Cruising Cat Width

[stewi]

I have to sign off from the forum for some weeks and return to my job. Jonathan, you are in good hands here. My travel experiences are already 25 years old and not up to date.
However, on the boat length, I remember there were some restrictions related to the boat license. I thought > 19.60 m requires a professional captain’s license and below it is a sport boat license.
Nevertheless, I would stick with a mono. A cat brings your deckhouse too high up above the waterline. Wetted surface is larger and requires more horsepower, sorry Wattage.
If I guess some numbers than the 24 X 4 m hull and deck in plywood will weigh 3 tons. If you have 1 ton of batteries, water and fuel tanks below the waterline, you should have enough stability not tipping the boat over.
A round hull will heel when you step on the side decks, but not by much.
With the boat, fully equipped you shouldn’t get more than 8 tons.
I would locate the (enclosed) steering station either in front or in the center of the boat. Yes, in river turns, you want to see what is ahead of you.

Your thread makes me thinking, if I shouldn’t follow you in a few years. Although I couldn’t afford the Riviera.
Drop me an e-mail once in a while and let me know where we can meet.

P.S. I keep on trying not to have it look like an UFO. I should have drawn the side view, or 3D.

[JonathanCole]

Originally Posted by D'ARTOIS

Therefore we need to know where you want to go and if that includes the Canal du Midi - absolutely the most exiting and tranquil waterway in France, we have to see what can pass.
Your limits are less tight in case you skip the CdM parameters/requirements.

The barge would be certainly the best option, but you have clearly stated that such is no option - so we restrict ourselves to the double hull, either the true cat hull or the pontoon hull.

Only Rhine and Rhone will require optimal power - the rest of the inland waterways are reasonable navigable w/o the necessity of a large engine and/or power supply.

The first answer I need is Jonathan, if you desire to navigate the CdM?

I have been planning to cruise the Canal du Midi with a friend from Germany (maybe this Spring) using a rented boat. I think that it makes the most sense to do it that way.

I have close friends that live along the Neckar (Germany) and a sister that lives in Lyon, so that is probably my most usual route, although trips as far as The Netherlands in the summer and the Mediterranean in the winter are part of the plan. I would like to live this lifestyle for several years, so the boat needs to be very practical and comfortable. I have not ruled out a barge style boat, but if I do it on such a boat it will not be the hi-tech solar electric catamaran I have envisioned. It might be more practical to do that here in Hawaii as I originally envisioned in 1996.

However, solar panels on the roof of a smaller boat can certainly provide enough energy for all the comforts of home without having to run a generator when moored for extensive periods as I plan to be. Based on Stewi's latest post, a smaller boat that comes under less stringent operator licensing might make more sense for Europe.

I have heard that 15 metres is the length limit for a non-professional captain in Holland. Is that true, D'Artois?

[D'ARTOIS]

In fact that is correct, but that counts only for Dutch citizens. A barge type would be the very best solution; I have several such designs here, ranging from 15 till 20 mtrs. I will put some pictures in this thread for your convenience and I guarantee you that you will live very comortable. With a little reinforcments and smaller windows you could even make outbound trips (coastal) that makes it possible to cruise even the UK and Ireland. Which you could never do in a cat hulled houseboat. The elongated deck combined with the wheelhouse will give ample space for your solar cells.

Such a boat will keep also a high resale-value as these kind of boats are in a strong demand.

[yipster]

did i ever tell i lived on such a barge in the river amstel here when i was younger?
those original deckhatches actually hinge in the middle and can fit alot of solar panels.
the noorderzon the navigo guý's cruised europe around with was a such a barge and i bet they will be pleased to answer questions.
for boats faster than 20km or longer than 15m you need a licence in europe, for open waters an extra exam and paper.
a captain licence ( not needed ) is harder.

[JonathanCole]

Originally Posted by yipster

for boats faster than 20km or longer than 15m you need a licence in europe, for open waters an extra exam and paper.

Do you mean faster than 20 knots?

By the way how much does the upgrade cost for your European Noordersoft program?

Why do I get the feeling that this thread about the width of catamarans has been hijacked by mono-theists? Perhaps the barge can be built mono-coque and painted mono-chrome. But this might appear to be a mono-poly to the mono-hull enthusiast. Just as long as I don't catch mono-nucleosis!!

[tspeer]

I recommend you read "Outward Bound" by Tristan Jones. One man's account of taking a trimaran up the Rhine and down the Danube. Not just any man, mind you...

[D'ARTOIS]

Yes Tom, he also wrote something about the Canal du Midi in "Wayward Sailor" - his tour with the Tri happened much later, just before the Rhein-Donaukanal was finished.
Rhine and the other main waterways of Europe are quite well navigable for a twin-hulled vessel that has all the height above the waterline. Trying to find a mooring might be another issue.

Practice and experience are the best teachers

[brian eiland]

In the past I've had a considerable number of persons ask about a catamaran design that could also do the canals of Europe. With some knowledge I had gained from a few cruising guides I just had to flat out recommend they NOT try to combine the two design requirements....too incompatible.

I've always dreamed of some of these canal trips as well....maybe when our dollar gets a little stronger again....but I would think renting a canal specific vessel or chartering with a owner operator would be the way to go.

Its a bit of a shame that all of this great canal discussion, photos and maps is hidden away in a different subject thread...?

[masrapido]

Originally Posted by JonathanCole

Do you mean faster than 20 knots?

By the way how much does the upgrade cost for your European Noordersoft program?

Why do I get the feeling that this thread about the width of catamarans has been hijacked by mono-theists? Perhaps the barge can be built mono-coque and painted mono-chrome. But this might appear to be a mono-poly to the mono-hull enthusiast. Just as long as I don't catch mono-nucleosis!!

no, yipster meant kilometers. in europe, on rivers and channels ships are measuring speed in kilometers. one day sea ships will also fall in line. knots are incompatible with the metric system.

[D'ARTOIS]

Well, there are more people from the US that come to Europe and navigate the channels as vice versa.
A French friend of mine called me - he wants to buy a boat that is located somewhere at Lake Erie and asks how he can sail from that lake to the Hudson bay - he is used to the solid bridges in France and don't know anything about conditions there.
He might be joining this Forum, as I advised him to put his questions here.
I told him that it is winter now and all the waterways might be frozen, or not.

In any case Brian, you gave your clients the correct advise. The idea's of a twin hulled vessel are too incompatible for sheer comfort under the forementioned circumstances.