Colin Archer - jonnyb

Originally Posted by Lin ZeYang

The problem with Mr colin archer, he trusted his foremen (or yard) so he only provided the drawings. detailed buildingconstruction does not exist. so basically as long as you follow his drawings i think you are pretty close to what this boat will have been like 100 years ago, but ofcourse alloy was not an option 100 years ago. Well seasoned oak-knee or massive amount of oak is not an option today
Zeyang.

Right,
you do´nt build Colin Archer boats, you do´nt even build replicas, that would mean all wooden classic methods to CA plans.
You build boats in CA style, that is a pretty different thing.
And of course, CA probably would have designed in Aluminium and honeycomb too if he was still active.

Sure a massive amount of oak wood IS a option today! You just have to have the right source, or to be in the right place, to have such source. There are still boats built to original CA plans in Northern Europe!

Originally Posted by Lin ZeYang

ca-108/109. same but only this is in lapstrake.

So that is not longer a CA design, sorry! You cannot say I build a Porsche, but with a 2cyl. Diesel engine, and as a 9 seater!
Just leave it what it is, some double ender boat, which has nothing in common with a Colin Archer, except it is a sailing boat and is inspired by the lines of CA too.


Regards
Richard

[Lin ZeYang]

Originally Posted by Velsia

Zeyang

I appreciate that Colin Archer passed his drawings down to the yard and it was up to the shipwrights discretion to get the drawings "to work".

Alloy maybe a much more suitable material for your purpose, and properly grown oak wood at the prices per cube + shipwrights might make it "not an option" for the budget but, I am asking what is a replica?

I won't name her for the sake of the owner but I worked on a boat which was meticulously rebuilt from the keel up to the yards drawings and pictures and accounts, even the brass name plate on the tiller head has been remade as it were circa 1902, but, the only thing left of the old boat is a small section of keel. When she was "relaunched" the old boys at the dock said she wasn't the same boat and and now was a yacht! Is she a replica?

This is the same case with RS1 Colin Archer. She has shifted so much of the wood so its hard to say its the original RS1 Colin Archer. Another problem is: RS1 Colin Archer has been refitted so many times during last 100 years so its hard to say that the "version" they try to keep as original is indeed an original.
This was strictly working boats, so any new invention was take into use -engine, elecric navigation lights etc. So we can say that the original RS1 is maybe a replica of the the orginal RS1 when it left the yard.
The colin archer club has some rules and criterias when it comes to become member. Im far from allowed into that club with an alloy colin archer even if my boat is much closer to any original CA than any member-boat which has been rebubild 10 times for the last 100 year. :-)


zeyang.

[Lin ZeYang]

Originally Posted by apex1

Right,
you do´nt build Colin Archer boats, you do´nt even build replicas, that would mean all wooden classic methods to CA plans.
You build boats in CA style, that is a pretty different thing.
And of course, CA probably would have designed in Aluminium and honeycomb too if he was still active.

Sure a massive amount of oak wood IS a option today! You just have to have the right source, or to be in the right place, to have such source. There are still boats built to original CA plans in Northern Europe!


So that is not longer a CA design, sorry! You cannot say I build a Porsche, but with a 2cyl. Diesel engine, and as a 9 seater!
Just leave it what it is, some double ender boat, which has nothing in common with a Colin Archer, except it is a sailing boat and is inspired by the lines of CA too.


Regards
Richard

Looks like you are member of the colin archer club :-)
Any owner can be member as long as its made in any kind of wood and look slightly like a double ender.

zeyang

[Lin ZeYang]

Originally Posted by apex1

Right,


So that is not longer a CA design, sorry! You cannot say I build a Porsche, but with a 2cyl. Diesel engine, and as a 9 seater!
Just leave it what it is, some double ender boat, which has nothing in common with a Colin Archer, except it is a sailing boat and is inspired by the lines of CA too.

I dont follow this argument.
A guy making a porche in fiberglass body instead of metal with exactly same dimention form and put in a porche engine, would for sure be called a replica.
Its of course not an original porche. Some will even think its an original porche until you knock on the body.

Ditto for this boat. I can paint the hull and you will never notice its alloy until you knock on the hull. even the keel look like massive wood, since i fake the shape of wood.

so yes., this boat is a replica. :-)

zeyang.

Originally Posted by Lin ZeYang

I dont follow this argument.
A guy making a porche in fiberglass body instead of metal with exactly same dimention form and put in a porche engine, would for sure be called a replica.
Its of course not an original porche. Some will even think its an original porche until you knock on the body.
Ditto for this boat. I can paint the hull and you will never notice its alloy until you knock on the hull. even the keel look like massive wood, since i fake the shape of wood.
so yes., this boat is a replica. :-)
zeyang.

It is not! And how often you like to twist the facts, yours is at best a copy!
But it is not even a copy, it has nothing to do with a Colin Archer apart from some style. I assume you do´nt even have the same hull shape as a wooden one would have. The rig will be different too, I´m sure.
So would the Porsche be at best a copy, not a replica. And calling it a Porsche would get you in serious trouble. But Porsche is alive Colin is not, good for you.

No I´m not a member of any club.

[peter radclyffe]

Originally Posted by Lin ZeYang

I dont follow this argument.
A guy making a porche in fiberglass body instead of metal with exactly same dimention form and put in a porche engine, would for sure be called a replica.
Its of course not an original porche. Some will even think its an original porche until you knock on the body.

Ditto for this boat. I can paint the hull and you will never notice its alloy until you knock on the hull. even the keel look like massive wood, since i fake the shape of wood.

so yes., this boat is a replica. :-)

zeyang.

who are you kidding, there is a difference in thickness between plate & wood

[dskira]

It looks like everything double ended, beamy and long keel is now a Colin Archer. Everything under the roof is a Colin Archer, I see even reputated brookers calling Colin Archer a crap in plastic built two years ago.
Pilot cutter is not the name of a designer, but I understand the similitude.
Can brookers, designer and yard live the man alone.
Cheers
Daniel

[peter radclyffe]

your doing a great job zeyang

Originally Posted by peter radclyffe

your doing a great job zeyang

That is your honest opinion Peter?

Sasha

[peter radclyffe]

yes it is Sasha, ive been following it on sailing anarchy, i dont know that much about it but its terrific that zeyang is going for it, apparently on his own, he keeps the ali from buckling by clinker, on wood frames, to be replaced with ali,

Peter, I went a bit through that story and must agree, it is at least a demanding task! A uncommon approach too. And although I wish zeyang to have success with his project, one point remains valid: it is NOT a Colin Archer.

Regards
Richard

Peter, after your comment, I went a bit through that story and must agree, it is at least a demanding task! A uncommon approach too. And although I wish zeyang to have success with his project, one point remains valid: it is NOT a Colin Archer.

Regards
Richard

[peter radclyffe]

for sure it is not a c a,
i have been studying john leather since i was at school 1971
he lived at the top of ferry road, i lived at the bottom on an old yacht,
i have designed a 10 mt boat based on yours Velsia & others in the book,
but i still cant work out how to put the lines onto the screen
how to use carlson or freeship
but im not giving up

[Lin ZeYang]

Originally Posted by peter radclyffe

your doing a great job zeyang

Thanks Peter.

Finished up the planking, will do the keelplank then start to weld up on outside before i flip her. She looks fair sofar.
Lots of welding to do soon. Will switch to MIG.

zeyang