beautiful skeleton

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by messabout, Apr 1, 2011.

  1. viking north
    Joined: Dec 2010
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    Location: Newfoundland & Nova Scotia

    viking north VINLAND

    My Rowing Machine

    Hard to beat one of these. I consider this the most refined of the Grand Banks Dory style. It's "The Shelburne". (Narrow beam, schooner spoon bow) I row an average of 50 miles a week from may to nov. On other than flat calm water I can out row a kayak and not get wet to boot. I been in open ocean up to 5ft seas no problem and estimate she could handle much more. Don't like kayaks every since i seen a big shark take a seagull, was even a little leary when one sort of skirted along the dory. She's an excellent rower, with 9 ft. oars I can maintain 4.5 to 5 knots on a 5 mile course no prob.---And of course the full body workout --
     

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  2. nordvindcrew
    Joined: Sep 2006
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    Location: Marshfield massachusetts usa

    nordvindcrew Senior Member

    very nice

    look good! what are the dimensions and weight? it looks like fiberglass construction The 10' oars are kind of scary. I started with 10's (50" beam) and couldn't pull them fast enough to make any speed.
     
  3. viking north
    Joined: Dec 2010
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    Location: Newfoundland & Nova Scotia

    viking north VINLAND

    It's fiberglass, 12ft 6 in. bottom, 18ft' LOA, bottom beam is 16in. (approx 18in on the waterline)Displacement approx. 275lb. I built her a little on the heavy side could have shaved off another 50lb. but I don't like a light boat. Weight momentum and sea keeping verses lightness is always a trade off. I added a full 3in. keel to keep her runnung straight also very ample positive flotation. I want to add a small foot controlled rudder to offset uneven pulling on the oars in windy conditions.
    The bare hulls are available from a gentleman here in Bridgetown.

    P.S. the oar length should read 9ft not 10. I have corrected my post.

    A yacht is not defined by the vessel but by the care and love of her owner
     
  4. nordvindcrew
    Joined: Sep 2006
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    Location: Marshfield massachusetts usa

    nordvindcrew Senior Member

    dorys

    my new dory is 20'3" LOA, 19' on the waterline, 12" wide on bottom with 48" beam at the gunnels. It departs from dory form in having two panels per side and it is double ended. spoon bow with a very slight spoon at the stern. Weight is unknown, but is in the vicinity of 250 LBS. Right now there is no keel or skeg. We've got to row it some more to figure out what it needs. For rough going, the weight is a positive benefit. Right now it looks pretty rough because it is only 3/4 faired and not primed or painted yet. Project this weekend is to lower the thwarts 2-1/2" to get some more stability. We're rowing with 8'-8" aluminum shaft oars with a filled plastic blade. They're a bit of a mistake: not as light as you'd think, and they dig in too much. I tried the dory stroke that was in wooden boat magazine a couple of years ago. in my single skin on frame boat. it was good for .3 knots over a conventional long pull with a snap at the end
     
  5. viking north
    Joined: Dec 2010
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    Location: Newfoundland & Nova Scotia

    viking north VINLAND

    Do you have a couple of photos. I can see she would be a little tender being narrower than mine on the bottom and less flare on the sides. Mine is initally tender but stiffens up once heeled say 20deg. Leaning hard over on the gunnel I can heel her enough to take on water. The sides actually have curvature to them which adds further displacement as she heels. If I take her on the open ocean more than i have in the past I will instal foam floatation collers similar to that on a sports pal canoe.I have posted my first conversion a 20ft. Newfoundland style dory to motorsailer. It was an excellent sea boat, we had her for some 5 yrs. before i was given an offer i couldn't refuse. --
     

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  6. ancient kayaker
    Joined: Aug 2006
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    Location: Alliston, Ontario, Canada

    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    - I imagine sometimes you need the weight but not at other times. Is water ballast practical for this kind of boat?
     
  7. upchurchmr
    Joined: Feb 2011
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    Location: Ft. Worth, Tx, USA

    upchurchmr Senior Member

    Does anyone actually have instructions on how to install the Polyester fabric. Yost uses PVC, Dave Grant suggests looking at Yost's site.

    I haven't actualy found any instructions. Help. I am thinking about doing Ruth, the design from which Jeremy Harris's aluminum frame above was developed.

