Batteries and New Battery Technologies

[portacruise]

Originally Posted by Dave Gudeman

Kistinie, I've never seen a mathematical proof of O.U. so I can't comment on it.

As to the "working devices", as I'm sure you are aware, skeptics deny that there are any working devices. Of course we can't prove that there are no working devices, but we shouldn't have to prove it. It is up to the people making a positive claim to prove their side and no one has demonstrated any free-energy or over-unity device to my satisfaction or to the satisfaction of hardly any working physicists, engineers, or professional technology investors.

Look, I am a long way from a hardened scientific dogmatist. I have spent quite a bit of effort studying the history and philosophy of science and from that study I've concluded that enormous stretches of "settled" science are ill-founded. Besides that, I love science fiction and from an early age I have been conditioned to expect miraculous new scientific discoveries that will enable cheap energy, anti-gravity, faster-than-light travel, energy shields, and the other staples of SF (but not time travel, the idea of time travel is fundamentally confused).

I am willing to consider possible new sources of energy. Maybe dipping into another universe for energy or finding a way to convert matter directly into energy or something like that. But just because I'm skeptical of science, that does not mean that I'm not skeptical of anyone who claims to overthrow respected scientific theories. For a supposed invention to even be worth considering, it has to pass some basic credibility tests. For one thing the inventor is going to have to have a good foundation in modern physics or engineering because if such an invention is possible, it certainly is not simple. For another, a demonstration will have to be set up in a way to rule out obvious cheats.

I've yet to see a demonstration that passed these basic credibility tests.

The wonderful thing about science laws is that they welcome ALL challenges, forever. The laws of science must be reproducible by anyone, anywhere at any time for the described conditions. They are simple statements of fact that do not require anything else. If anyone, any time, anywhere finds a flaw or exception, then the stated law must be rejected or ammended. Any proven, existing, over unity device as described in the provided links would require rejection of the first law. So, I eagerly await to see that rejection published in reputable sources.

Porta

Porta

[kistinie]

Originally Posted by portacruise

So, I eagerly await to see that rejection published in reputable sources.

What is a reputable source ?
What about if the reputable source is not keen on doing it ?
Wait ?
For Eternity ?

[CDK]

Originally Posted by kistinie

Lance, What you talk about is a MEG or EASER.
This is also done in France, but here, the subject is quite unpopular.

I accidentally clicked on this text, didn't recognize it as a link.

The pdf-file it led to is kid's stuff, written by someone who doesn't really know what he is talking about. A collage of simple circuits with texts picked more or less randomly, probably because certain words looked or sounded impressive to the ***** who made this page. A 1th year student radio engineering knows more than this child.

It reminds me of my first radio I built in 1949 when I was 6 years old. The detector (the active part) was a potato, a piece of aluminum foil and a copper nail. About the same complexity....

[kistinie]

Originally Posted by CDK

I accidentally clicked on this text, didn't recognize it as a link.

The pdf-file it led to is kid's stuff, written by someone who doesn't really know what he is talking about.

Sorry
i will now only use visible links
It will also limit destruction of the links, involuntary of course
Edited : I did it for the last two pages, hope you like it although it now gives a less pleasant outside 'looking at' aspect. Sorry.

Originally Posted by CDK

A collage of simple circuits with texts picked more or less randomly, probably because certain words looked or sounded impressive to the ***** who made this page. A 1th year student radio engineering knows more than this child.

It reminds me of my first radio I built in 1949 when I was 6 years old. The detector (the active part) was a potato, a piece of aluminum foil and a copper nail. About the same complexity....

[SheetWise]

I think it's important to remember -- while recognizing the laws of thermodynamics -- that there are many sources of energy that recognize those laws, but are virtually untapped. All of them seem to involve either gravity or some element of solar -- but they are, for all practical purposes, unlimited sources of energy. Combining solar energy and gravity humans have developed hydroelectric energy. While this looks like it's free -- it's simply an inefficient tapping of a non-exhaustive source. The secondary sources of solar energy, such as wind, wave, and thermal, are virtually untapped.

Those who feel that "free" energy is a myth sometimes limit their thought process by focusing on what man can create instead of looking at what man can harness.

