Building my first wooden boat

[mittoo]

Hi,
Have decided to build my first wooden runabout. I have access to teak wood here in India. Can i use teak to build the boat. I was thinking of planking with epoxy. What epoxy can be used successfully to bond teak frames?
Thanks,
Mittoo

[gonzo]

You need to degrease the surface with acetone or other harsh solvent. Any of the major brands: WEST, System 3, etc, will work.

[PAR]

Teak has a unique set of oils and acetone is a little too quick to be totally effective for proper epoxy encapsulation. Use a 70/30 mix of isopropyl alcohol and acetone, which will stay on the teak long enough to dissolve the oils in teak. Straight acetone will flash before the job is done.

[gonzo]

In Florida the acetone may be a bit fast.

[PAR]

It's a fast evaporation rate everywhere Gonzo, probably the fastest of all the common solvents.

[hoytedow]

And Goa, India is a very warm place anyhow.

[gonzo]

I know it is fast, but have never had any problems. The Geugon Brothers are using 95%alcohol with good results, but it takes longer to evaporate. I can see a mix work well.

[mittoo]

Thanks for the advice,
What about dried teak. And how long will the solvent have to remain.
I'm actually here in GOA. summer temperatures are between 28deg C to 38 deg C.
Thanks once again.

[mittoo]

HI Everybody,
Have finally decided to go in for Wild Jack Framing with teak or Mahogany Planking.
Twin screw, Two Volvo Penta Engines in the 75HP Range.
Was Thinking of using 3M-5200 marine Adhesive for the project, for building up the frames & planking.
Any body knows of a suitable 3M clear epoxy that I could use as 3M products are the ones that I can easily lay my hands on.
Thanks..

[gonzo]

5200 is a flexible adhesive. It may not be the best material, unless you also use fasteners. If you are using epoxy for sealing, using it for gluing too is the best. Mixing systems is almost always a disaster.

[PAR]

3M-5200 is a SEALANT, that happens to have good adhesive qualities. It cures fairly rigid compared to most sealants, though has a very wide range of flexibility.

Mittoo, follow the plans and standard building practices. If you elect to use epoxy as a coating, then you have to encapsulate fully, there are no short cuts to this decision.

Do yourself a favor and log onto westsystem.com and systemthree.com and download their user's guides. These will explaine the products and techniques for all epoxy use.

#m does market the old Scotch products under their name now. They have the 460, 920 and 1838 series of epoxies, but I'm not that familiar with their epoxy line. They're more know for their pre-mixed lines and specialty filler lines, which are less suited for marine applications. If you can get 3M products, you should be able to get West System and System Three products too.

[mittoo]

Thanks Gonzo & PAR.
Will revert with pics once I get things moving.
Thanks Again,
Mittoo

[viking north]

Question? How wise is it for a beginner to use epoxy as a laminating glue with teak. Recently there has been much speculation about even using it to laminate white oak. I'm not saying it's impossible but it does require alot of care and attention, epoxy and acetone are not exactly human friendly products if not handled properly,especially acetone. This was a big debate over on the other popular forum not so long ago and the drift i got was there were superior and safer products out there. I know Mittoo specifically asked about epoxy but that could be lack of info on other products. Just throwing it into the mix. I personally have not used anything but epoxy to glue up teak but have used other marine glues on white oak with excellent results. ---Geo

A yacht is not defined by the vessel but by the care and love of her owner

[PAR]

This debate is over, except for the throw backs that can't let go of information they absorbed years ago. My and others comments in the last decade, West System and other formulator testing in the last decade, all have proven that the "myths" of white oak and other oily woods, not bonding well are just lousy surface prep and not a function of the adhesive/substrate interface.

Epoxy isn't that difficult to work with, nor that hazardous, especially for the back yard repair person or hobbyist, if you follow the commonly listed precautions by all the formulators. Assuming your not eating it, rubbing it in your eyes and ears, bathing with it or other wise not following reasonable and usually recommend procedures, you're not going to have issue with it. Now long term exposure for those that work with it daily or nearly so, well this is a different animal and involves cumulative absorption, and special precautions should be taken so that contact is greatly minimized. This of course isn't the same thing as someone looking to glue some planks. This is for those like me who are working with it daily, year after year.

Anyone still working these "debates" just isn't keeping up on the long term trials and current testing results, not to mention the different formulations available, particularly recently.

Wash out the oils with a solvent bath, then apply the epoxy as soon as it flashes off.

[viking north]

It was an open forum question from the poster, by posing the question he is now made more aware of the importance of prep. work and safety. It is not necessary to refer to others me included as throwbacks professing myths of the past.We have the right to express our points of view without insults in return. A more diplomatic, courtious answer might have been, those concerns were well founded at one time but new formulations and better prep work have corrected the problems. Your response on the toxicity of epoxy and acetone while reasonable re exposure is also condecending in nature re eating it, bathing in it and so on, PAR i know from your past posts you are are knowledgeable craftsman but you have to realize others have questions and opinions also and hopefully we can be encouraged to learn without fear of someone trying to make a fool of them. I'm sorry but thats as gentle as i can put it being on the receiving end.---- Geo.