Building Flareline 18, would like to extend by 2 frames...

Andrew, I am so pleased with your reply. Sorry I was away for 2 days and only now were able to reply. Your reply confirms the University's conclusion. Basically only one extra frame, no more. Thanks bert

 

Bert
The power required for a planing hull displacement speeds is not orders of magnitude greater than for a 'proper' displacement hull. However, since you will need every ounce of efficiency that you can eak out of your boat, given it's intended propulsion system, it's still an imperative consideration.
Of greater importance, is that a planing hull will behave poorly at displacement speeds... no matter what your local authorities say.... you may be building an inherently unsafe boat.
As I said previously, You have received a great deal of good advice here - ALL of it is suggesting that you reconsider.....

 

Will; As you know, a man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still. No slight to Bertku is intended, it is just the way we humans are assembled.

 

Indeed - I'm just hoping that if nothing else, the sheer weight of advice that he is receiving will be sufficient to change his mind.

 

Bert he is right about the planing hull being "prone to behave poorly at displacement speeds".

Easy

 

I like to change my header at the top. No longer, "building Flairline 18, extending length by 2 frame" to "where to find the best and suitable design for a displacement hull, which can carry easy 1000 watt solar panels at the roof (10 m2) , with space for reflectors (16 m2) . Suitable for low power electrical propulsion and seaworthy. Because I love woodworking, I prefer to have it made in light plywood construction. My building "construction" site is not suitable for fibreglass. Plans must be affordable.

or

the heading could read, "how to modify Bert's plan's he has for the "Hartley 28" to suit electrical propulsion. But 28 feet is too long. Maximum 22 feet i.e. 20% smaller. I could shrink all dimensions by 20%, but unfortunately one shrinks when he or she gets older, but not by 20%, thus the berths cannot be shrunk by 20%

I bought those plans some time ago, but when we went sailing overseas last year, 5 days before flying off to Europe, my wife had an operation, and she insisted not to cancel the trip, I landed up to sail on my own. It was an impossible task, thus most of the time I only sailed with the mainsail. That was the time I changed my mind to electrical/solar/wind propulsion.

Bert

 

Yippee!! Bert, I'm so glad that we've been able to change your mind! As I've said before, the cost of new plans will soon be a distant memory when you're gliding effortlessly and silently across the bay....
Now can I suggest that you start a new thread... something along the lines of 'looking for plans for a 22' electric boat'. You'll get more replies that way.
Like many, I am quietly working on something that could be suiatble, but it's quite a way off. And sadly, I can't point you in the right direction other than to suggest that you should look for something along these lines:

http://www.aequusboats.com/

 

Thank you Will,
Yes, I dug into my library and have to admit, that you all are right. It was not so much the maximum performance at displacement speed what made my mind change, but the instability of the planing hull at low speed.


"FOR SALE A FEW BOATPLANS"

Yes Will, that website is approximately I have in mind. I believe that many future customers will go for something like that. Special if battery technology becomes more realistic for our industry, not only price, but in Kwh.

Thank you all.

 

Bert; A few years ago, Phil Bolger built and operated an electric powered boat that was similar to your general idea. That boat might be worth exploring. It was not a typical "Bolger Box" and was quite lovely to look at. Phil is gone across the bar but his asociate, Suzanne Altenberger, is still running the business I think. Google Phil Bolger and Friends

Surfing the web,I ran across a site that promises that we can make our own solar panels on the cheap. The claim is that we can find the needed materials at the local hardware store. The site is well done but of course we cannot attest to the practicality of the method. There are testimonials of course. See for yourself at www.Power-4-home.com

It seems that you may know enough about electric propulsion to see your build to fruition. A good reference book for the rest of us is: Electric Boats, The handbook of clean, quiet, boating By Douglas Little ISBN 0-07-038104-6. The book does not contain boat plans but there is very good and practical information about all the components and math of the electric layout. Also a list of suppliers for things electric. You might try to find the Electric Boat Association of America, an organization devoted to building, and using electrics. The book also has pictures and descriptions of commercially built electric boats. One of them is near the size of your prospective boat. It is the Ray Electric Explorer...Powered by eight 235 Amp 6 volt batteries. It claims to have a top speed of 7.5 MPH for a duration of eight hours.

