1959 Johnson 9.9 outboard

[dgjones]

Hello, I am thinking about purchasing a 1959 Johnson outboard 9.9. The seller told me that I need to buy a "pressurized" gas tank. Is anyone familiar with this motor? Thanks

[gonzo]

Those are called "dumpers" because of the amount of oil they leave behind in the water. Some of those old motors send compression into the tank to push the fuel to the carburetor. If you want to pollute a lake, nothing beats one of those Johnsons.

[dgjones]

Thanks for the info. What would you recommend as a good cheap 9.9 outboard for my boat? I heard Nissan is a good buy.

Thanks for the help

[Rangerspeedboat]

That johnson is probably a good runing little outboard. Instead of a pressurized gas tank, a little fuel pump should work. Oh no, pollution.

[gonzo]

Tohatsu makes Nissan and Mercury motors up to 9.9HP. If you buy them in blue they are cheaper. They are really good motors.

[Wynand N]

Tohatsu makes Nissan and Mercury motors up to 9.9HP. If you buy them in blue they are cheaper. They are really good motors.

actually, Tohatsu supply all Mercury's two stroke engines up to 50hp and the complete Mercury four stroke line.
The other day a chap walked into my showroom, looked at a 15hp Tohatsu (we are local Tohatsu dealer in my town) and was shocked to see it is the same (even detailing) as the Mercury 15hp he had just bought at 30% more...
All our 2009 model Tohatsu two stroke engines are "Mercury" black with same red sticker across the cowling side with just the name different.

[dgjones]

How much does a tohatsu 9.9 cost?

[thudpucker]

Those old OMC 9.9's are a lot better than those guys are leading you to belive.
That's a Two-hose tank setup. A bad thing...OMC realized it and converted to a Single hose in the 60's.
That old OMC was a 25:1 oiler. A real slimer at Idle.
If you get a good buy on it, less than $100 you can convert it to a Single hose and use one of the new tanks, and with the newer Oils you can go to the 50:1 Mix all the newer outboards use.

Here's two links to what you need to know.
http://www.sschapterpsa.com/ramblings/Converting_dual_fuel_line.htm
http://outboard-boat-motor-repair.com/johnson/Pressureized%20Fuel%20Tanks.htm

[mydauphin]

actually, Tohatsu supply all Mercury's two stroke engines up to 50hp and the complete Mercury four stroke line.
The other day a chap walked into my showroom, looked at a 15hp Tohatsu (we are local Tohatsu dealer in my town) and was shocked to see it is the same (even detailing) as the Mercury 15hp he had just bought at 30% more...
All our 2009 model Tohatsu two stroke engines are "Mercury" black with same red sticker across the cowling side with just the name different.

I have a Nissan 5hp, a friend has Mercury 6hp, the engines seem identical in all regards including power. Do you know difference?

By the the way, I also have 15hp Evinrude which is same 9.9 hp with a different carb I believe. It is an excellent motor once you upgrade to single line, 50:1 mix. Lots of power runs great. Unbreakable. The two stroke is much lighter per hp than 4 stroke. I hate little nissan, every time I move it around I get oil in carb and have to remove spark plug at launch. You talk about oil in water. YEah, if you hold perfectly straight or in its correct side it does not happen, but it does.

[gonzo]

thudpucker:
nobody said they are bad. It is a fact that they dump more oil in the water than they burn though. Whether that is something you care about or not is another matter.

[thudpucker]

I do care Gonzo and your wrong of course. And you did allude to the old OMC's being bad for oil spillage.
I dont think you can show them to Dump more than they use. I've never seen that happen.

What MAY happen if the Mixer isn't careful, is a little too much oil with each mix, over time, will have the engine smoking.

Dumping oil means a fuel leak somewhere. Your exaggerations arent helping anything.

[gonzo]

Thudpucker: either you haven't ever started an old outboard and seen the oil sleek or you are just being obnoxious. The new technology was forced on manufacturers to prevent the oil being dumped in the water.

[tom28571]

Yes, the old 2 stroke engines are not very clean to the water but they are not as bad at this argument goes either. By using modern oils at 50:1 ratio, the amount getting into the water is cut in half right off the bat. Proper tuning and mixture settings of the carb will further reduce the oil but nothing will make them as clean as a four stroke or DFI engine.

There are an awful lot of good reliable old 2 strokes out there at very good prices and parts for Johnson-Evinrudes are in good supply. Bolt on fuel pumps are available to eliminate the need for the problem prone pressurized fuel tank. Frankly, I consider it an individual call on whether it is reasonable to run one of them in the local waters or not. In some places, it would be a significant issue, while in other places, it would be negligible. Natural oil seepage from the ocean bottom is several orders of magnitude greater. Runoff from our cars on the roads and parking lots dwarfs oil from outboards.

Not to minimize pollution from outboards but we should keep it in perspective.

[gonzo]

I agree. Has anyone tried running them with less than 50:1 ratio? The old oils would break down diluted more than that. It makes me thing that it was not really needed. Also, in tht 50's they used straight 30 oil.

[tom28571]

I agree. Has anyone tried running them with less than 50:1 ratio? The old oils would break down diluted more than that. It makes me thing that it was not really needed. Also, in tht 50's they used straight 30 oil.

