car topper rowboat advice

[fish_head_soup]

hi all. i am looking for a design of a very easy to build lightweight rowboat. mostly to carry down to the water and fish out of. being an efficient hull is not so much of a priority. perhaps stability is, it will be used in very sheltered ocean, mostly bays. not too too heavy as it has to either go on the roof of my honda oddesey or inside the back at times.

ease of build is important as i am not handy. i have most of the basic tools. i was thinking a dory style or curraugh? double open sit-in kayak?

any thoughts?

[alan white]

The Gloucester Light Dory by Philip bolger is a light boat if built in the lighter version. Also check out the Cartopper by the same designer.
Double kayaks are great until you are alone. A rowboat will usually allow center seating for one or a way to row with two or three aboard.

[messabout]

Alan has given two very good suggestions. For an even easier build, google the PD Racer. You can also find it at the Duckworks site. Plans are free and I think that there is a NZ firm that furnishes kits. The PDR is mainly designed as a sail boat but it would work very well with oars or a very small engine or trolling motor. It is ugly personified but it is a proven design that has many owners who are quite happy with it.

[fish_head_soup]

thanks guys. i reckon that pdracer might be a bit of me messabout, cheers. just ugly enough to hide my lack of skills!

[yipster]

thoughts? fold and blow ups are easy'r to handle in or on a car
as for skills, Glen-L has plans on a simple fold up
cartops: http://dngoodchild.com/divide_for_small_craft.htm

[AnalogKid]

This might just be car-toppable, and it keeps it all in NZ.

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/fishhook/index.htm

John Welsford offers plenty of support, as does the builders group on Yahoo.

There's also a design of his called Roof Rack available through Duckworks:

http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jw/roofrack/index.htm

[fish_head_soup]

analogkid, just got rid of my copy of john's book and i think it had plans for the fishhook in it? a good example of a "DOH!" moment!

tipster, i've been looking at some used inflatables and if it works out cheaper i'll buy before building as time is something i have little of these days. thats why the pdracer sounded good to me.

[SamSam]

thoughts? fold and blow ups are easy'r to handle in or on a car
as for skills, Glen-L has plans on a simple fold up
cartops: http://dngoodchild.com/divide_for_small_craft.htmThat's an excellent site! Pre mass manufactured boating . Do you know of any more like that? Here's one from Google Books...

http://books.google.com/books?q=editions:0ZCBCmMrMAo-HFv4sK&lr=&id=CPo6AAAAMAAJ&sa=N&start=0

[hoytedow]

Once you have the boat, you still have to haul it. Rack or pads? Options.: http://www.canoecampfish.com/canoe-carriers.htm

[peterAustralia]

hi

You have mentioned PD Racer and have metnioned a dory. Hmm. You want a small cartoppable rowboat that is reasonably stable. The RD Racer is boat designed for sailing, not rowing.

I have a dory, they are good seaboats, but maybe too long to cartop with as much esae as a smaller boat. Try and keep your boat light, 30kg might be doable with some luck.

My suggestion is s simple rowing skiff, maybe 12ft long. If you are going in reasoably protected areas, you probably dont really need the extra sea worthiness that the dory provides.

my suggestion is something like this, but a bit shorter. These are my lines, but use the web and look for a similar looking boat, about 11ft to 12ft long

http://www.tacking-outrigger.com/rowboat_13.html

some links here
http://www.tacking-outrigger.com/links.html

and mroe links here
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/r/plansindex.htm

[fish_head_soup]

hoytedow, my wagon has roof rails on it, i'll be fabricating some way of holding the boat on to it. some good info on that link cheers.

peter, you've raised some very good points. when i think about a suitable boat i have a very strong tendancy to get sidetracked. i have recently sold my boat, a short wide polyethylene fishing boat. i simply need something to get me out on the water. last month i took the family away to the beach and there was a 9 foot dinghy there and i took my two boys out for a fish 150 meters from shore and realized how little i could get by with.

it has to be able to be carried on the roof as the nearest boat ramp is a nightmare unless you get there before 5am. also there are lots of very good fishing bays within a short drive but they don't have a ramp. i am pretty sure i have found what i need....http://www.birchcanoes.com/......i have the plans downloaded and will ask my father in law to help me build it over the winter with my boys. he's made four sailboats now so i'm confident we can pull this off.

i'd like a larger boat again one day and if this goes well will hopefully build again.

[Tiny Turnip]

Have a look at the excellent 'Hannu's boatyard'. He has theory, cutting patterns and full instructions on line, all free, and prides himself on simplicity. His favoured method of jointing seems to be taped joints but using temporary blocks and screws instead of copper wire stitching.

Hannu's boatyard:
http://koti.kapsi.fi/hvartial/#XX15

Here is one of his simplest boats
http://koti.kapsi.fi/hvartial/dinghy1/simboii.htm

[thedutchtouch]

Hannu's plans are great, i used them mainly when designing my own boat. be wary as a first time builder- weight can creep up if you don't keep an eye on it. i used junk wood, a heavy hand with my fillets/epoxy, and a bit too much bracing, and my boat turned out about 135 lbs rather than the planned 95. :rolleyes: still cartoppable, but a good reason to build a second one.

[ancient kayaker]

hoytedow, my wagon has roof rails on it, i'll be fabricating some way of holding the boat on to it. some good info on that link ...

