Is It Cheaper To Motor Or Sail

I must confess to having skipped through this a bit since my last post on page 1, so forgive me if somebody else has already said this...
And you may well not be, but surely making this decision (power vs sail) purely on cost is not the wisest decision - unless you truly have no preference one way or the other...
If you're going to go to all the trouble & expense of designing & building a boat... build the one you want. Sure, cost will no doubt force some compromise along the way, but boat ownership is rarely a logical process.... go for the boat you desire and that best fits your needs... and feel the lurve..

 

I think this is the best thought on this thread.

Daniel

 

Will,
Well said but even though we talk pleasure boating utility is an essential part of yachting everywhere and especially in SE Alaska. I live in SE Alaska and as already stated sail boats seldom sail here. You'll probably get tired of putting sails up and taking them down as the wind is'nt steady. I often say the hardest part of cruising in SE is anchorages .. getting into them, having enough safe swinging room, having the speed to get to the next anchorage and a low enough draft to use it. Heavy ground tackle is best supported on a full bow typical of power boats. We have friends that brought a sail boat to SE, a beautiful french boat about 43' and now they want a power boat. The power boat is even better for rafting to fishing boats and fishing boats are much more numerous than pleasure boats here. Sail boats in SE are a bit like a NY dude on a horse with a bunch of cowboys. People sail boats to Alaska pecause it's the only boat they have and they want to boat here or they love sailing so much they suffer all the consequence's. Others even think sail boating is superior to power boating and sailors are more knowledgeable. Well, there is some truth in that as sailors typically are more serious boaters than power boaters but most of that extra knowledge is about sailing .. not boating.
The answer to the question of this post is without a doubt .. power boat. Sail boats are not well suited to Alaskan waters and to have a non powered sail boat here would not be smart at all. From an economical standpoint, since a sail boat must also be a power boat, buying two propulsion systems and maintaining them both when only one is needed makes the answer to the thread question a no brainer .. power boat.
My response here is only about 90% objective and if you want some input from sail boaters that live here contact the Ketchikan Yacht Club. You can sail a boat up here but if your'e concerned about fuel consumption alone consider my 8 ton 30' power boat that burns < 1gal hr and makes 6.15 knots. At that speed getting to my destination of the day is sometimes a problem.

Easy Rider

 

As Easy said, there is usually no wind -- usually, you'll be boating on water that is as smooth as a lake. So a sailboat will really just be a powerboat in Alaska. But worse, few sailboats have the visibility down below to enjoy the beauty of Alaska.

So you really want a powerboat with big windows, to enjoy that beauty while staying warm when its cold and wet (and its OFTEN wet).

One thing about Alaska is that the days are quite long in the summer, so you can go a long way in a day even at displacement speeds. So a displacement boat (like Easy's 6.15 knots) is usually sufficient to get to the next anchorage before dark. And you'll find that slow speed is really wonderful in Alaska because its so darn beautiful.

However, there are times when you've got to make a tidal gate -- like going to or from Sitka -- where on most days there is just one 10 to 20 minute period of time you can get through. So you may really, really want to be able to run quite a lot faster than 6 knots every few days.

So, a 6 knot powerboat that can go, say, 15 sometimes.

 

post 19 this thread pretty much shows what I want to build

 

Everyone has an opinion....that's what the internet is for....

I'm just trying to present another side....it is not (IMO) a black and white question...there are alternatives......

I cruise these waters (Juan De Fuca north to Desolation Sound) every year in a 20' open boat with sails, oars, and a 5HP motor. Fuel use is less than 20 imp gallons per year.






Some young folks wanted to cruise Alaska, they had little money and no boat, I designed them a 24' open ketch, they built her over the winter and sailed her to Alaska and back the next summer. They had no engine, just oars and sails.

 

enteresting
I am aiming for 25000 lbs fully loaded and I have a 170 hp engine already
so I am actually overpowered by quite a bit

hmmm

 

Im not real enthused about rowing but I can only respect that nice boat that you designed

great job Tad
and it looks like they did a good job building it as well

B

 

B:

Have you posted a layout of your boat somewhere else?


Thx

 

short answer is no
only that one elevation
I am working on the plan view now and the weight budget as well as some sections
just got the skinny on my bulkheads and stringers as well as my method of planking finally down
am working on mass balance and such before I nail down the layout
its my first and my last design of a boat so Im taking a lot of time and assimilating a lot of various points of advice from a bunch of respectable folks who do not necessarily agree on much

its been a long road

that and I purchased elements of yacht design and worked it until I felt comfy with the various concepts

I will present my plans for critique/abuse soonest

thanks for your interest
B

 

Great thanks.

And remember to make space for a decent sized freezer...

 

well friezer is easy cause its short and weighs a lot so it will go near center line along with the engine and fuel bunkers water tanks bla bla bla

if you look at the area under the pilot house its huge
fitting a whopping freezer in there should be cake

the part im struggling with not breaking up is the nice large space of the aft cabin
I can deal with jaming some accomodations into the wheel house but I kinda wanted a living room sort of thing out of the aft cabin, wood stove, entertainment center that kind of thing
but its screaming for two bathrooms and at 48' one would think that not the impossible dream
such is not the case

 

There are no bathrooms in boats.....

It's called the head......here's some info on building your own composting head.....no through hulls, no holding tanks, pumpout fittings, etc.....

http://http://ecovita.net/

 

I was thinking along the same lines
I've built several off the grid homes in the hills and they all use composting toilets

its the shower and the water heater that is the pain in the ***

I was thinking of a spot heater but they use a lot of electricity

oh
and I used to have an electric toilet in my old horse camper trailer back when I was actualy making money

 

Well, you can get fancy and build a real (tracking) parabolic trough.....http://http://wims.unice.fr/xiao/solar/index.html

Or you can paint an aluminum tank and mount it on the cabin top...gravity feed...and a hand pump in the shower provides the overboard drain....again no through hulls under water.

See the Briney Bug folks....I think they use a pump up garden sprayer....

http://www.trawlersandtrawlering.com/news/brineybugreplace.html