Best reference work?

[river runner]

When I started getting interested in boat design, Skene's Elements of Yacht Design was considered the standard. It must be getting pretty dated by now. A lot of water has flowed under the bridge since that was written. What is the standard reference work now?

[sorenfdk]

Larsson & Eliasson: Principles of Yacht Design

[FAST FRED]

What ever book you chose , get a used copy of Skene's Elements of Yacht Design just to check the numbers.

Esp true if you are reading the sales blither of some "designers".

FF

[philSweet]

yes, its dated, but read it anyway. Its probably the closest thing we have to a canonical approach to the subject; and some folks here well remember when it wasn't considered dated.

[TeddyDiver]

Originally Posted by philSweet

and some folks here well remember when it wasn't considered dated.

Dated?? you kidding, right? (and I'm not taking about the Kinney's revised edition..)

[viking north]

As in any subject-no one reference book completely covers the subject- Along with Skenes, a quick cross section of my collection would include--(Modern Development in Yacht Design by David Cannell & John Leather)(Modern Boat Building by Edwin Monk)(The proper Yacht by Arthur Beiser)(Understanding Boat Design by Ted Brewer)( about 500 pages of boat magazine articles collected over the past 40 yrs.) In addition the specalist references (Rigs and Rigging by Henderson)( Sail Power by Wallace Ross)(Seaworthyness by Machaj)( Aero Hydrodynamics by Machaj) and about 20 more less technical but all with their wonderful tid bits of info. While the highly technical books are beyond my math skills I do manage to soak up the info in the verbal descriptions associated with the formulae. Not to forget, the greatest library of them all, This Forum whose resources can educate any willing to learn --- of which I am most grateful--Geo.

A Yacht is not defined by the vessel but by the care and love of her owner

[river runner]

Thanks for the feedback. I've owned a copy of Skene's (the revised edition) for quite a few years. Glad to know it is still relavent. I also have Yacht Designing and Planning by Chapelle. But I might look into purchasing one of the other suggested works. I'm too old to change careers now, but if I had a do-over, I'd be a boat designer. I think it is extremely interesting stuff.

[jehardiman]

Just remember that arrangement and hydro/aero is only the tip of the iceberg. Construction details are more than half the problem and you will need to become familiar with those also. You need to understand the advantages/disadvantages and relative costs of the desired construction method in order to design a viable vessel. Often the limits to performance and styling are buried in the limits of the selected material and budgets rather than in the physical design space.

[viking north]

Wow!!--Jehardiman--your English Language Library of expression sure surpasses mine but well said--Geo.

A yacht is not defined by the vessel but by the care and love of her owner--

[river runner]

How true, jehardinman. I'm finding that out even with my modest boat project. Starting with having to make compromises in my design so it would fit in my limited build space. And plywoods distaste for being twisted made designing the shape I wanted impossible, or at least beyond my skills with CAD.

[upchurchmr]

river runner,

Add "The Gougeon Brothers on Boat Construction" if you think plywood doesn't like to be twisted. You are of course correct - sort of. Their methods on developed plywood shows that plywood can be used to make 3D bent shapes - with distinct limits. I do think that there are distinct possiblilties to make some classic shapes with plywood, it would just take a good deal of experimentation and cleverness. I am assuming you are designing a monohull. Just don't think that CAD is necessary to design what you want. I work in the aircraft industry and there are shapes that we no longer use just because the limits of the CAD packages don't allow some things to be done quick or easy. The tools we use distinctly influence the final product - most people don't do enough/ learn enough to recognize the limits.

Marc

[DCockey]

Aero-Hydronamics and the Performance of Sailing Yachts by Fabio Fossati is a very good reference for understanding boat performance and how it relates to the design, if you have a technical background.

[DCockey]

Originally Posted by upchurchmr

river runner,
..... I work in the aircraft industry and there are shapes that we no longer use just because the limits of the CAD packages don't allow some things to be done quick or easy. The tools we use distinctly influence the final product - most people don't do enough/ learn enough to recognize the limits.

Marc

As you said it depends on the tools used, and there are many different "CAD" tools available. Automobiles have very arbitrary surfaces and are designed using "CAD" such as UG and Catia. Rhino has very similar capabilities for surfaces design. On the other hand many engineering CAD packages are very limiting in the types of surfaces which can be designed.

[upchurchmr]

DCockey,

We use Catia, a very expensive and full featured CAD package with the possibility of exquisite control of the surface, and it still influences what we design. For many of my coworkers the possibilities are so endless that not everyone can be expert in very many of them.
Most find something that works and only reluctantly adopt additional capabilities even when shown the possibilities.
20 years ago I was given the assignment of converting a hand drawn leading edge flap, and it was finally realized we could not exactly match the part as built. Eventually tooling was adjusted to match the close but not exact match in Catia, even though we had built parts for 5 years just fine.

None of this means mutch to amature designers, except, they should not assume any given CAD system is the only way to do things. Additionally, some methods of making surfaces are not particularly suited to the nice continuously flowing surfaces desirable in a boat - Nurbs are an example that allows so much control that it is easy to depart from nice smooth surfaces - not at all desirable.

Sorry for the rant, this was just suppose to be a little caution.

Marc

[FAST FRED]

For folks that prefer the Cutter config, the tome is,

Further Offshore by John H. Illingworth 1970,

Fantastic book for understanding cutters , the choices and making rig decisions.


FF