Hoyt's link is useful especially for a canoe or kayak. I also use the pads shown in that link, I find they will sit on the roof rack cross rails without budging. I hold the boat on with just 2 cross-straps which have never let go, but I run a cord to the front of the car to stop the boat rolling off into traffic just in case. It is visible through the windshield so I get a warning if the front of the boat is shifting, and a small flag at the rear does the same - it is visible through the back window. I don't like using bow/stern tie-downs on relatively flimsy canoes, too much strain.

A larger boat like a dinghy needs something more substantial to rest on. I use the same tie-down and tell-tale scheme for mine, but I put a pair of 2 x 4's across the rails of the roof rack first to provide a firmer surface.

I made a clamping arrangement with wingnuts just to hold the 2 x 4's in place on the rack while I put the boat up, but they do not hold the boat! The straps run from side rail to side rail over the boat so they hold the 2 x 4's down as well as the boat when I am travelling.

For carrying kayaks, I have slots cut in the 2 x 4's which engage in the cockpit coaming; that allows me to carry the kayaks upside-down without shifting or rolling under the straps.

[portacruise]

For stability and lightness, I would go with an inflatable pontoon style. http://www.seaeagle.com/FramelessPontoonBoats.aspx I don't particularly like this company, but there are others that make larger or smaller versions that are still car toppable. http://www.boatstogo.com/inflatable_fishing_kayaks.asp Solid versions can be built that are only slightly heavier. The advantages are very easy launch, no scratch PVC car top material, easy mount/dismount- can just walk into or stand up in shallow water without having to balance and move around to shove off. Some designs are the most comfortable boats that will allow you to sit for hours, almost like in an easy chair for relaxing. Also track well and require very little effort to power. JMHO.

Porta


hi all. i am looking for a design of a very easy to build lightweight rowboat. mostly to carry down to the water and fish out of. being an efficient hull is not so much of a priority. perhaps stability is, it will be used in very sheltered ocean, mostly bays. not too too heavy as it has to either go on the roof of my honda oddesey or inside the back at times.

ease of build is important as i am not handy. i have most of the basic tools. i was thinking a dory style or curraugh? double open sit-in kayak?

any thoughts?

[ancient kayaker]

FHS, are you still looking for a design to build, or is it already under way or even in the water? If you are still looking for ideas I’ll post a few thoughts of my own to add to the mix.

Purpose: primary purpose is fishing; this is a time-consuming activity so it implies comfort. You’ll want extra stability for safety, casting and retrieving the catch over the side. You will want primary stability, which shows up as soon as the boat starts to heel.

Shape: a rowboat is designed to be move well under limited power. The hull is long and well rounded to reduce wetted area and wave drag at speed, which does not make for a lot of stability but that is not a problem under way as the oars have a stabilizing effect. Such a boat will feel unstable if you want to move around, however.

Weight: a stable boat that is really light will feel unstable when you stand, no matter what shape, as it tends to move from under your feet like standing on a skateboard. I have one, I know from experience.

Capacity: you mentioned a double kayak but that would mean spending all your time in the boat sitting down. Something else I know from experience, that can soon become uncomfortable. Do you want double occupancy?

Simple construction: the simpler type of rowboat such as a dory or skiff will try to achieve a rounded minimum wetted area shape in 3 planks, by having a narrow bottom with sheers well flared for a comfortable width for rowing without using outriggers. That creates a lot of stability, but it is secondary, and will appear only when the boat is heeled: when level the boat will still feel tippy. This is a nice thing to have in a heavy sea and I design my canoes like that so the waves a passing powerboat will pass under the boat without throwing it around. But it’s not a good fishing boat.

So your requirements of an easy row, easy build, lots of stability, comfort, capacity and lightweight are conflicting. A compromise is called for in this situation. If you follow the designs in Yipster’s link that are listed as suitable for fishing, you will find flat-bottomed boats with plenty of bottom width and relatively upright sheers, for stability.

Back to my own experience: my flat-bottomed sailing skiff is similar to the ones in AnalogKid’s links. It was originally designed as a rowing tender for a small yacht so it has heaps of primary stability for that all-important transfer between tender and yacht; it is 10' long, 4-1/2' beam which is carried down to a bottom almost 4' wide, so there’s not much flare in the sheers, and was very easy to build.It came out at 60 lb, using 4 mm sides and 6 mm bottom plank, marine ply. It rows very easily, not very fast but effortless. It will carry 2 but is a bit small for 2 to fish from IMHO.

I still have the problem of a lightweight boat wanting to go the opposite way when I move around. Sideways is not the problem because the hard chines bite into the water, it's fore-and-aft that's the trouble. Something to hang down in the water to damp the motion might help.

I would agree with Peter that a simple rowing skiff would meet your needs best, and his suggestion of 12' length is spot on. Much longer and it will be a problem to cartop. You could go for a wider boat than mine but that one cartops very nicely; if it had been much wider it might be harder to get the cross straps to hold it properly.

A word on the PDR. I looked at it long and hard for a while back then. I doubt it is as easy to row as my little boat. It’s main advantage would be the ability to store upright in a regular height room. Ultimately I decided I wanted a real boat. BTW, I got the plans from PAR.

Well, I’ve run out of ideas: imagine that! Good luck whatever you decide.