A cape Horn vessel

[gonzo]

Nice emergency kit. However, let's not hijack the thread
I think the design is bad, for the Horn or elsewhere.

[simon]

http://www.periple.com/ is what I call a Cape Horn sailing yacht, capable of being single handed, extremely solid, versatile and most of details practical. Might not be a purist's dream, but I thought it was perfectly set up for the region around Cape Horn and Antartica.

[Brent Swain]

Originally Posted by LyndonJ

At the very least experienced hands would always have a line or two coiled ready to be thrown, serious safety gear like a danbouy, lifesling. A liferaft. A dinghy most likely, all the things you would have within reach for emergencies, collisions sinkings.


As to autopilots
I think some of the electronic autopilots are getting pretty good now they are simple robust and very reliable, for a sailboat they're as good as an extra crewman most of the time, delayed auto tacking for example has to be tried to be appreciated.

I think trim tabs seem to be pretty reliable on metal rudders but add complexity on wooden or grp construction.

Should I take medication too Brent?

There is nothing compicated about putting a set of gudgeons and pintles on the back of any rudder, unlss one is mentally challenged. A trimtab drasticaly reduces the power consumption of any autopilot,and the loads on it, and thus drasticaly reduces ones dependence on generating the huge amount of power it takles to steer by the main rudder ,a complicated arangment at the best of times. I don't think I would trust an electronic autopilot enough to go around the horn single handed, with no other option. A lot of people have regreted that ultra naive desicion. . .

[dskira]

Originally Posted by Brent Swain

So what would you use that's simpler than a trim tab for self steering, or inside steering? Servo pendulum? Simpler" Electronic autopilot? Simpler?Cable steering? Ya right! Go take your medication!
There is nothing simpler, nor more robust than a trim tab, supported by three gudgeons and pintles, on the back of a rudder. Properly done, it will never break. Not so with the other alternatives.
Or are you suggesting that going without any self steering and a ******* helmsman in an open cockpit, is less likely to fail, ( after may hours of exposure in an open cockpit.)
Ya, Sure! Go take your medication!

I have a news for you: the self steering was invented and implemented BEFORE your parents were born.
If you don't know that please, learn.
Did you heard about BALANCING a boat with a two mast rig, or with a cutter rig (cutter rig as one mast in case you don't know that.)
By the way, try sailing a real sail boat, you will enjoy.
Don't give me the "take your medication" it is stupidly insulting from someone who has no clue about what is talking about.
Please refrain to show your ignorance. It will reflect negatively on your book sale
Daniel

[dskira]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Nice emergency kit. However, let's not hijack the thread
I think the design is bad, for the Horn or elsewhere.

Tell us why?
I don't say it is good, but I like to know the reasons behind an opinion.
Just curius.
Daniel

[Angélique]

Originally Posted by dreamer

....
Here's a nice picture - Dobroson 50 Rounding Cape Horn


....

Is this a real pic ?

Cheers!
Angel

Angel,

The answer is in post #68!

[Angélique]

Originally Posted by apex1

Angel,

The answer is in post #68 !

Thanks !!

Sorry folks for the rhetorical question about a point that already was made.

Before responding I should have read the whole thread instead of a quick scan for designs.

Good Luck!
Angel

[Brent Swain]

Originally Posted by dskira

I have a news for you: the self steering was invented and implemented BEFORE your parents were born.
If you don't know that please, learn.
Did you heard about BALANCING a boat with a two mast rig, or with a cutter rig (cutter rig as one mast in case you don't know that.)
By the way, try sailing a real sail boat, you will enjoy.
Don't give me the "take your medication" it is stupidly insulting from someone who has no clue about what is talking about.
Please refrain to show your ignorance. It will reflect negatively on your book sale
Daniel

I have no doubt that self steering was invented befor my grandparents were born. Slocum used his mizzen for one. Did I ever say otherwise.
While I have had my 31 sailing and balanced perfectly on a broad reach in 15 knots of wind, balancing doesn't work well with all boats, especially downwind, which ,with a little planning, will be most of your voyages. It would be foolish, and just plain bad seamanship, to not take advantage of the advances in self steering, and the sheer simplicity of it. Balancing a boat every time there is a wind shift , or chance in wind strength ,is anything but simple. Been there done that. If it were as simple as some simpletons suggest, there woulk be far fewer windvanes on cruising boats.
I thoroughly enjoy sailing my curent boat , far more than my tank tested first boat , designed by someone many consider a "Guru."
I apologise for insulting someone who has no idea what he is talking about, namely you. It was you who started with the insults. My response was appropriate. I wouldnt sell my right to respond for the price of a book. My thinking outside of "Consumer Groupthink " is what makes my book so valuable.

