaming the city for eye candy. By choice, even.

And people wonder why I prefer to be alone …

[enjoysurvival]

Hi, all

Reading different events inspires different thoughts.
Anyone tell me what is the prerequisite of preparing survival kits. and why .loading ? money ?planning ?

If the preparation is good, survival becomes enjoyable ( of course ,this wording may become ridiculous because the word itself is a paradox , perhaps I have to use another word later)

Why struggle to survive ? very simple , your equipment is bad ,the preparation is bad , you make yourself in a survival situation because of bad kits, bad preparation !!!

It is a concept of why have to fight so bitterly by bringing just kilos if supplies.

You know why I ask where to place the EPIRB ! The point is not I do not know where to be placed but I have to knock the sea players head. Most of
them don't care , some of them , as mentioned before , do not know what it is and not even register !!!!

Where to place ? in the raft ? in the bedroom? , on the control room ? on the deck ? It is a very serious question ! How to make sure the device be with you ? Just like you have a million dollar but you don't know where the key is !


I am serious in preparing the kits . Are you ? My point is definitely simple .... if you have good preparation , you don't have to use too much effort to fight for survival.
Why just several cans of water? , why 2 packs of biscuits ? Is the raft would sink for some more 20 Litres of water and two bottles of co-ca cola ?

What is most important during the survival period ?
Food ? Water ? Yes , of course but most importatntly........OPTIMISTIC ,POSITIVE THINKING.

why take camera with you ? not a picnic , but to remind that , "hey , take some photos for your sons to see how I experience somthing different"

Turning from "fighting to survive" to "securing survived"

Let's put in a simulated case , ESK and "standard kits" in two screens

12:00 am , storm attacked suddenly and boat to sink, EPIRB lost
12:01 am , raft deployed and all ESK caught on board "standard kits" also on board ( if lost , no story ...12:02 am , still shivering , hand shaking ,wet , storm still horrably blowing
12:25 am , still shivering .clothes changed , deck with several inch of water ..
7:00 am , still blowing , 5 ft waves..................very warmth with the suggested suit. a bit hungry , I have my beef and biscuits breakfast , can fruit , calculating the supplies , feeling safe.thinking why not more !

day 2 , though have sufficient food , start preparing to fishing , rods work well with bait............thinking why pocket EPIRB is not invented


Equipped in wilderness is totally different from at sea because of loading.

My points still valid ...
1. why fighting for survival , why 2 cans of water ? why...
2. How to design some device to make sure all the equipped be with you.

Well , core-tex may not be appropriate , polar suit may fit ... You started to think about the issue.

Day 5 1:00 pm , ESK serve well , fishing , not so easily caught even with fishing rod and bait , coca cola all consumed , desalinator works well , mp3 with radio works well , solar charger works well ........., though cold at night , sleeping bag kept good warmth . no time to play games because too busy to desalinate water and repair the raft and fishing. self made spear gun broken because of manufacturing defect . ( regret not to buy a better one)

Day 6 , I found myself totally not enjoying the survival, because....

indeed , if EPIRB , GPS , Radio ,Satellite phone are with me , I should be in Miami beach..................

[DanishBagger]

Wow, this is like Gamage being drunk. I won't give you the long answer now (I will go to sleep after I have finished eating, but you're making assumptions and jabbing blindly at what to do. And at the same time you recognize you know shyte about survival, you are trying to tell people that what information they have gathered (and chosen from) is wrong. Funnily enough, very few on these boards make these decisions light-heartedly, it has been researched thouroughly, and choices have been made.

What you're saying is that none of us, and in fact noone that plans this for a living is "getting it". Your solution: Bring toys. YOu cannot seriously be that ignorant.

Have you ever been lost? I was – in NZ. Yes, yes, I was stupid, but from the moment I realised I had no clue where I was (and I don't walk very well), it became a survival situation. Yes, you may well laugh, but it's about the mindset.