[kistinie]

Originally Posted by SheetWise

I think it's important to remember -- while recognizing the laws of thermodynamics -- that there are many sources of energy that recognize those laws, but are virtually untapped. All of them seem to involve either gravity or some element of solar -- but they are, for all practical purposes, unlimited sources of energy. Combining solar energy and gravity humans have developed hydroelectric energy. While this looks like it's free -- it's simply an inefficient tapping of a non-exhaustive source. The secondary sources of solar energy, such as wind, wave, and thermal, are virtually untapped.

Those who feel that "free" energy is a myth sometimes limit their thought process by focusing on what man can create instead of looking at what man can harness.

Yes

Thanks for this very clear explanation.

The fiels we are talking about, ZPE fields are used for a long time in fluorescent light, Discharge light, laser, NP and NPN junctions.

Now, we all see that ZPE fields, for high power devices, are not here also Tesla and others played with ZPE fields since a century.

Understand and harness others than gravity and water or solar panels or windmills high power fields under the form of ZPE must be different.

Here is what a friend of mine studying ZPE fields wrote about this aspect.

Maya is, the illusion, of matter, including the matter you are, that prevents you from reaching your spirit.

All other mystic terms used here, mostly refer to, Tibetan culture and Yoga.


Visible spectrum (space-time or Maya) is embedded in the real Source of everything containing an intermediate stage some call Zero Point Energy (ZPE). There are many pathways to interconnect ZPE field but pathworking such ways are usually practiced by mystic (i.e. shaman, yogi, healer,..) since you need bio-energy sensitivity to perceive beyond space-time (human is a scalar wave receiver, converter, transmitter). Tesla engineering provides means to open a gate into space-time as a yogi while meditating or shaman while trancing.

What i'm try to say here: the ultimate Overunity machine (OU) is our own body-mind-energy matrix trying to self-realize so in the long run, there is no engineering OU machine to build but only reactivate our own real nature.

Of course to reach illumination, we need a system, a method, a map which is why we have lineages such as yoga, tantra, chaman, reiki, sufi, kabbalah, gnostic,...

From an engineer point of view, being able to design and have work an OU requires deep inner work before. Otherwise you can wound yourself real fast because the OU machine will act as a Shaktipat (high level of scalar waves around the machine). Such OU machine can be more brutal in the local density of karma being detoxed in a short time as opposed to receiving shaktipat from say a authentic guru who knows how to monitor the process with his heart. This poses the real engineering problem of designing, using and who is supposed to used an OU machine them in our society.

Build a machine (i.e. scalar coil with frequency generator) that generates scalar waves in this plane of existence so this is equivalent to consciously be near a machine who opens a gate, a link through space-time continum (i.e. time-travel)

The user of the machine or the machine itself are required to be able to:
- send ZPE blocked in this plane of existence through the gate hence towards say Aether or Mystery
- pump ZPE from Aether into this plane via the gate
- ON-OFF function controlled by thoughts

An OU machine should generate more power energy in this plane that what it uses in this plane to run.

At some point, the OU machine might blow physically or you can badly wound yourself due to a reaction chain, for example this scenario:
- power & start the OU machine with non-ZPE energy in this plane (i.e. 9VDC battery, 220VAC,...)
- once you start to pump ZPE from other planes, disconnect energy in this plane and use some of this ZPE to self-power the machine
- put a load to use ZPE (i.e. car, home appliance,...) but what should be done about excess of ZPE floating in this plane that might blow up the physical OU machine or deepley affect the aura of humans around the machine (i.e. car's passanger with no experience on energy work)
- need to control the machine so it regulates, probably by recycling excess ZPE towards Aether

In other words, we're talking of automatism controls laws involving mental intent and physical elements working simultaneously between this plane and other planes.


CDK is perfectly right to underline the technical simplicity of ZPE devices.

Physics and electronic involved in High power ZPE devices, is not the difficult aspect of ZPE power devices.