 

Thank you Messabout,
My second computer packed up, my development computer 2 months ago, and now my Internet one. Thus I had to go out and buy a new computer and it took me ages, to load Windows7 with all the old programs I have.

I did search the web, found all the boats and references, but unfortunately not the electric boat. However, I did find a few electrical driven boats, which are indeed more apealing to the eye, then the "roof solar panel " type of boat. I will still search for more info. Thanks for the hint

Although it is not difficult to make a solar panel. There are a few snacks during building one.
a) getting the single cells in one piece at your workshop
b) it is better to use hardened 3,2 mm glass, not allways cheap to get in small volumes
c) I did connect the connections by vacuum seal method, not suitable for larger panels. You need some special tools to ensure 100% conductivity.

The rest is simple.

This website is all about selling their books, but says nothing where to get the cells at the best possible price. Like the Sharp one or the Solarex one's.
But maybe I haven't tried hard enough.

Yes, I will see whether I can get hold of that book. However, I will never use such heavy batteries . A 235 Amp - 6 Volt (+/- 1,3Kwh) will weigh approx 26 - 30 kg. I don't think my spine will survive lifting it on and off the boat. The maximum I would be willing to go for, if Lead Acid is my last resort, would be 13 Kg for a 60Amph - 12 Volt.

Thanks for the contribution.

 

Bert,
Here is a really good electric launch
www.elcoelectriclaunch.com

Easy

 

I checked into Power4home a few years ago and he is not selling anything he did, but is selling the right to read about stuff other people have done. This "introductory offer" has been going on for at least 3 years that I know of.

 

Thank you Easy. I had a look at the website. It is not completely what I like to make, I prefer on the sea to have something more firmer above my head. But it is indeed a very nice boat and a good example.

I had a good look at all the plans I have bought. To meet the criteria from all those who have convinced me to drop the planing hull, could I consider to use the hull design from the Hartley 28 and reduce all dimensions by 15%. ?????

reason :
a) Our wood is in metric dimensions and I have to cut it in anyway to the millimeter size. Whether I cut it 112 mm out of 120 mm or another size, it makes no difference. I have to cut it in anyway.
b) I will in anyway try to use lighter wood, which will compensate for a possible few percent heavier weight, due to those items which cannot be shrunk, due to the natural weight it has, toilet, fittings, etc.
c) I will have a better construction to mount the required folding up solarpanels onto.
d) Fanie will be happy, as the boat will then be 7.38 meter long.
e) I don't have to buy new plans. which I have to modify then also.
f) I will have in anyway 2 rudders, because I will have 2 motors.
I cannot afford to steer on the reducing or increasing the speed of one motor, should one motor fall out. I am a goner. I need thus 2 rudders.
g) I like woodworking.
h) The width will be 2,42 meter and thus trailable.
i) I could consider to make it 12% smaller instead of 15%.

The only problem is, that the "double bed" 2 births are thus slightly too small for my length. (1.78mtr) The length at 15% would be 1.66 meter
and at 12% , it would be 1,72. I gamble that I would possible be able to make a plan and "steal" a few centimeters from somewhere.

ARE YOU ALL SUPPORTING ME, or do I get shot down again.
Bert

 

if you cant put up a shelter outside why cant you build it in the garage ?
If you want to make it longer just respace the frames as sugested and if you are worried about strength just use 1/2 frames in the bottom only between the existing frames for 2/3 the length of the boat starting from the back !!
My dad had one those and we just made it longer by spacing the frames a little all the way along !! only added a couple of feet .

 

Hey Bert,
Nothin but support! Hey .. if they can do heart transplants ect ect I'm sure they could make you a little shorter. But seriously .. your'e the builder .. make the births a bit longer and shorten whatever. What's a "Hartley 28"?

Easy