You do not go about putting on your walkman, and play a feisty game on your PSP, rig your solar panels to charge your batteries (which, btw, you want to keep warm, otherwise they won't work - so you have to heat them with body heat), types a few blog entries and upload it, just for the hell of it. YOur top priorities is either being saved or finding your way to safety. Which one you choose depends on how much water, food, shelter and which communication you're able to establish.

Equipped in wilderness is totally different from at sea because of loading.

Yes, apart from the desert or some really, really cold places or at high altitude, the wilderness is much more forgiving.

The loading part is nonsense.


P.S. There are aready some rather nifty, very small 416mhz epirbs available. If you can afford them. Secondly, who's to say you'll be wearing the jacket or the lifevest it's attached to?


Yes, that was the short version. I have finished eating.
You're simply way over your head here. Not with me, but with the subject – you haven't got a clue, yet you want to bring nonessentials instead of essentials. Think how much that "kit" of yours will weigh and which volume it will have, and think how much water and nutrition you could fit instead. But feel free to go ahead, but please try it first yourself before you give out that dangerous advice. With any luck, that advice will disappear the moment you receive your personal Darwin award.

"enjoying the survival" pfft!

[DanishBagger]

To hell with it. I couldn't sleep before I ended what I started. That's really an annoying thing (to me). But here goes:

Welcome to the long version, ES – you might want to make a cup of coffee, it will be a while.

Originally Posted by enjoysurvival

Reading different events inspires different thoughts.
Anyone tell me what is the prerequisite of preparing survival kits. and why .loading ? money ?planning ?

As I have mentioned in my former post, and others have mentioned as well: You know nothing about survival but have a single book, and think it is like making camp. What the hell do you think you do when you prepare for a survival situation? You think needs. You think "Maslow's hierarchy of needs, then you plan. And in that planning you think KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid), you have to think what will happen in a given situation, and what is your back-up plan. What will happen next and so on and so forth. And at each step, what is the back up plan. And how does it tie into the rest of it?. While doing so, you also have to take into account things like lightning. What if the epirb is fried along with the rest of your tools? Many of these parametres change with where you're going. Many don't.

You then ask about "loading". Well, how much can you lift? Don't think that those davits will work for you.

If the preparation is good, survival becomes enjoyable ( of course ,this wording may become ridiculous because the word itself is a paradox , perhaps I have to use another word later)

"Later"!? You shouldn't have used it in the first place. Get real. It has been ridiculous to use that term to begin with. Almost as ridiculous as your stupid ideas about survival is about passing time in an enjoyable fashion. It's bloody hell about surviving until you can be saved or until you can save yourself (i.e. the longest time possible).

Why struggle to survive ? very simple , your equipment is bad ,the preparation is bad , you make yourself in a survival situation because of bad kits, bad preparation !!!

Says someone who has admitted to not even knowing where to begin on planning a survival kit, someone who has no clue as to what expect, because he hasn't bothered doing the research and from there begun to make choices.

It is a concept of why have to fight so bitterly by bringing just kilos if supplies.

If I understand you correctly, you want to bring more than mere kilos? You do realize that the next step up is tonnes, right? That's right, 1000 kilogrammes.
"Fight bitterly". No, frankly, I hope not to, by _preparing_ properly.

You know why I ask where to place the EPIRB ! The point is not I do not know where to be placed but I have to knock the sea players head.

Well, I gave you a few options. Think about it. There isn't an end all answer, but there are many ridiculous suggestions (I will return to them).

Most of them don't care , some of them , as mentioned before , do not know what it is and not even register !!!!

I see you have learned that tidbit from this very thread. Yes, it is stupid to buy such an expensive thing without registrering. But I have a hard time believing you actually know what it is (for real), and that, as any other technology, it can break, be damaged or simpy malfunction.

Back to placement:

Where to place ? in the raft ? in the bedroom? , on the control room ? on the deck ? It is a very serious question ! How to make sure the device be with you ? Just like you have a million dollar but you don't know where the key is !