[BertKu]

Everybody needs a solarpanel or a set of panels. Whether it is for our home or boat. Why don't we help each other and start building ourselves some panels and see how we can optimise our backyard production. Lets exchange our experiences. I have the following points to be cleared.
a) where do we buy solarcells. >>>> here >>>> http://www.quadmodsusa.com/solarcells.html
b) what is the best way to make the interconnections. My way is not suitable for larger panels, thus lets discuss what is the best method.
c) what do you pay for ONE square meter in your country for 3,2 mm hardened glass. One could go for perspex, but I am worried about the 20 years warranty we have to promise ourselves.
d) we need to put some layers of "?????" between the glass, cell, and bottom. What should that be?

Shall we go for it??? Bert

[CDK]

Bert, how about starting a new thread for photovoltaics? This one is cluttered up with unrelated items.

[BertKu]

Originally Posted by CDK

Bert, how about starting a new thread for photovoltaics? This one is cluttered up with unrelated items.

Yes we can so.

[capt vimes]

http://www3.imperial.ac.uk/newsandev...-2010-10-26-39

what they found is a carbonfibre polymere-resin based fabric which has characteristics of an capacitor but holds energy better and longer than todays batteries...
and now comes the best part:
it has all the characteristics of a carbonfibre-resin composite...

build a hull with that stuff and the hull is the battery!
sounds promising - eh?

[CDK]

A very interesting and original idea.
I resent the word battery because that is not what it is: for some reason the article avoids the word capacitor.

Bear in mind that this is only an article about a mechanically strong capacitor material. To determine usefulness, we must know the capacity per surface unit and the dielectric strength. All technical and mechanical issues from other capacitor storage systems, like the current carrying grid, the danger of a short circuit and the charge dependent voltage remain unchanged.

[BertKu]

Originally Posted by capt vimes

[url]build a hull with that stuff and the hull is the battery!
sounds promising - eh?

Indeed interesting, I assume that somehow you will have to insolate this from the seawater and from your internal metals and also the internal walls has to be insulated, like a sandwich. But a "capacitor hull", would be quite some energy holder.

Give it 5 - 10 years and it will probably on the market at a high price.
What is happening to the "solar paint" ? You paint your roof and it becomes a solarpanel.

[capt vimes]

i know that the article did not go in detail about technical issues - its usefullness, capacity, voltage, charge- discharge-rates and all that suff is yet to be determined...
but what is mentioned that it is not working with a chemical reaction like batteries do... hence my interpretation that it is working more like an capacitor (although also not mentioned)...

if this is going into production all the other problems like insulation and application will becoming an issue - sure...

i was just very facinated because last year i tinkered with the idea of building an electric motorbike focused on racing only and my thoughts were going somewhat on the same lines...
a capacitor is nothing but 2 very thin layers of some material seperated by a membran and some electrolyte in between... the capacity is almost only determined by the surface of this layers...
now - a motorbike has a rather big area of fairing all around and why should you not be able to apply the capacitor layers onto the fairing on the inside?
you could easily insulate the whole thing with insulating laquer... and now they come up with a material that has both characteristics:
strong and stiff and holds electrical energy...
fantastic!

[BertKu]

Originally Posted by capt vimes

if this is going into production all the other problems like insulation and application will becoming an issue - sure...

I love to see it in production, it would be a major advantage for many industries.

i was just very facinated because last year i tinkered with the idea of building an electric motorbike focused on racing only and my thoughts were going somewhat on the same lines...
a capacitor is nothing but 2 very thin layers of some material seperated by a membran and some electrolyte in between... the capacity is almost only determined by the surface of this layers...

Yes and the thickness of the di-electric

now - a motorbike has a rather big area of fairing all around and why should you not be able to apply the capacitor layers onto the fairing on the inside?
you could easily insulate the whole thing with insulating laquer... and now they come up with a material that has both characteristics:
strong and stiff and holds electrical energy...
fantastic!

Lets keep on dreaming, why not. Keeps us getting 100.

[CDK]

Originally Posted by capt vimes

a capacitor is nothing but 2 very thin layers of some material seperated by a membran and some electrolyte in between... the capacity is almost only determined by the surface of this layers...

Almost correct. Just two conductors and an isolator in between. Capacity is a function of surface area and the distance between the conductors.

The isolator or dielectric may be air, ceramic, plastic, glass or even an oxide layer. Only if the conductors are rough to obtain more surface, a conducting liquid or paste must be added.