Dare to Say No

Amazing , is it not ?

 

Timothy
I have seen rapidly increasing number of kayaks on waterways you would never see them 10 years ago. I recently saw a couple of cars trailering four
canoes each. One for each member of the family. Still cheaper and easier than most power boats.

Unless you live on a boat they are more a chore than pleasure. It is a constant rush with little relaxation - maybe a little easier if moored at the back door but then limited places to explore. A kayak that can be carried on top of a car is convenient and can be taken to the water way of choice.

I would like to know how many Hobie kayaks are sold worldwide each year. These are the upper end of the roto boats. There must be millions of the 6 to 8ft sit ons sold each year.

Hobie seem to have the high end of roto boats virtually sewn up. Based on their selling price compared to the others they must rake it in on every sale.

How has Hobie fared through the downturn?

Rick W

 

...and still manage to completely miss the point!

 

"...It is a constant rush with little relaxation..."

That is the point...it is a "rush". The "relaxation" comes from this activity....your equating your personal interpretation of "relaxation" as being the same for everyone and the bench mark. This is not the case.

 

I'm with AH on this one. Rick, you've mentioned boating being a 'chore' any number of times. With the possible exception of sanding the bottom before I antifoul, I really can't think of anything boat related that I consider to be a chore.

I don't deny the obvious joy that you and millions of other gain from paddling about. I do a little of it myself. But to think that it could ever voluntarily replace 'real' cruising (and I don't mean that in a derogatory way) is fanciful.

The current popularity of sea kayaks etc is not really any different from the fads of the past. Sailboards are a prime example. It's not that long ago when everyone had one (I still do). Indeed it is probably the kayak that has replaced them on the deck of the Riviera to which I referred earlier!
That's not to suggest that there's anything wrong with people paddling about, I just think its a mistake to think that they are all doing it because they're more environmentally responsible boaters.... in spite of the fact that many glare down their indignant noses as larger craft pass by. Most do it because they can't afford anything bigger - or can't justify the outlay

 

My premise is that it is not a fad. My boys and any number of their mates could not think of anything more ridiculous than pumping $100 worth of fuel into a boat to pound across some waterway for a few hours making a god awful noise and disturbing the tranquility of an otherwise pleasant place. If you want see what I mean spend a few hours on the Broadwater at the Gold Coast any summer weekend - once a beautiful spot that is now a horrible place.

I have not seen any reduction in windsurfers or sailing dinghies. In fact I see more than a few years ago and there are now kite boarders and heaps of kayaks and canoes.

I dare say by the time your boys get to a stage where they can buy a boat it will not be something that uses a whole lot of fuel if any. My bet is that they will lose interest once they get outside influences that you cannot control.

I might be a minority on this forum but the original question was about leadership. There are many here who want things to go back to how they were. That is not leadership but rather wishful thinking. It will not happen. There are 4,000,000,000+ aspirants to the lifestyle most on this forum already have or have experienced at some time. There is no way that all 6.7bn of us can have large luxury fuel guzzling pleasure craft.

There are 20 million scooters produced in China each year to efficienctly transport them to jobs where they work diligently for 10 to 12 hours per day. The country imports 1bn tonnes of iron ore every year to convert into infrastructure that improves the efficiency of their manufacturing and transport. They can afford to set the prices of every commodity because they are so efficient at converting for the things the rest of the world buys. This is where the pressure is coming from. (I think USA already owes China about USD2,000,000,000,000 so the interest bill on all those zeros is not insignificant)

High powered pleasure craft are dinosaurs on the brink of extinction. Each pleasure boat owner in the west is competing against roughly 1000 scooter owners in China and India for the fuel to power his boat. I know who will come out on top. Think about it. Will the Chinese commuter baulk at paying $10 a litre for fuel to get to work for a week? (in fact most are electric anyhow but that is another story) I am certain even wealthy boaters would take stock before paying out $10,000 for fuel for a weekend on the water.

Right now China and India are building infrastructure that requires steel. Steel prices have more than quadrupled since their emergence in the market as they have been prepared to pay whatever price is necessary. As they advance economically the pressure will come on other commodities. Oil experienced a blip a couple of years back but wait till more of China and India's populations migrate to cars and luxury boats. $100 a barrel will be fondly viewed as a giveaway price.