Yes, I see your predicament. But where to put the epirb depends on your plan, your boat and preference. But frankly, you're suggesting "bedroom"!? That is something in a house. Even I know that. But that aside, do you seriously think that it would be smart placing it in a cabin, off hand? Technology won't save your arse, planning and prepping will.

I am serious in preparing the kits . Are you ?

What the **** do you think!? I have never been more serious. I'd hate for someone to share your Darwin Award unwittingly.
And let's get this straight: You're not serious at all. If you were, you'd have been doing some research. It sound more like you have been trawling the West Marine-catalogue.

My point is definitely simple .... if you have good preparation , you don't have to use too much effort to fight for survival.

Hmm, but you have no preparation, no plan, no nothing. All you have is an opinion based on zilch research, only conjecture.

Why just several cans of water? , why 2 packs of biscuits ? Is the raft would sink for some more 20 Litres of water and two bottles of co-ca cola ?

You cannot honestly think anyone only plans to bring "several cans"? Further, you seriously don't want to bring your life saver (water) in cans.

What is most important during the survival period ?
Food ? Water ? Yes , of course but most importatntly........OPTIMISTIC ,POSITIVE THINKING.

Yes to the last bit, that is important. I call it a "will to live". The reason for this, is that you "optimistic, positive thinking" implies that if you just think "everything will be fine, we will be saved" which is a very close cousin to apathy.

But, and you might be surprised. Food aren't _that_ important. But water is. How long do you think you can survive without water?

why take camera with you ? not a picnic , but to remind that , "hey , take some photos for your sons to see how I experience somthing different"

Yes, and here's the crux: As I have stated earlier, you think "survival" equals "primitive camping". If it does then it isn't survival. It's not that I believe one has to do things the hard way, but when you go camping with an axe, a cantine, a map and a gps, it's simpy just "roughing it". In a survival situation, you life is actually at stake. You are in a real risk of losing it! Get that in your head! You're not there to report an experience, you're there only because you want to survive. That is not a prioriroty. That is the only goal. And you better be prepared for it. Otherwise you won't be able to tell the story afterwards. Who gives a shyte about your photos?

Turning from "fighting to survive" to "securing survived"

You really have to be a wanna be academic, if you think that you have covered grounds in that direction.

Let's put in a simulated case , ESK and "standard kits" in two screens

12:00 am , storm attacked suddenly and boat to sink, EPIRB lost
12:01 am , raft deployed and all ESK caught on board "standard kits" also on board ( if lost , no story ...12:02 am , still shivering , hand shaking ,wet , storm still horrably blowing
12:25 am , still shivering .clothes changed , deck with several inch of water ..
7:00 am , still blowing , 5 ft waves..................very warmth with the suggested suit. a bit hungry , I have my beef and biscuits breakfast , can fruit , calculating the supplies , feeling safe.thinking why not more !

day 2 , though have sufficient food , start preparing to fishing , rods work well with bait............thinking why pocket EPIRB is not invented

Already adressed some of this. You're still an idjit for thinking that documenting for someone else should even be a priority.

Equipped in wilderness is totally different from at sea because of loading.

Yes, very much harder, usually, and other methods. Just like you need other methods of survival in a hurricane on land vs sea, mountaneering, the desert in antarctica vs Sahara, vs. greenland, vs. the canadian forest, the Florida swamps and so on. But not because of loading.

My points still valid ...

Your points have never been valid. Not by a long shot.

1. why fighting for survival , why 2 cans of water ? why...
2. How to design some device to make sure all the equipped be with you.

O course you want all the planned equipment to be with you. But you don't want to make a plan that includes taking half the boat.

Well , core-tex may not be appropriate , polar suit may fit ...

Well, I said survival suit. different beasts. When I hear "polar suit" I think of big North Face Jackets and feather-bibs.

You started to think about the issue.

Well, yes, insomuch that I have already thought of what to wear. I live in a cold place (not as cold as Norway or Svalbard, though). Further I have done my research.