    Marc
     
  8. kach22i
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    Location: Michigan

    kach22i Architect

  9. ancient kayaker
    Joined: Aug 2006
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    Some info here - http://capefalconkayak.com/howtoskinakayak.html

    Also "Skin-on-Frame Boats" by Robert Morris and "Baidarka" by George Dyson
     
  10. upchurchmr
    Joined: Feb 2011
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    Location: Ft. Worth, Tx, USA

    upchurchmr Senior Member

    Terry,

    If you "dances with Turkeys" you must work with the same guys I do.

    Thanks for the sources.

    Marc

     
  11. Dave Gentry
    Joined: May 2010
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    Location: Charlottesville, Virginia

    Dave Gentry Junior Member

    Tom Yost's instructions for skinning a wooden framed kayak work just fine with either PVC or polyester. The difference is that the polyester is sewn at the stems, there is no gluing, and rubrails are added to cover the staples along the gunwales.
    If you build my Ruth design - and you won't be sorry if you do!:D - the building guide has full skinning instructions included.
    Ruth - 18'x33" 45lbs
    [​IMG]

    I recommend Dyson's 12 oz nylon for skinning your rowboat, if you want good durability. There are plenty of even heavier options, but I have found that 8oz polyester is fine for most uses, and is somewhat easier to work with.
    In any case, check out Mike Bielski's "It's a qajaq, part 2" article here: http://www.qajaqusa.org/newsletter/Masik_Summer_2009_082809.pdf
    for a good overview of skinning and coating options. It's on pg 42 or so.


    And, back to the topic of this thread, George Dyson's shop is indeed a fascinating place! It's located just off downtown, in Bellingham, WA. There are a lot of cool baidarka frames to ogle, and a wall full of great books - plus a full bar!
    He's a nice guy, too.
     
  12. upchurchmr
    Joined: Feb 2011
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    upchurchmr Senior Member

    Dave,

    Sorry for calling you Dave Grant.

    Thanks for the suggestions, I have your build directions for Ruth.

    Another question, have you ever tried to make hulls similar to a sailing catamaran? Just a closed shape of relatively narrow width? I was thinking about 16' x 6" max width with as close to semicircular section as possible in the water - double ended. I assume the closed section would allow smaller frame sizes, but might not change the stringers since they still need to resist bending between frames.

    Marc
     
  13. viking north
    Joined: Dec 2010
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    Location: Newfoundland & Nova Scotia

    viking north VINLAND

    Question- not being familiar but always a fan of the simplicity of construction of skin on frame, is this proceedure similar to that used on canvas covered aircraft where the material is pulled reasonably tight stapled and then a product called "dope" is applied to shrink and tighten the skin. a friend of mine rebuilt an aircraft using this system and i've always wanted to build a camper on my truck the same way. I do recall the doping product certainly deserved it's name from some of his worksite conversations whenever I visited to check on his progress. :)

    A yacht is not defined by the vessel but by the care and love of her owner
     
  14. Jeremy Harris
    Joined: Jun 2009
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    Location: Salisbury, UK

    Jeremy Harris Senior Member

    I'm covering mine in exactly the same way I've covered aircraft with polyester, which is quite different to the way that people seem to be skinning SOF kayaks for some reason.

    The aircraft technique is to glue the fabric to the frame using a PVC based adhesive, then heat shrink the fabric using a calibrated iron, then glue pre-cut, pinked edge, reinforcing tapes over every point where the frame contacts the fabric (on the outside), with maybe a double layer of tapes over the stem and keel. The fabric is then sealed with PVC based coatings that make it tough enough to withstand modest abrasion and also allow easy repair. By using a PVC based adhesive and coatings the skin can be easily patched neatly, as all that's needed is a bit of acetone or MEK over the damaged area to remove part of the coating, then a patch (with pinked edges to give better edge adhesion) can be bonded on, shrunk and the whole patch area re-coated.

    In my experience this system works very well, is quick and easy to do, is very tolerant of errors (a bit of acetone/MEK dissolves any bond made in error so the fabric can be pulled a bit to get out big wrinkles) and has the big advantage of only having thick fabric where it's needed, over the frame hard points. There's also no sewing required. When I get around to covering my frame next week I'll try and post some pictures showing how it's done.

    Jeremy
     

  15. viking north
    Joined: Dec 2010
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    Location: Newfoundland & Nova Scotia

    viking north VINLAND

    Jeremy, maybe I was assuming the "dope" shrunk the material, possibly it was just a sealer. Was there such a product in the old days when they used actual canvas--Just curious
     
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