Boston
01-07-2011, 08:29 AM
money is the grease by which the wheels keep turning
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[46]
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 08:30 AM
www.thefreedictionary.com/money
mon·ey (mn)
n. pl. mon·eys or mon·ies
1. A medium that can be exchanged for goods and services and is used as a measure of their values on the market, including among its forms a commodity such as gold, an officially issued coin or note, or a deposit in a checking account or other readily liquefiable account.
2. The official currency, coins, and negotiable paper notes issued by a government.
3. Assets and property considered in terms of monetary value; wealth.
4.
a. Pecuniary profit or loss: He made money on the sale of his properties.
b. One's salary; pay: It was a terrible job, but the money was good.
5. An amount of cash or credit: raised the money for the new playground.
6. Sums of money, especially of a specified nature. Often used in the plural: state tax moneys; monies set aside for research and development.
7. A wealthy person, family, or group: to come from old money; to marry into money.
Idioms:
for (one's) money
According to one's opinion, choice, or preference: For my money, it's not worth the trouble.
in the money
1. Slang Rich; affluent.
2. Sports & Games Taking first, second, or third place in a contest on which a bet has been placed, such as a horserace.
3. Something Hoyt don't got.
on the money
Exact; precise.
put money on Sports & Games
To place a bet on.
put (one's) money where (one's) mouth is Slang
To live up to one's words; act according to one's own advice.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Middle English moneie, from Old French, from Latin monta, mint, coinage, from Monta, epithet of Juno, temple of Juno of Rome where money was coined.]mon·ey (mn)
mon·ey (mn)
n. pl. mon·eys or mon·ies
1. A medium that can be exchanged for goods and services and is used as a measure of their values on the market, including among its forms a commodity such as gold, an officially issued coin or note, or a deposit in a checking account or other readily liquefiable account.
2. The official currency, coins, and negotiable paper notes issued by a government.
3. Assets and property considered in terms of monetary value; wealth.
4.
a. Pecuniary profit or loss: He made money on the sale of his properties.
b. One's salary; pay: It was a terrible job, but the money was good.
5. An amount of cash or credit: raised the money for the new playground.
6. Sums of money, especially of a specified nature. Often used in the plural: state tax moneys; monies set aside for research and development.
7. A wealthy person, family, or group: to come from old money; to marry into money.
Idioms:
for (one's) money
According to one's opinion, choice, or preference: For my money, it's not worth the trouble.
in the money
1. Slang Rich; affluent.
2. Sports & Games Taking first, second, or third place in a contest on which a bet has been placed, such as a horserace.
3. Something Hoyt don't got.
on the money
Exact; precise.
put money on Sports & Games
To place a bet on.
put (one's) money where (one's) mouth is Slang
To live up to one's words; act according to one's own advice.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Middle English moneie, from Old French, from Latin monta, mint, coinage, from Monta, epithet of Juno, temple of Juno of Rome where money was coined.]mon·ey (mn)
wardd
01-07-2011, 08:44 AM
so for the good of society should it be allowed to congeal in one place?
troy2000
01-07-2011, 09:36 AM
Workers work. Management rapes? Come on Troy, you're being a union rep!
Company executives and boardroom directors are probably no more dishonest and greedy as a group than Congressmen and Senators are. But they aren't a bit better, either.
Whatever you may believe, they aren't part of some altruistic meritocracy -- earning their positions strictly because of their knowledge and experience rather than because of who they know, and administering their companies strictly for the good of the shareholder.
For an instructive case history, you might study the career of Neil Bush: as the son of one President and brother of another, he's been CEO or boardroom member in a long list of companies. He's been involved in Silverado Savings & Loan, Apex Energy, TransMedia Communications, InterLink, Telecom Holdings, Grace Semiconductor Management Company, Crest Investment, Ignite! Learning, so on and so forth, ad infinitum, ad nauseum...
I'd like to point out that the first three companies (in three separate fields) all went belly-up and left the shareholders and employees holding the bag, while Neil Bush walked away with his pockets full.
Company executives and boardroom directors are probably no more dishonest and greedy as a group than Congressmen and Senators are. But they aren't a bit better, either.
Whatever you may believe, they aren't part of some altruistic meritocracy -- earning their positions strictly because of their knowledge and experience rather than because of who they know, and administering their companies strictly for the good of the shareholder.
For an instructive case history, you might study the career of Neil Bush: as the son of one President and brother of another, he's been CEO or boardroom member in a long list of companies. He's been involved in Silverado Savings & Loan, Apex Energy, TransMedia Communications, InterLink, Telecom Holdings, Grace Semiconductor Management Company, Crest Investment, Ignite! Learning, so on and so forth, ad infinitum, ad nauseum...
I'd like to point out that the first three companies (in three separate fields) all went belly-up and left the shareholders and employees holding the bag, while Neil Bush walked away with his pockets full.
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 10:27 AM
bla bla bla, except for the Neil Bush thing.
WickedGood
01-07-2011, 10:57 AM
This Damm Global Warming!