Day 5 1:00 pm , ESK serve well , fishing , not so easily caught even with fishing rod and bait , coca cola all consumed

Here I have to interrupt you. First of all, I assume those will be cans, as you mentioned before? In a higly corrosive environment?
Secondly, and much more important: You want to drink sugary water to keep hydrated? That can kill you as fast as drinking all that good salt water that surround you. As I have mentioned before though: Be my guest, but please try it yourself before putting it out here as something to do.
You might want to research dehydration and nutrition a bit.

, desalinator works well

Good, you're lucky.

, mp3 with radio works well

Yes, and while you're sitting there listening to "the radio" or your favourite Primus number, happily slapping yourself on your sunburned forehead, a ship sails by. But you don't notice it.

But then again, it doesn't matter, because your having a good experience you want to tell your grandson, and it's only a matter of time before it stops functioning, and soon there will be another ship, right?

, solar charger works well .....

Yes, let's hope so. Otherwise you will have used your battery supply on the stereo, that could be used to run the VHF instead.

...., though cold at night , sleeping bag kept good warmth

You wish. Make yourself a hammock out of a tarp, poor salt water in the bottom, and lay there in a storm, when it's pissing down. Then imagine huge waves of salt water slamming down on you while you're there.

. no time to play games because too busy to desalinate water and repair the raft and fishing. self made spear gun broken because of manufacturing defect . ( regret not to buy a better one)

Yes, you should have brought another one, and some more water instead of that crappy battery hungry stereo and the associated batteries.

Day 6 , I found myself totally not enjoying the survival, because....

indeed , if EPIRB , GPS , Radio ,Satellite phone are with me , I should be in Miami beach..................

Ah, I see. That sounds like a splendid plan. You obviously think that a helicopter can lift you off from anywhere.

Have you ever sailed? Ever been on a boat?

[westlawn5554X]

Originally Posted by DanishBagger

I agree completely.
My plan (in short form), would be to trigger the EPIRB put it back in the grab bag, and launch the (attached) life raft. Now, I'd have a knife on the liferaft (one of those seat belt cutters, of course, both in the raft, and at the place where the life raft is attached. And only when it goes down for real, will I get into the raft, and then cut the string.

This (to me, that is) seems like the proper way –*at least it is simple. Hell, I don't even trust automatically inflating life vests. The reasoning behind that is that you may not want it to inflate in an overturned hull (look at which people die in air plane crashes on the sea – it's the ones that inflate their life vests before they're out of the plane).

But, yes, this thread has its merits, because it gets people thinking. But I do consider his "advice" to be downright life-threatening.

Mmmm... knife can be darn useful, find an electrician knife for cable cutting that can be use for tower climbing, easy drawing yet not fall out of the sheath. It is curve infront without pointy pierce so you dont kill yur only float.

Get a cert. lifejacket gas inflated like the one you stolen from a boeing he... or get a foam that last the best variable from 5- 20 hrs as water will degrade the floating foam and lead to your death.

The cold water is your enemy it will draw away every drop of your heat and lifeforce... get geasy calories squeezed food and high sugar stuff... you need it.

Get a H2O filter pipe for unsure water or sea water so u can drink as salt make u more thirsty.

Anything that glow or reflect is best... like my bald head.

Get a water tight black bag that the S.E.A.L. use get your medicine stay dry and not mussy... I found the item in Sear Tech S'pore Beach Rd... get one if you are in Asia.

A diving suit will be a boon with themal warmer with battery or ...

have a flare torch and international beeper buy Breliting watch which already have one as a STD in one of their high end model.

Old trick from pilot.... eating asparagus will boost your urine in drawing attention from fish???

wat else? water proof torch? gramma photo or latest playboy?... just pulling yur leg... Cheers

[westlawn5554X]

Originally Posted by Kay9

Enjoysurvival has read a book about being in a life raft at Lattitude 12N for 30 days. I have read the same book. Its generally 1-3' swells there and your biggest problem is water and saltwater soars. What he dosnt realize is just how violent a sinking can be, on both the body and soal. USCG says that 90% of the people that die in a boat sinking die in the first 30 mins. Due to mental anxiety. The stress of suddenly being thrown into a situation in which you have to give up all controll, is more then a lot of people are ready for, thus they give up and die.

