bouyancy certificate

[colfar5033]

Morning all

Wonder if anyone can shed some light on my question? what is a bouyancy
certificate and does a yacht need to have one or is it just for speed boats?
i stay in south africa and also wonder what is the norm in the rest of the
world!

cheers colin

[Wynand N]

Goeie middag Colin.

According to SAS all sailing dinghy's should have a buoyancy certificate.
SAMSA Marine Notice 13 - 9.2 (note 4) on the other hand states that sailing vessels over 7 meter in length are exempted from buoyancy and must have life rings (1 per two persons) in lieu of buoyancy....

A buoyancy certificate is a piece of paper (with colour photos of the boat attached/printed on) that must comply to the guidelines of SAMSA and I actually uses the SAMSA template for certificates I issue. On boats that are mainly used inland on rivers and lakes, the category is "R" and must be fitted with 30% buoyancy based on the maximum loaded condition of the boat. Boat going to sea - Category E, D, C etc must have 60% buoyancy fitted as with the Cat R but with people included in gross weight.

When appointing someone to install buoyancy, make sure of his credentials (I recently removed 28 x 2 liter bottles from a "Cat C" boat and reinstalled 870 liter foam to have the figures added up!! and the boat had a buoyancy certificate...) and make sure that he is BIASA registered and the logo and his accredited membership number is also stated/displayed on the certificate.
In fact, some insurance companies in Gauteng already insist on BIASA certificates for insurance due to some incompetent persons fitting substandard buoyancy in the past, and I believe this will eventually spread all over the country.

[Manie B]

Hello Wynand, while we are on this subject and seeing that you are registered to do this kind of work and issue certificates, i would also like to know a bit more. I am sure our other readers will also benefit, even if this is for South Africa.

Firstly what is BIASA certificates

Secondly, please explain the different catagories ( E D C etc ) for our waters

my main interest is small sailing vessels say 5m to 9m for offshore sailing, with bouyancy requirements, the main focus here is to be able to comply for Durban and to be able to do coastal sailing - Richards bay - EL - Maputo.
Point is there are NO SAFE harbours in between, nowhere to hide, once you are out, you are committed, sink or swim !

My hull is going together now and freeship gives me 500 kg displ, does that mean that i have to have 60% bouyancy = 300 litres? I want safe unsinkability because i would rather not have a life raft.

I was going to take this up with you anyway but seeing that Colin has brought the matter up we might as well learn more now, and plan it into the build now.

[Wynand N]

Firstly what is BIASA certificates

Perhaps I was a bit unclear. Certificates issued by BIASA members are commonly refer to as BIASA certificates, but there is no such thing. Preferably a certificate must have the BIASA logo and membership number clearly visible to avoid future hassles as the buoyancy issues are about to be sorted out soon by BIASA to get rid of the fly by night type out to rip boaters off for monetary gains.
I attach a copy of buoyancy certificates I issue (foam placement get drawn onto the simple drawings with red pen) - the two pages a placed back to back and then laminated in plastic to prevent tampering. For obvious reasons I made all the numbers in my BIASA membership as zeros.
BIASA = Boating Industry Association Of South Africa.

BTW, my company only fits close cell expanded polyurethane foam - bottles and other stuff is a no go with me.

Secondly, please explain the different categories ( E D C etc ) for our waters

Category R = Restricted to inland lakes, rivers, and within the confines of a port or lagoon/estuary

Category E = vessels not operating more than 1 nautical mile from shore

Category D = vessels operating more than 1 nautical mile but not more than 5 nautical miles from shore

Category C = vessels operating more than 5 nautical miles but not more than 15 nautical miles from shore

Category B = vessels operating more than 15 nautical miles but not more than 40 nautical miles from shore

Category A = vessels operating more than 40 nautical miles from shore

Category R calls for 30% positive flotation based on max displacement loaded excluding crew - all other categories calls for 60% positive flotation based on max displacement INCLUDING crew.

[Manie B]

Thanks, now what are the latest / current requirements for Cat A small sailing vessels of Durban, or where can i download from. Taking it now that the boat will have 60% bouyancy. There seems to be confusion this side, and i woulld like to be up to date. eg. radio (vhf?), flares, lifejackets?? running lights?? anchors, fire extinguisher, mob marker, engine, fog horn?? compass, first aid kit?????