I have a 1987 Yamaha 8hp that runs on 100:1 oil ratio. Since I am a little conservative, I always fudge that a bit and also add "Ring Free" to keep the rings from sticking when the engine sets up for a while. When I first got this engine, the pistons were frozen, perhaps from too little oil. Still have this engine and it still runs well. I run my 1980 Evinrude 25 at 50:1 oil ratio. It smokes a little when first fired but not so much thereafter. Neither of these engines is used a lot. Three older two strokes are not used at all.

[Lt. Holden]

I also have 15hp Evinrude which is same 9.9 hp with a different carb I believe. It is an excellent motor once you upgrade to single line, 50:1 mix. Lots of power runs great. Unbreakable.

I currently have a 1960 Evinrude Sportwin 10 HP on a 12' 1960 Alumacraft Vee puddle jumper. It runs great but the boat is a tad too small for two guys to fish from (imho). I have a 13'6" flat bottom dinghy hull that I would like to restore. I don't think the 10 HP will be quite enough power; I would like 20 mph or so.

Can anyone clarify on the differences between the 10 (or 9.9) and the 15 HP? If I could simply buy a carb and get 5 more HP that would be great.

[Lt. Holden]

By the the way, I also have 15hp Evinrude which is same 9.9 hp with a different carb I believe. It is an excellent motor once you upgrade to single line, 50:1 mix. Lots of power runs great. Unbreakable. The two stroke is much lighter per hp than 4 stroke.

Can anyone clarify that this is correct? I have a 1960 Evinrude Sportwin 10 HP that runs great. I want to swap it from a 1960 Alumacraft 12' semi-vee to a 13'6" flat bottom dinghy that somebody left in my yard. If simply swapping the carb gets me 5 HP that would be way cool:cool: .

Sorry for the double post. it didn't look like it posted the first time, can I delete one of them?

[thudpucker]

Better post a photo Lt. I never heard of a Flat bottom Dingy before.

They only way you could know for sure is to see a parts list for both engines. If the only difference in part numbers was the Carb and Reed block, then it will probably work.

[mydauphin]

Can anyone clarify that this is correct? I have a 1960 Evinrude Sportwin 10 HP that runs great. I want to swap it from a 1960 Alumacraft 12' semi-vee to a 13'6" flat bottom dinghy that somebody left in my yard. If simply swapping the carb gets me 5 HP that would be way cool:cool: .

Sorry for the double post. it didn't look like it posted the first time, can I delete one of them?


Yes, search on internet, there is even a video how to do it on utube

[ondarvr]

Its not a good idea to run the older 24-1 engines at 50-1, the older engines use bushings that require more oil for lubrication, the newer engines have needle bearings which require less oil. The change on oil ratio was made in the mid 60's when J/E went to all needle bearing designs. J/E recommended 100-1 for a couple of years on some small engines, but changed back to 50-1 after storage problems at 100-1 (not enough oil to protect from corrosion when left sitting).

The conversion to a fuel pump and single line tank allows you to use the newer, more common and lower cost fuel lines and tanks, but doesn't really change anything else.

The J/E models out of the 50s have a following because they were simple, easy to work on, parts are still available, reliable and sort of low in cost.

[ondarvr]

The switch from 9.9 to 15Hp is one everybody asks about. There were a couple years that the only part difference listed was the carb (in the 70's I think), after that it was the carb and other parts, you need to get a parts breakdown for each model year to find the differences. Many people complained there was very little difference in power between the two when new, so the swap may not gain much. Since everybody wants the 15hp parts for the swap, they go for more money on ebay and at times are a difficult to find. Its much easier and normally costs less to sell what you have and buy the one you want.

[thudpucker]

On two river in Alaska, people used hi-horspower jet boats to get up river, then drift down.
The wake damage was bad enough that Fish n' Game put a horspower limit of 35 on the river.
J/E Came out with the 35 Hp Alaskan. Immediatly the Rumor was; "The Alaskan was a 55 Hp engine with a 35 Hp Carb on it!"
I dont know the truth, but it seems pretty similar to the 9 to 15 Hp rumor.

Thanks for the Explanation ondvar.

[ondarvr]

The Alaskan 35hp rule made things difficult and actually worse for the shoreline. Instead of being able to use a higher HP engine that would fully plane the boat when it was loaded, they required the lower HP to reduce speed, which increases the size of the wake and results in more damage. They recenlty increased the allowed HP to 50.

The kits to detune larger motors to 35HP were installed, approved and then later modified to defeat some of the HP reduction. If you got busted there was a fine.

[thudpucker]

I was one (of hundreds) who went to the fish n' game meetings and complained about that very thing. A boat moving slow makes a bigger wake.
I had already left when the changed the rule. I didnt know. Thanks.

[Wynand N]

The switch from 9.9 to 15Hp is one everybody asks about.

Most manufacturers having these two motors use the same "de-powering" techniques from the 15 to 9.9hp. The obvious difference between them are the RPM where the said HP is achieved and some carb tuning. All 15's runs about 500 RPM faster than the 9.9's. Both these motors have the same engine displacement and weight.

Tohatsu make things actually worse or better perhaps. They not only have a 9.9hp, but also a 9.8hp and as a dealer in these engines I usually recommends the 9.8 over the 9.9. The 9.8 is a totally different motor than the 9.9 with a smaller engine displacement and weighs 15kg (33lbs) less than the 9.9! giving it much more bang for weight and cost considerably less than its fractionally bigger brother....

[thudpucker]

Interesting. Sounds like Tahatsu bought another company's motor for one or the other dont it?

At any rate, in the 60's, Tahatsu was the first Jap importer of a Motorcycle that looked like a Motorcycle. Good little unit.