Short answer he has no idea what he is talking about.

You mean it is ok to weed in emergency cases?... just kiddin

[DanishBagger]

Originally Posted by westlawn5554X

Mmmm... knife can be darn useful, find an electrician knife for cable cutting that can be use for tower climbing, easy drawing yet not fall out of the sheath. It is curve infront without pointy pierce so you dont kill yur only float.

Get a cert. lifejacket gas inflated like the one you stolen from a boeing he... or get a foam that last the best variable from 5- 20 hrs as water will degrade the floating foam and lead to your death.

The cold water is your enemy it will draw away every drop of your heat and lifeforce... get geasy calories squeezed food and high sugar stuff... you need it.

Get a H2O filter pipe for unsure water or sea water so u can drink as salt make u more thirsty.

Anything that glow or reflect is best... like my bald head.

Get a water tight black bag that the S.E.A.L. use get your medicine stay dry and not mussy... I found the item in Sear Tech S'pore Beach Rd... get one if you are in Asia.

A diving suit will be a boon with themal warmer with battery or ...

have a flare torch and international beeper buy Breliting watch which already have one as a STD in one of their high end model.

Old trick from pilot.... eating asparagus will boost your urine in drawing attention from fish???

wat else? water proof torch? gramma photo or latest playboy?... just pulling yur leg... Cheers

Seriously, some of those are on my list.
Here are some of those:

Small LED-light - red. Two of them.

I made a non-pointy knife meself. But the safety harness cutters are neat for the specific purposes.

My bald head (yes, mine is too, although most of it is shaved) will never be reflecting anything, as too much heat will escape from an uncovered head. The head is first priority, unless I am already in the water.

haha, I just realised you have put a breilting in that list! I wish I could afford any breitling watch. I'm not even close to that.

[westlawn5554X]

I seriously prefer to have a survival boat that is unsinkable without my fancy mini cooper but best mountain bike and diving gear... meaning a boat that can bring you out of a war zone quick and start you in a gentle way...

A clear landing point with the next survival gear for land survival and set for the hidden Shangrila somewhere and hide to regroup...

That is a long term investment ... with cheap rubbish material and clever bargaining... I am scared of war misfire but never back away from a right cause.

I must have drink something expired as I am starting to sound like danishbagger.....

[westlawn5554X]

Originally Posted by DanishBagger

My bald head (yes, mine is too, although most of it is shaved) will never be reflecting anything, as too much heat will escape from an uncovered head. The head is first priority, unless I am already in the water.

haha, I just realised you have put a breilting in that list! I wish I could afford any breitling watch. I'm not even close to that.

err... get a 3M sticker and put it on yur hat... head is the easy to see from a high point...

Or... get a site safety helmet and but reflective bit all over... look like a 70' disco light ball...

for the watch see ebay...

[DanishBagger]

Yes, and 3M-stripes on the inside of the cuffs (well, on the outside of the inside, if you know what I mean).

btw, I already have a dry suit (the diver's suit you mentioned).

[DanishBagger]

Originally Posted by westlawn5554X

I seriously prefer to have a survival boat that is unsinkable without my fancy mini cooper but best mountain bike and diving gear... meaning a boat that can bring you out of a war zone quick and start you in a gentle way...

A clear landing point with the next survival gear for land survival and set for the hidden Shangrila somewhere and hide to regroup...

That is a long term investment ... with cheap rubbish material and clever bargaining... I am scared of war misfire but never back away from a right cause.

Sounds like a plan. At least a better plan than ES.

I must have drink something expired as I am starting to sound like danishbagger.....

The cure for me would be to hit the sack. I guess I could go for a beer instead, though (at this stage, that would propably make me even worse).