Rower/Sailer for Catalina for 2 men

[a67676767]

Hi. My dad and I are looking to build a boat that would take us to Catalina Island and back. My dad studies boatbuilding quite a bit, and we are both good sailors. We are definitely novices when it comes to boatbuilding. We were looking for a boat to build that we could row/sail to Catalina. We had played around with different designs for a rowable trimaran. I am leaning towards a larger (~20 ft) monohull design, but still very open.

Wondered if anyone had any places to start looking.

[Chris Ostlind]

This design might tweak your imagination a bit

http://www.antrimdesign.com/rowing/MultihullRowing.html

[ba67676767]

a67676767, this looks like it is possible to row between the amas. we might want to re-visit this. I wonder how they work around the cables.

Chris,
have you seen the actual boat in action? Is there plenty of clearance for the oars? Do the oars have to be shortened from the optimum length?

[Chris Ostlind]

Keep in mind that this boat is intended for a full oceanic crossing. As such, it has to have considerable load carrying capacity, as well as a secure place to sleep for both crew members. That makes this a fairly good sized craft.

A smaller version of this boat could be done to suit the above mission statement for a boat to row/sail from, I would guess, Oceanside to Catalina. That's a pretty good distance, as well as up-current and upwind the whole way there if the put-in is, in fact, Oceanside. They'd have a much easier time of things if they began their trip from San Pedro.

As far as I know, the oars have not been shortened.

So, a smaller version with self-bailing cockpit, forward cuddy and the provision for a smallish, but efficient, rig would make for a boat that could be very slender through the water, allowing good time under sail and oar.

ChrisO

[ba67676767]

So a better route would be San Pedro to Catalina and then Catalina to Oceanside?

Cool!! all we need is a boat:)

[Chris Ostlind]

Yep, that's an ideal route for this kind of trip.

There's a nice launching ramp inside the breakwater at Cabrillo Beach, giving a short trip to the ocean entrance. If you were to depart at about 6AM, you'd get a beautiful (typically) glass smooth sea state all the way across to the island 26 miles, depending on destination on the Island. Big freighter traffic in the channel tends to be slower at that time as well.

Time your departure from Catalina so that the bulk of your trip to Oceanside is done in the afternoon. The prevailing winds are going to be with you, as will the coastal current, making for a pleasant reach down the coast.

There are some great places to stay on the island besides Avalon and Two Harbors (though those locations are really fun) Catalina maintains a system of improved and unimproved campsites around the island coast. You'll need to make reservations well in advance for some of the sites, such as Little Harbor, Two Harbors and Parsons Landing.

Little Harbor is a really cool cove along the shore on the "outside" of Catalina with a perfect landing beach and really nice camping spots, complete with picnic benches and a fire ring. Parsons is secluded and located at the west end of the island where there is little traffic save for the possible adventurous Boy Scout venturing away from Emerald Bay.

Two Harbors is quiet, has a small restaraunt/bar, little store and a few permanent houses for employees.

Avalon is the small, Mediterranean style village on the coast where all the touristas go. The harbor is marked by the Avalon Ballroom, which is now mostly used as a cinema. There's a thriving little town there with a sizeable all-year population and lots of restaraunts, curio shops, a nice beach area, a decently large mooring field for weekend boats from the mainland, etc.

I consider it one of the quiet gems of the California boating experience. A full circumnavigation is more than worth the trouble, especially if you like to snorkel or fish. The water is very clear and there are fish and other sea life in abundance. If you already know Catalina, my apologies.

One tip: Do not dive at the southeast end of the island anywhere near the seal rookery. Because of the pinipeds, there's a tendency for large predators to frequent the area.

[ba67676767]

Chris, Thanks for all your help.

We plan to build a boat, so it will be a while before we actually make the trip. We have sailed to Catalina in chartered sailboats from Marina Del Rey, so have some familiarity with Catalina but you obviously have much more experience.

So swimming with the seals off Catalina is as dangerous as swimming with veterinarians off San Diego?

thanks again for your help on this.. hope we can maintain contact as we build and plan.

[a67676767]

Chris -

Wow .. thanks for all the info. The multihull rowing is exactly what my dad and I had discussed. We started drawing out plans similar to this. I wil take a look at the URL.

- Tim

[ba67676767]

I talked with Arch Davis of Davis Design. (he was the designer of the Penobscot 17).

Some points that he made:
It should have a covered deck so water cannot get below
It should have a self-bailing cockpit
It should be self-righting

He has said that he would be willing to visit with me while I am in Maine next month so I will try to stop by and look at boats and talk some

Might want to read the "French Rower Rescued" thread. We don't want that to be us.

[Zilver]

You could look at this site :

http://www.anne-quemere.com

Anne Quemere rowed across the ocean solo. Her boat looks a lot like the other ocean rowing boats, so probably this hull shape (the old self righting lifeboat concept) is the most apropiate for these kind of adventures.
You can try to contact Anne via her website.