The laws have changed and are been rewritten so it would be nice to know what is current, because some of these things haven't changed that much either, its just that when some small things change there is always unnessecary resistence from the public at large, mostly it is actually updates that is seen as change.

Thanks sport ;)

My werk in Warden is klaar en ek hoop om Bloem toe te gaan, dan val ek in by jou :D

[Fanie]

Hello Colin,

The first thing you have to do for YOURSELF is to be happy that your boat cannot sink. It is worth it to go the extra mile for this piece of mind, you never know what situation you can land in and you know how reliable the weather forecast is. Imo, doesn't matter what category or type of boat you have, make it permanent booyancy. I've been in such a situation (before SAMSA and their crap came along) and I vowed never again without booyancy.

Boats are friggin expensive, the little you are going to spend to give it positive booyancy is worth protecting the investment.

I use only Sondor's XPS33 foam for this, they offer a certificate for booyancy for it, there is no other foam that can claim that that I am aware of. Beware of the two part mix that foams from AMT - all the so called booyancy fixers use it, it is an insulation foam and not a booyancy foam and does absorb water. The only way to use this pour foam is when you seal it very well in a solid form, by pouring it into the boat does not do it. You can just as well seal polistirene and use that. A few years froim now there are going to be a bunch of very PO people with very heavy and very unsafe boats, and SAMSA making the rules up as they go is just going to pull their shoulders up and say they just make the laws.

The SPX33 bonds well to polyester resin and epoxy resin (Manie confirmed that), so you can glass it in place.

We had so much crap up here in Gautengelengelengelengeleng with the booyancy issue and surveyors that is not informed that we go to a police station and make a declaration (avidavid) wrt the booyancy, this you send to SAMSA and you can give a copy to the surveyor.

Since your rig is your responsibility in any case, this just means you declare you accept the responsibility for it, and as long as you pay SAMSA and the surveyor they are happy.

Also, don't just dunk a stack of foam in the boat, plan it a bit so you get proper balance...

[Manie B]

Wynand just another question

in a case like Colin and myself that are building in marine ply
can the volume of the wood and ply encased in epoxy also qualify as bouyancy as a part of the 60% the other being polyurethane

might be a tricky question for our "authorities" that can't swim ;)

[Fanie]

Hi Manie,
There is no such thing as a Cat A small sailing vessels :D A cat A vessel is one that can cross oceans and can be self sustained for a prolonged duration of time. Read the maritime notices.

Taking it now that the boat will have 60% bouyancy. There seems to be confusion this side, and i woulld like to be up to date. eg. radio (vhf?), flares, lifejackets?? running lights?? anchors, fire extinguisher, mob marker, engine, fog horn?? compass, first aid kit?????

The laws change here all the time, you cannot buy a legal life jacket currently as in the meritime notices, remember what I told you the other night :D For local sailing you will need a VHF radio (and license) and yes, all the equipment. Make the list, you'll see it may never stop as the laws are changed all the time. Also note that while the marine stuff is supposed to be universal the world over, SAMSA does not recognise the CE rated equipment, and CE now also does not recognize SAMSA equipment. Pretty soon you will have to have both for visiting Mas ;)

[Fanie]

WRT the first aid kit, the course has to be redone every 2 years or something...

The joke is, with all this manic safety going on on the water, the second you set foot on shore any philamon can take a pot shot at you and nothing will come of it. Where is the balance in all this.

The only conclusion one can make from this is it is only to make money out of you. They don't give a sh1t if you live or die as long as you pay them before you die.

[Manie B]

Ok lets steer clear of politics and personal views and get down to facts

this will keep you reading for a while


http://www.sailing.org.za/downloads/NSVSRegulations2007.pdf

http://www.sailing.org.za/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=21&page=1

[Fanie]

Ok lets steer clear of politics and personal views
I know you are not impressed by what I tell you, wait until you get to the water and they refuse you to launch without reason like they did with us - and whoever is responsible is now dead. Shall I give the other guys that was with me your phone number and tell them you say this is my personal view :D
It wasn't my personal view, it was someone else's personal view and it cost a lot of money.