I personally think Hobie are a main player in the boating industry with very ordinary products that sell at premium prices - like the majority on this forum other manufacturers think this market beneath them. It is not "real" boating unless it has 1000HP and can get to 40kts. Like the boats they aspire to design and build they are a dying breed.

Rick W

 

".. My boys and any number of their mates could not think of anything more ridiculous than pumping $100 worth of fuel into a boat to pound across some waterway for a few hours making a god awful noise and disturbing the tranquility of an otherwise pleasant place..."

That is your personal opinion, many others the world over will disagree.

"..It is not "real" boating unless it has 1000HP and can get to 40kts..."

Again, that is your personal opinion and many others will disagree.

You're opining about your own personal preferences for pleasure, relaxation, etc etc and assuming that others must confirm to this, or there is something wrong with their own ability to derive pleasure/relaxation etc in a form other than your own version.

Willallinson, again appears to hit the nail on the head, certainty in terms of human behaviour of those on the water:

"..in spite of the fact that many glare down their indignant noses as larger craft pass by. Most do it because they can't afford anything bigger - or can't justify the outlay.."

Everything is about personal choice. To suggest that someone else must accept your version/definition is laughable at best, or arrogant at worst. Everyone goes on to the water for different reasons....and enjoys the water in different ways. To deny someone pleasure/relation because it does not conform to your own "model" is a dictatorship not freedom of choice and pleasure.

Quality and enjoyment of life is not defined by one boat and one method of boating alone...

 

One would also have to think with the rise of these new economy's with their pro ported goal of a more even distribution of wealth ,that the market for these ostentatious displays of wealth might be coming to an end, as it seems that in these states the penalty for the flaunting of wealth is of rather an extreme nature. Perhaps there will be a market for the every man cruising boat yet. But then again I suppose it is possible that the U.S can pull another rabbit out of its hat. But this time it won,t be the Texas oil that made it the worlds greatest exporter and provided it with the post war capital to build an empire.

 

Wow! Sorry Rick - I had no intention of getting you so arked up!

 

Wow! Sorry Rick - I had no intention of getting you so arked up!

 

So good you said it twice..???

 

Oops...!

 

I was restating easily found facts and making a few projections based on them. I am not arked up.

Your kids are young. They will soon have external pressures to do other things that eat into your time on the boat. I expect you will find boating with a growing family becomes quite a selfish pursuit. Give it five years and come back to this. You might surprise me.

There will also be influences from teachers and peers that shape their outlook. You cannot control this. There is considerable concern for the sustainability of the planet that gets into kids' brains. Believe it or not this is the sort of stuff that will shape their outlook:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w62gsctP2gc&feature=player_embedded

I doubt that there are many people in small, planet friendly craft who envy the big gas guzzling boats. The big boat owners might think they do but that is their belief to satisfy their ego. My view is that they are anti-social because they are wasteful of a rapidly diminishing resource. An opinion only but I know shared by a growing number, particularly the young well-educated people who would, in the past, be potential luxury boat owners.

I can see many opportunities for boats that are more planet friendly but not many examples have come forth on this thread. Fact is you cannot buy a marine prop that suits an easily driven hull. If you want one that give best efficiency you have to make it:
http://www.woodenboat-digital.com/woodenboat/20060506/?pg=73

Rick W

 

Rick touched on something here that I would like to make comment on.

I have not the money to own a large , powerful , luxurious boat.

I have however thought about what it would be like to own one.

Assuming that I had no difficulty pumping several hundreds / thousands gallons/ liters of diesel into the tanks at will ,
I can say, HONESTLY, that the consumption necessary to operate that boat / yacht would nag at my conscience.

Is my way of thinking really in the minority ?

 

In a few years they could be paying people to get rid of them. Issues is not the cost of getting one but rather the cost of using it.

Funny story here. Going back to the mid 70s, I had a friend in Dampier who owned a 25ft Bertram with twin 150HP mercruisers. He invited a visiting bearing specialist out fishing. The guy offered to buy the fuel. When the bowser clicked into three figures my friend took pity and said he would pay for anything over $100. It stopped at $120. Would hate to think what it would cost for fuel for a fishing trip on that thing now. Probably more than the beer.

Rick W