Good Luck, Hans

[Chris Ostlind]

Let's keep in mind that the journey stated in the original post involves a water distance from Oceanside to Catalina of just about 90 miles, give or take, one way. If they leave from San Pedro, the distance is more ilke 26 miles, one way. While this is the ocean and there can be unpredictable events at sea, the typical prevailing conditions present in this location are something like the following.

"There will be late night and early morning low clouds, expected to burn-off about 10AM, giving way to prevailing sea breezes of about 12 knots northwest to west. Air temps will be 75 degrees with water temps of 68-70. There will be a low ocean swell of about four to six feet in the afternoon with nearly glassy conditions in the morning"

Now, you can build and use a full-tilt, bluewater rowing vessel for the adventure, nothing wrong with that apporoach at all. In my mind, it's enormous overkill, as well as overweight. Every pound of self-righting capability in the boat will have to be stroked each and every time they pull on the oars. When sailing, the boat will be appropriately slower due to the weight necessary. Slower vessel means longer trip, means extra stores, etc.

It is for these kinds of reasons that I proposed the consideration of a multihull, such as the newest machine designed by Jim Antrim... and that one is for long distance open water as well.

Like anything in design, you get and you give until you, hopefully, reach the boat that solves the most problems in the simplest fashion for the work intended.

[a67676767]

Well, that ORCA trimaran looks like a definite possibility. I'm sure it could be rigged with a sail.

[Zilver]

Let's keep in mind that the journey stated in the original post involves a water distance from Oceanside to Catalina of just about 90 miles, give or take, one way. If they leave from San Pedro, the distance is more ilke 26 miles, one way.

Sorry, I didn't read the posts good enough. I don't know why but I was under the impression that the trip was much bigger.

The site of Anne Quemere is interesting nontheless.....

Cheers, Hans

[ba67676767]

Zilver,

We do appreciate and want iny input that you may have to offer. ... even though we will never be more than 20 miles from land, that is still a long swim.
The Anne Quemere site was interesting and helpful. I clicked on the kite section and it got my wheels spinning... one thing at a time.

Thanks again for your input.

[ba67676767]

http://www.chriswhitedesigns.com/discovery20/index.php

How does this look as a starting point? Only 20 ' long and may not modify for rowing. It would be cool if the cockpit could be a lift-out box. Have one for rowing / sailing and one for fat old guys to sail on the lake?

[a67676767]

yeah, that looks like it could be ok as a starting point. I don't have a sense for the cabin space. Definitely looks enough to investigate. Is there a way to get more info without buying the plans?

[diwebb]

Hi, you may be interested in the attached design I did many years ago for a plywood Swampscott Dory. She has been relofted and built at 12 foot long and was a delightful boat to row around the harbour for a single rower. At 18 feet long she would be suitable for the purpose you have outlined, but would need a watertight floation compartement built in to the bow and stern. A low center of effort, simple sailing rig, such as a lusail cat ketch with unstayed masts, would be suitable for this design. I recently installed one on a local two part nesting dory here in New Zealand and she performed well with it. The dory design is quite easy to build as every plank has one straight edge. The construction uses stringers at each plank lap and has sawn frames at each station. She is a bit over designed structurally but that is not a bad thing for a boat designed for this purpose. I also have a design for a 14 foot sailing rowing dinghy but construction is lapstrake ply and she is a bit more difficult to build. I have attached a sail plan for her as this rig would suit the dory. Attachments are photos of the hand drawn plans. Plans are available for purchase if you are interested.

[AuxiliaryComms]

For a mono-hull that can sail, row and handle the ocean, look into the Grand Banks Dory.

They were made for open ocean cod fishing and rowing or sailing in seas that weren't always happy to see you. The carry a good sized load too. They were more stable in rough seas with about 1000 lb load though so I'm not sure how well it would work for you. 18-20 was common for the ones that could carry a sail.

[diwebb]

Hi, a few more thoughts. Joe Dobler did the design for Millenium Falcon which won the Catalina to Marina Del Rey rowing race several times. He has sevral designs published on the www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/dobler website. One that seems to suit your requirements ideally is the Nootka Sound. She is a 20 ft long rowing and sailing boat with overnight accommodation and designed for use in rough water. Plans are available for this stitch and glue plywood design.

[multicapt]

Chris and the member looking for info on Orca ,I am the builder and skipper of the boat you can go to www.rocexpedition.com to view a film of Orca in action.
I have in fact sailed Orca from Barbados to St Vincent and she flew ,granted in a following sea however there is no doubt in my mind with a few changes she would be a lot of fun.
Orca is for sale at the right price if your interested , make me an offer.
I understand this forum is not about selling ones unwanted goods therefore if anyone would like further info on the boat I'd be only to pleased to help.