It was suggested by SAS that I join a sailing club, the hint was that it sort of opens a door for you to slip in through. You just complained about all the requirements, this is just another one added to your list, you yearly club membership.

I'm not trying to be difficult. I, as much as every one else wants to enjoy my sport, but when one is treated badly and unfairly when you have paid and comply to all the requirements then you want a bit of service in return.

http://www.samsa.org.za/content_main.asp?menuId=5

[Fanie]

Oh yes, be sure to read the '21 of 2009 New Compulsory standards for Lifejackets used on South African Vessels'

Can you please indicate where I can get such a life jacket for sale ? I just bought a brand new life jacket for R1600 which now is worthless. You want to buy it :D

[Fanie]

Here's another one for you, I planned to make my own nav lights... which will comply of course. Now see the attached. This suggests that what I have been doing for the last 30+ years is below their standard.

Had the same thing with my trailer lights, the 'approved' lights stopped working the first time they hit water, I re-installed my own which was 'disapproved' and they work ever since. Since then half the trucks on our roads are working with lights like mine, now why wasn't mine approved ???

There is nothing you may do yourself. If you do not buy your boat from one of their 'approved' resellers you will not pass a survey. Sounds too radical for you ? Wait and see, monopolies are created faster than your standard of build can exceed theirs.

I'm saying again - they don't care about your wellfare, they just want your maaaney.

Sorry for thew rant there Colin, I'm looking for the maritime notice wrt booyancy...

[Wynand N]

Fanie, without going into pissing contest with you, you are a bit confused with some issues mentioned.
SAMSA is very specific with the type of buoyancy to be fitted - styrene is a no no since petrol and oil attacks it. If bottles are to be used, it must be a HDPE type with sealed caps (this is in dispute and is a rigid bottle that does not collapse with altitude difference as Coke bottles and the like) and the foam the recommend is a closed cell expanded polyurethane foam. I use the RX121 type or commonly known as Resicon 44V20.

Firstly, the foam does not need to have a buoyancy certificate - the purpose of it is to keep the water OUT of the hull when the hull is opened up, or the boat goes turtle. It is also commonly known that if the hull is damaged and the foam damaged by water, it should be repaired soonest as stated on reputable buoyancy certificates.
The buoyancy need to float the boat for only 24 hours which leaves ample of time for help to arrive.
I tested my foam by submerging it into under a brick water for 4 weeks and when taken out, only the outer layer of cells were soaked and when rubbed off by hand, the foam under that was still as good as new.

As for your statement about foam not sticking to the boat - we had to remove a boxed seat from foam we sprayed in under the seat in a small bass boat- my apprentice sprayed in to much and as the seat was only temporally fixed at that stage and the expansion of the foam lifted the seat about 100mm up. It was hell to get the GRP seat off the foam and foam from the hull. We actually used a rip hand saw in desperation and still it to a longgg time.
The foam is also very light and only weights about 38 kg per meter cubed. Most ski boats inland uses about 240 lt on average and we just done a Z Craft Catamaran for Cat C and she took about 870 lt - about 33kg in weight.

As for Life jackets - I received the latest notices about 4 weeks ago from BIASA and the CE mark is now accepted. You have such a range now to choose from with the new legislation and do not understand your complaining about PDF's.

BTW, I do about 5 buoyancy's weekly on average and my clients expect me as an installer to do it right with the best available as required by legislation. I have the complete and latest SAMSA Marine Notice 13 (with most recent updates) on file for reference purposes

[Wynand N]

Wynand just another question

in a case like Colin and myself that are building in marine ply
can the volume of the wood and ply encased in epoxy also qualify as bouyancy as a part of the 60% the other being polyurethane
might be a tricky question for our "authorities" that can't swim ;)

Manie, I am on record and in dispute with SAMSA and more so with this so called safety inspectors from SAADSA issuing COF's and the like that I held a workshop at my shop about 4 weeks ago with two top dogs from SAMSA in attendance to answer questions on the buoyancy issue.
They are not very Kosher in my books on the subject and rather stand with the views of their safety officers (persons that cannot even tell you what CP of a boat means - ordinary guys with jobs like handyman, pig farmer and the likes) rather than a veteran boatbuilder / designer like me. Shit, I have a three year diploma in small boat design and should know a little bit more than these suckers that intrepid the rules as they want. My local safety officer insist that a baler must be a galvanized steel bucket!! and fail boats on COF if it is plastic that can float when dropped in water....

