Adapting any jet engine to propeller drive

[RatliffFranklin]

Back in 1960, Porsche engineer Leopold Schmid proposed a land speed car which would use a paddlewheel placed in the exhaust of a jet engine to drive the rear wheels through spur gears. This same concept could be used in boats as a simple compact method for adapting almost any jet engine to driving propellers.

[kach22i]

It was a gimick to get around the rules, no engineering sense to it other than that.

http://www.grandprixmodels.co.uk/fsw...03/reviews.php

Two very different LSR contenders that sadly never made it beyond the drawing board and scale model stage.

Leopold Schmid’s design shows a novel approach to the rule book by diverting 40% of the thrust from the jet engine to a paddle wheel which, in turn transferred drive to the rear wheels, making the machine eligible for the wheel driven record. The project was apparently scuppered by engine manufacturer Bristol, who declined to supply their Orpheus engine in order to protect British LSR attempts.

http://www.sportscars.tv/Newfiles/recordatt.html

In the postwar era, Porsche held the patent on a radical design produced by Leopold Schmid (the same engineer who invented Porsche's widely used synchromesh) . This Buck Rogers-ish creation was designed around a British Bristol "Orpheus" turbine engine, which lay in a bullet-shaped fairing between twin outboard hulls carrying fancy, self-suspending wheels. In spite of the fact that this car represented one of the few highly scientific and rational designs ever formulated for the record, Porsche felt incapable of undertaking such an elaborate and expensive project. Attempts by Carlo Abarth and Pininfarina to negotiate an agreement whereby they would build and run the machine on their own failed. All that came of the project was a detailed scale model.

You are full of suprises, thanks for the ride.

[RatliffFranklin]

"In spite of the fact that this car represented one of the few highly scientific and rational designs ever formulated for the record..."

Whoever said that was a moron. Highly scientific and engineered designs have been the rule for the absolute record rather than the exception.

[kach22i]

I think that comment/quote was made in reference to getting around the rules.

I can look at F1 cars and tell you they are not the best way to go fast around the track, but the rules limit how far down the front wing can go and how large the rear wing is. Form does not follow function, form follows the rules.

Another example:
http://www.core77.com/blog/materials/default.asp?p=3

Oscar Pistorius, recently took his first second place against able-bodied athletes and now stands a chance of Olympic eligibility.

If the rules allow it..................go for it.

[RatliffFranklin]

Originally Posted by kach22i

It was a gimick to get around the rules, no engineering sense to it other than that.

http://www.grandprixmodels.co.uk/fsw...03/reviews.php



http://www.sportscars.tv/Newfiles/recordatt.html


You are full of suprises, thanks for the ride.

The story published at the time was negotiations with Pininfarina broke down when they refused to identify Schmid as a Porsche engineer.

At the time Schmid designed the car, it was either wheel-driven or nothing. The FIA had no category for jet/rocket cars. To this day, the FIA has never ruled on the percentage of residual thrust allowed in a wheel-driven car.

Schmid's design allowed energy to be recovered from the jet exhaust and converted into shaft horsepower without a heavy and complex gearbox. The estimated weight for Schmid's whole car was only 1,500 lbs more than just the ENGINE in Campbell's turbine streamliner.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by RatliffFranklin

At the time Schmid designed the car, it was either wheel-driven or nothing.

There you go.

It's a niffty idea, but a gas turbine such as used on helicopters, hovercraft and fast attack boats would be straight foreword.

[RatliffFranklin]

Originally Posted by kach22i

I think that comment/quote was made in reference to getting around the rules.

I can look at F1 cars and tell you they are not the best way to go fast around the track, but the rules limit how far down the front wing can go and how large the rear wing is. Form does not follow function, form follows the rules.

Another example:
http://www.core77.com/blog/materials/default.asp?p=3



If the rules allow it..................go for it.

In land speed racing the only basis for legitimate rules is establishing a baseline to measure progress through performance. When the rules no longer allow for innovation or new technology, they cease to be legitimate.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by RatliffFranklin

In land speed racing the only basis for legitimate rules is establishing a baseline to measure progress through performance. When the rules no longer allow for innovation or new technology, they cease to be legitimate.

I agree with you, but the rule makers throughout history have not. In the early 1900's Porsche would have rulled the roads with 4WD electric hub racers, and Indy would have only 4WD turbine powered racers.

There are great quotes about racing rules, something to the effect of homogenized mediocrity and a level playing field.

Diesels in racing............there, now we have a little innovation, but they had to bend quite a few rules to make it possible.

[RatliffFranklin]

Originally Posted by kach22i

There you go.

It's a niffty idea, but a gas turbine such as used on helicopters, hovercraft and fast attack boats would be straight foreword.

If somebody is looking for big horsepower in a big boat it's a different story.

[RatliffFranklin]

Originally Posted by kach22i

I agree with you, but the rule makers throughout history have not. In the early 1900's Porsche would have rulled the roads with 4WD electric hub racers, and Indy would have only 4WD turbine powered racers.

There are great quotes about racing rules, something to the effect of homogenized mediocrity and a level playing field.

Diesels in racing............there, now we have a little innovation, but they had to bend quite a few rules to make it possible.

With the introduction of jet and rocket cars, it was the FIA that was forced to change, not the racers.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by RatliffFranklin

With the introduction of jet and rocket cars, it was the FIA that was forced to change, not the racers.

I'm sure it was.

Makes me think also of professional fishing tournaments, no live bait, artificial lures only!

Then there is common sense or lack of it.
http://www.portlandart.net/archives/news/index.html

[RatliffFranklin]

Originally Posted by kach22i

I agree with you, but the rule makers throughout history have not. In the early 1900's Porsche would have rulled the roads with 4WD electric hub racers, and Indy would have only 4WD turbine powered racers.

There are great quotes about racing rules, something to the effect of homogenized mediocrity and a level playing field.

Diesels in racing............there, now we have a little innovation, but they had to bend quite a few rules to make it possible.

At first I had some hope for F1 when I read they were writing new rules to introduce kinetic energy recovery systems, but then I found out the powers that be were continuing their pasteurized homogenized cookie cutter clone mentality so it's going to be the same old BS just with different technology. The KERS units themselves are neat, though.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by RatliffFranklin

F1 ...........kinetic energy recovery systems, ............The KERS units themselves are neat, though.

I'm not familiar with it, found this pdf, says 2010.

http://www.paddocktalk.com/news/html..._Framework.pdf

Here is an article with pictures.
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/m...in-f1-by-2009/

Torotrak and Xtrac transmission expertise will help F1 teams develop new, highly efficient, mechanical kinetic energy recovery systems … technology also applicable to road cars

[RatliffFranklin]

Originally Posted by kach22i

I'm not familiar with it, found this pdf, says 2010.

http://www.paddocktalk.com/news/html..._Framework.pdf

The KERS as developed for F1 weighs under 50 lbs but stores up to 80 horsepower, using a carbon fiber wound flywheel turning 80,000 rpm in a vacuum.

[kach22i]

For the Rat.

http://www.toy-gulf.com/products.asp?sid=4


(UK) Item number: 270209515222
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