Originally Posted by Brent Swain

My thinking outside of "Consumer Groupthink " is what makes my book so valuable.

Do´nt underestimate the value of the btu´s it contains (a hint for cold nights).

[dskira]

Originally Posted by Brent Swain

I apologise for insulting someone who has no idea what he is talking about, namely you. It was you who started with the insults. My response was appropriate. I wouldnt sell my right to respond for the price of a book. My thinking outside of "Consumer Groupthink " is what makes my book so valuable.

Brent your apologize are very stranges. You apologize to insult a little more.
And then you start the:

It was you who started with the insults

Pathetic.
You don't know what you did. But I don't care.
What I care is boat problems solving. You have opinion which you transform on rule. This is very wrong. As a naval architect (if you are one) you should know better then this attitude is a certainty for making huge errors.
I read your answer on the plating and framing, a student naval architect or boat builder will not have made this mistake after one month of learning.
You are perhaps a good librairien, and take care of books, but what you put inside your books about boat must be questionable at best, after reading your posts.
Questioning yourself is the first step you should do when you debate on a subject.
I do it all the time, and guess what? I learn. After more than forty years I still learning, even with all the degree and experience which will make you a little kiddy.
But this is very irrelevent if you don't continue learning all the time, day after day, customer after custmer (yes you can learn a lot from customer) other professional, other people, all around. Learning is also from the forum.
Do not write books, open your mind, take the time to learn, as I do, don't be arroguant, it doesn't worth it.
It is just boat. Cool off. And learn.

Daniel

[Brent Swain]

In the last 40 years I have build over three dozen steel boats, and I have learned from every one. They have endured many torture tests, and have come out intact, and all the owners who followed the plans, were extremely happy with them. Each is a slight improvement on the previous. Otherwise I wouldn't have been able to take the building process from primitive , imitation wooden boat building methods, to hulls that are far fairer, more seaworthy and which take one tenth the man hours of the traditional methods. Boy , the trouble, expense and time I would have saved if I had the contents of my book back then! I make no apology for trying to pass on what I have learned to save others the trouble it would have saved me.
What is the biggest problem facing those who want to get out and enjoy the cruising life? The one problem that gets the least amount of effort and innovation, on this and other sites. How to reduce the tremendous amount of work , time and expense of getting good seaworthy boat together. The "Be reasonable and do it the hard way" type of thinking seems to be the prevailing train of thought on may boat building sites.
When someone tries to mislead others into believing the hard, expensive , super time consuming way is the only way , threatening to make having a good steel cruising boat the exclusive domain of the rich, do I get pissed off ?
When someone tries to pass of outdated dogma and outright ******** as the only way to think, do I get pissed off? Damned right I do.
No advancement in technology was ever accomplished by those who refused to question traditional ways of doing things, but who simply read the books, and do exactly what every one else does, and protested loudly when anyone ever suggested there may be a better way. Now that is what I call refusing to learn!
I will always challenge ******** whenever I encounter it. That is how progress is made.

[gonzo]

The sites are also full of people reinventing the wheel. They claim that an hexagon is better than the traditional round ones and that any sensible argument is people that are too obtuse to be able to change. New or different is not necessarily better. Tried and proven has a lot to recommend. Hard to build and expensive are not traditional ways. Boats were traditionally built as quick and cheaply as the current technology allowed.

[dreamer]

Originally Posted by Angélique

Thanks !!

Sorry folks for the rhetorical question about a point that already was made.

Before responding I should have read the whole thread instead of a quick scan for designs.

Good Luck!
Angel

No problem Angel, I get this a lot

[peter radclyffe]

quote, Brent, to hulls that are far fairer, more seaworthy

can you explain this ?