Luckily there are some good guys around like this chap whom is on the technical committee of BIASA and executive member on SAMSA board whom regularly contacts me regarding the buoyancy issue.
Tomorrow Tuesday Im in Boksburg discussing with him some issues and formulas he need on buoyancy for the coming technical meeting at SAMSA. I was actually invited to go along but declined since I have to make my own way to Cape Town for that.

I cracked a rotten egg and informed him to inform SAMSA that there is no way that 30% buoyancy will float a Cat R boat when swamped. This rocked the boat badly so to speak and over the last couple of weeks run my calculations many times and every time the same answer.
I actually contacted "Carte Blanche" on Mnet about this that it is an accident waiting to happen and many people are under the impression their boats are "unsinkable" and will be now subconsciously be less careful due to this false security and I predicted people will drown in this season because of this error by SAMSA. They did not contacted me yet and probably wont - same with Huisgenoot I contacted. Philemon hanging on a white chick is more news worthy:(
I am desperate and need people to be made aware of this but how? Can you imagine the implications and havoc this will cause...?

Tomorrow in Boksburg my calculations will be demonstrated to the person mentioned to be taken to SAMSA. Will they act upon that? I will say no because in doing so, they will admit that they are fools and cost a lot of people a lot of money for nothing. That is how politics work and I see some dark days coming. Perhaps I must contact the Rapport and get this in the open if they have the balls.

But Manie, back to your questions. Unfortunately I am at home and the data I need is in my office and I will post it tomorrow afternoon when Im back from Boksburg.
In short; different materials have different SG factors when submerged and this must be brought into the flotation calculations and this is where SAMSA fucked up. Eg. Fibreglass laminate SG is about 1.5 ton per meter cubed dry. Submerged the factor is about 0.33 due to the density of the water. So does everything changes in SG when submerged. But you will have the numbers tomorrow and you can calculate it yourself

[Fanie]

styrene is a no no since petrol and oil attacks it.
Not if you seal it. I have a client that seals PS and you can glass over it or throw petrol on it.

Contact Brian at AMT 011 392 4232 wrt their 2 part foam. they were here, I got samples and mixed some of it myself and if I'm not mistaken they cannot issue a certificate for it for booyancy. As I said, if you seal the foam it will keep water out.

This foam has another problem you may not be aware of. If it breaks and a piece is loose, then movement and vibration scarfs itself and the rest of the inetrior away ie it becomes a powder. It is not a flexible foam. Rub two pieces together and see what happens. Hopefully you boat will never have a piece break loose. Look here www.amtcomposites.co.za

I also won't go into a pissing contest with you, you use in your boats what you want. All I can say to you is that over the last ten years I have spent a lot of time experimenting with various foams, and the Sondor closed cell foams is the only foam I will use in my boats. I can also tell you some of the installers here use Sondor's foam, others use the mix foam.

As for your statement about foam not sticking to the boat
I never said anywhere the pour foam won't stick to a boat ??? I does stick very well. Sondor's foam, which you can only buy in sheets or blocks have to be glassed to keep them in their position.

I received the latest notices about 4 weeks ago from BIASA and the CE mark is now accepted. You have such a range now to choose from with the new legislation and do not understand your complaining about PDF's.
Can you please foreward those notices to my e-mail adress ? It is then in contrast to the content '21 of 2009 New Compulsory standards for Lifejackets used on South African Vessels' - unless I have a complete misunderstanding of this whole saga. I was under the impression the marine notices is the LAW...

Aparently there is a difference between a life jacket and a PDF as well.

I asked a laywer last night specifically about the use of life jackets and en light of the requirements. He said to me you may only use another life jacket as long as the one required by law is not available, the moment they do become available you can throw the old one in the dust bin.

I have also phoned (and e-mailed) SAMSA RB and asked about the life jacket, they TOLD me I can use the one I have, but they won't put anything in WRITING.

my clients expect me as an installer to do it right with the best available as required by legislation
Wynand, I'm sure your work is professional, I have no doubt. That unfortunately cannot be said about all installers. I saw someone else's booyancy done by an installer and it was pathetic.

[Fanie]

Tomorrow in Boksburg my calculations will be demonstrated to the person mentioned to be taken to SAMSA. Will they act upon that? I will say no because in doing so, they will admit that they are fools and cost a lot of people a lot of money for nothing. That is how politics work and I see some dark days coming. Perhaps I must contact the Rapport and get this in the open if they have the balls.

Well well, now that you've won the pissing contest can we agree on something :D

[Wynand N]

Fanie, Im off to Boksburg tomorrow morning early (see my previous post and tell me what you think of it) and when Im back, I will forward the new lifejacket rules from BIASA to you. For different category's you have different jackets that is nominated in KN or if divided by 9.8, will give you an approx kg flotation rating of the life jacket.
You are correct, PDF's differ from life jackets mainly in the sense that it does not keep your head above water as a proper life jacket does. PDF's are accepted in Category R boats and if memory serves me right, also for category E, but I stand to be corrected.

Stuur more die notas.

[Fanie]

Take the weight of your boat with everything fully loaded including your butt in it. The booyancy should match that in volume (take into consideration the foam's weight also) and your boat will just barely stay afloat. Any extra volume foam you add is what will give you positive booyancy.

My boat weighs about 800kg empty. I have 2 cu meters of foam in it. That is 100% booyancy. Sometimes one load more stuff in it than other times, I would hate to sit and weigh every time I go out.

[Fanie]

Good luck... but from experience I can tell you SAMSA listens to no one...

[Wynand N]

My boat weighs about 800kg empty. I have 2 cu meters of foam in it. That is 100% booyancy. Sometimes one load more stuff in it than other times, I would hate to sit and weigh every time I go out.

Not quite Fanie - I will email you the proper formulas and SG's to work with. Remember, assumption is the mother of all fuckups...

Im of to bed now with my Clive Custler book - he is more interesting than you and buoyancy:D :D

Praat more weer my pel.

[Fanie]

Ok, here's what I think. I'm 52, it's going to cost me thumb suck around R300 000 to build and complete my boat and take me about 3 years to do so.

Lets say I'm up and about to around 65, that gives me say 10 years in which to catch all the fish there is.

Now, with all the crap going on here getting the boat built, the authorities that is not accomodating, laws being changed all the time etc etc etc, why don't I just take MY figgin money and I can have a nice holiday elsewhere every year.

300 000 plus what I would have spent on going on a holiday here is more than R 30 000 plus a holiday expense that I can blow on a holiday elsewhere, where you are not friggin victimised by shitheads, I can holiday between intelligent people, I don't have to join any clubs, my stuff won't get stolen, I don't have to do all these required courses, You don't have to get 'inspected' by someone with no experience.

Just thinking about it, I haven't had a decent time away in YEARS :(

[boat fan]

Ok, here's what I think. I'm 52, it's going to cost me thumb suck around R300 000 to build and complete my boat and take me about 3 years to do so.

Lets say I'm up and about to around 65, that gives me say 10 years in which to catch all the fish there is.

Now, with all the crap going on here getting the boat built, the authorities that is not accomodating, laws being changed all the time etc etc etc, why don't I just take MY figgin money and I can have a nice holiday elsewhere every year.

300 000 plus what I would have spent on going on a holiday here is more than R 30 000 plus a holiday expense that I can blow on a holiday elsewhere, where you are not friggin victimised by shitheads, I can holiday between intelligent people, I don't have to join any clubs, my stuff won't get stolen, I don't have to do all these required courses, You don't have to get 'inspected' by someone with no experience.

Just thinking about it, I haven't had a decent time away in YEARS
__________________




Sounds like a plan..................

[Manie B]

Strokes for folks, ultimately you will have to decide what you personally prefer and can or cannot live with.

I have experimented with the same foam Fanie is talking about and it has the following draw backs

heavy

very expensive ( top quality product )

comes in sheets or blocks (big and small - usually 2.4 x 1.2)

I got sheets of 100 mm - 80 mm and 20 mm thick
now the problem is that you basically have to cut it up and glue and stuff it into your cavity, the different glues have their own problems and sinificantly add even more wieght to an already heavy product. Stuffing and glueing pieces big and small into a cavity also leaves more cavities, so your chamber that you want to use as an "floatation chamber" has a lot of air cavities within as well. These empty cavities could be reduced if this foam was installed during the construction fase, but you end up with a lot off very expensive offcuts.

The point that a 2 part mixed PU foam gets heavy after some years, as it may absorb water, is also problematic. If you have poured the foam into a decent and clean cavity with and escape hole on the opposite side where the foam can bubble out as it expands and then afterwards seal it of well and then paint - you may never have problems

I have personaly worked on a 36 ft Beneteau that is approx 40 years old and at some stage foam was poured into some cavities - BONE DRY

the point is a well maintained boat will never have PU foam go heavy from water absorption

the "speed" boat lying in a backyard in the rain gets heavier after every rainy season.

So to say the one product is better than the other, is wrong. Every product has it ideal application and if used and maintained correctly will give the life expected. I have seen PU foam that is many years old and in 100% excellent condition, and considering that those "old formulations" were not as good as todays, the new stuff is much better.

My conclusion after carefull experimentation

PU is light - cheap - easy to work with

[Fanie]

Manie,

SPX33 weigh 33kg/cu meter. It is not the weight that is the draw back, it is that you cannot use it in sheet form as a former because it flexes, you have to glass it both sides to make it structural.

[colfar5033]

morning all

wow! did not realise it was such a complex issue. here i thought i could just
put a couple of 2 litre bottles or some of those pool noodles in there. Could
your fuel and water tanks be classed as bouyancy for the boat ?

cheers
colin

[boat fan]

morning all

wow! did not realise it was such a complex issue. here i thought i could just
put a couple of 2 litre bottles or some of those pool noodles in there. Could
your fuel and water tanks be classed as bouyancy for the boat ?

cheers
colin


Fuel is lighter than water so that would be some benefit , but not a lot.

Example for 100 liters :

Diesel : 192.8 lb ( 87.5 kg )

Petrol : 161.1 lb ( 73.1 kg )

Water : 220.1 lb ( 99.8 kg )

You would need BIG tanks if you carried them full .

Water tanks of course would only give you buoyancy if you can pump them out ( quickly ).:D

[Fanie]

Colin, fuel (and tanks) does assist in floating a boat, but I would suggest you do not calculate that in. Provide enough and decent flotation. When the time comes it will be a comforting thought. Even an aeroplane can make an emergency landing, but on water you have no where to go other than stay on the boat. In an emergency about the worst thing you can do is to abandon boat

[Manie B]

One area where the closed cell foam that Fanie refers to excells is in padding. Gymnasts generally use it for excersise mats. I will be using it in my boat as flooring and around areas where i could bump my head. It is by far the best waterproof added floatation rubber lining / padding around. It is nice to crawl on and has the added advantage of insulation. 20mm thick does the job and the blue looks ok. I will be using it in my forward cabin where i will crawl in and out. My forward double berth area will only be used as storage.

[Wynand N]

Fanie, I have some good news for you. Had my meeting with the BIASA headman and he had samples of all buoyancy materials that were presented to SAMSA on the last technical meeting.
He had two samples of Sadors SRX33 - in a nice blue - and the guy that actually make this stuff, came to meet me and explained how it is made and the composition of it. This foam can actually be cut in strips as you like, or in sheets as the ones you showed me sometime ago. The piece given to me is actually turned on a lathe (see photo).

The good news is that SAMSA is quite impressed and this is also now acceptable. However, this stuff is apparently fuel, oil waterproof and I think of changing to this. The price per meter cube is about 20% more than RX121 PU foam.

[Fanie]

Well now. I've been telling SAMSA this for YEARS :( That's it Wynand, from now on you are my personal mouth piece with them :D

Could you please fwd me their contact details where they manufacture it please, I only have a Wattloo number for them.

Well done with the meeting today, but you can tell in your own gruesome details about it.

One area where the closed cell foam that Fanie refers to excells is in padding. Gymnasts generally use it for excersise mats.
AHemmmmm.... Manie, actually I'm using it in my boats :D Look at my lips ;)

[Fanie]

Manie, if you do use the foam for a floor, how long will it last if you walk over it all the time ?

[hoytedow]

It will last quite awhile, but make it easy to replace. It is inexpensive so why not use it as a consumable piece of equipment, just as batteries, flares or even rope are considered to be.

[Manie B]

Manie, if you do use the foam for a floor, how long will it last if you walk over it all the time ?

If you walk on it barefoot the stuff will probably out last you, the 2 pieces that i use on the floor has lasted 5 years and still good as new just dirty, the 2 x 100mm pieces have been used to test the rammers on and have been on the back off the truck for 4 years with only surface cracks, that's why i say in a confined space it is the best flooring / padding. Soft and it floats.

[Fanie]

If you walk on it barefoot the stuff will probably out last you
Have you seen my toe nails :D






Ha ! Have you guys heard what Wynand did :D

Aparently he tried to catch some shine in front of some chicks (of course HE said it was for the WIFE) but nobody married so long does something this dumb I mean daring :rolleyes:

The man stood up on a boat and attempted a back summersault. Aparently there was a drum he could have stepped down on but this he kicked contemptuously away and proceeded none the less. Now I suspect his wife was walking in on that moment, because what else could possibly go wrong ??? This disoriented him or tightened his muscles up because the rest of the movement was not completed.

Now If one have to make a landing somewhere you would choose the softest spot around eh, but not Wynand no. Just to show how tough he really is he chose a stainless steel prop to make his landing on.

I asked him 'How do you feel'
His words was ' Ja well no fine'
Can you imagine ? Me I would have complained about sore spots etc but HE says he FEELS GREAT:eek:

[masalai]

Wynand, Fanie requested that I give you grief, I did.... Check your <user CP> by clicking the button at the top of the page :D:D:D:D

[Fanie]

You only gave him half there Mas. Stingy bugger ;)

[Fanie]

It will last quite awhile, but make it easy to replace. It is inexpensive so why not use it as a consumable piece of equipment, just as batteries, flares or even rope are considered to be.

I was just thinking - if a small piece gets damaged, it may well be easy to cut a square, take it out and simply glue the new piece in.


Actually, I like Manie's idea. If you use this foam as a padding all over, it not only protects one from bumps, falls... whatever, but it also serves as booyancy with minimal weight added. While I sandwitched mine between the glass, I like your idea better the more I think about it.

[hoytedow]

The best way to do that is to cut out the old at the same time as you cut in the new piece. I used to install flooring and that is how we made the patch to fit. Lay the new piece over the damaged area and cut them together, a small rectangle or triangle then glue in the patch.

[hoytedow]

Sorry you got hurt, Wynand, especially in front of witnesses.

[Fanie]

Yes, that's a good idea. Since the foam comes in very consitent colours one can fix it up quite easy.

[hoytedow]

If it had a pattern like solid vinyl flooring, we would simply make sure the pattern of the replacement was superimposed upon the old piece, taped so it would not shift, then cut.

[Fanie]

Sorry you got hurt, Wynand, especially in front of witnesses.
Fortunately it seems mostly the ego that was hurt. Very lucky, spare parts for us are getting scarce. Althoug I joked about it (one way of dealing with things) one can only hope it won'y turn out more than it seems. I'll call Wynand over the weekend and see how he's doing.

You know us old fishermen, not much happen to us, we just change smell once in a while ;)

[hoytedow]

Yep, about every 3 days.

[masalai]

Jeees and I thought that was a "pommie" trick?

[Wynand N]

I'll call Wynand over the weekend and see how he's doing.


Up and around with no ill effects, although I got a nasty blue bruise and scrape on the back where the damn propeller got hold of me. Luckily it was a stainless steel prop;) This is why I dislike cats - two props could have got me if it was a bad day:(

My 134kg hitting mother earth registered 4.2 on the Richter scale.:D :D

[Fanie]

I phoned Wynand's BIG BOSS, she confirmed he's up and about. I also got a list of do's and don't from her for Wynand but I'm sure he heard it many times already by now.

Anyway, she declared him fit and healthy and of sound mind so he's sent back to work or he'll get put in the pan if the bacon doesn't come home :D

[hoytedow]

My 134kg hitting mother earth registered 4.2 on the Richter scale.:D :D

You know what they say: The bigger they are, the harder they fall.;)