Its all Al Gores Fault.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/06/26/article-1195810-05804C25000005DC-588_468x291.jpg
Its all Al Gores Fault.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/06/26/article-1195810-05804C25000005DC-588_468x291.jpg
Boston
01-07-2011, 11:12 AM
Rapid Global Climate Shift = hard times ahead
troy2000
01-07-2011, 12:12 PM
Bit of a change in subject here, for those who are firmly convinced California's budget troubles are due to liberals and unions:
Texas (which has been held up before us as a shining example of how conservatives do it right) is working on its semi-annual budget, and the latest projections are that the state will run up a $25 billion dollar deficit in the next two years.
That's worse than New York's deficit and in the same neighborhood as California's, although not quite as bad as New Jersey's.
How can that be? Just the other day Texas was being touted as a role model (and still is by commentators who haven’t been keeping up with the news). It was the state the recession supposedly passed by, thanks to its low taxes and business-friendly policies. Its governor boasted that its budget was in good shape thanks to his “tough conservative decisions.”
Oh, and at a time when there’s a full-court press on to demonize public-sector unions as the source of all our woes, Texas is nearly demon-free: less than 20 percent of public-sector workers there are covered by union contracts, compared with almost 75 percent in New York.
So what happened to the “Texas miracle” many people were talking about even a few months ago?
The truth is that the Texas state government has relied for years on smoke and mirrors to create the illusion of sound finances in the face of a serious “structural” budget deficit — that is, a deficit that persists even when the economy is doing well. When the recession struck, hitting revenue in Texas just as it did everywhere else, that illusion was bound to collapse.
The only thing that let Gov. Rick Perry get away, temporarily, with claims of a surplus was the fact that Texas enacts budgets only once every two years, and the last budget was put in place before the depth of the economic downturn was clear. Now the next budget must be passed — and Texas may have a $25 billion hole to fill. Now what?
Given the complete dominance of conservative ideology in Texas politics, tax increases are out of the question. So it has to be spending cuts.
Texas is already close to the bottom of the country in money spent per pupil for public education, and leads the nation in the number of people without health insurance. So where are they going to cut now?
This was abridged and paraphrased from the following column, for those who want to read the whole thing:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/07/opinion/07krugman.html
Texas (which has been held up before us as a shining example of how conservatives do it right) is working on its semi-annual budget, and the latest projections are that the state will run up a $25 billion dollar deficit in the next two years.
That's worse than New York's deficit and in the same neighborhood as California's, although not quite as bad as New Jersey's.
How can that be? Just the other day Texas was being touted as a role model (and still is by commentators who haven’t been keeping up with the news). It was the state the recession supposedly passed by, thanks to its low taxes and business-friendly policies. Its governor boasted that its budget was in good shape thanks to his “tough conservative decisions.”
Oh, and at a time when there’s a full-court press on to demonize public-sector unions as the source of all our woes, Texas is nearly demon-free: less than 20 percent of public-sector workers there are covered by union contracts, compared with almost 75 percent in New York.
So what happened to the “Texas miracle” many people were talking about even a few months ago?
The truth is that the Texas state government has relied for years on smoke and mirrors to create the illusion of sound finances in the face of a serious “structural” budget deficit — that is, a deficit that persists even when the economy is doing well. When the recession struck, hitting revenue in Texas just as it did everywhere else, that illusion was bound to collapse.
The only thing that let Gov. Rick Perry get away, temporarily, with claims of a surplus was the fact that Texas enacts budgets only once every two years, and the last budget was put in place before the depth of the economic downturn was clear. Now the next budget must be passed — and Texas may have a $25 billion hole to fill. Now what?
Given the complete dominance of conservative ideology in Texas politics, tax increases are out of the question. So it has to be spending cuts.
Texas is already close to the bottom of the country in money spent per pupil for public education, and leads the nation in the number of people without health insurance. So where are they going to cut now?
This was abridged and paraphrased from the following column, for those who want to read the whole thing:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/07/opinion/07krugman.html
wardd
01-07-2011, 01:05 PM
2 conservative icons ireland and texas are both in trouble
do i hear anybody say tax the rich their share?
do i hear anybody say tax the rich their share?
mark775
01-07-2011, 01:15 PM
I came one day from getting to fish with Neil Bush - then he ditched me for... I forget why. Oh yeah, that savings and loan tthing came up. He's no longer there, right? Are you sure he came out smelling like a rose? Don't let envy get the better of you. Also, it is inflamatory and rude to paint businessmen in the same light as politicians.
"no one has answered my question of what is money and why does it exist and what happens to an economy when a disproportionate percentage of it is allowed to accumulate in a very few hands."
Pretty simple to look up, thanks, Hoyt. In short, it allows one man to barter with another man if the other man only has something a third man wants. Mix 'em all up and everybody goes home with what they want. You get it? Betty baker sells a loaf of bread to a Bobby butcher but doesn't eat meat (but sure likes the bone!). Rather than take a dead pig home then, in turn, barter that for a quart of hummus, she takes money to Hameed the hummus man who rushes to Bobby, discovers there is only animal protein forbade in verses 2:173, 5:3, 6:145, and 16:115. Hameed read from his Qur'an "He has only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and any (food) over which the name of other than Allah has been invoked." so he blows all three of them up. Allah ak..BOOM!
Hmm, it didn't work in that example but you get the idea.
With no gold or silver standard, money also allows your F'ing government to print more dollars so that they can spend more. This is perhaps the most critical function of money as we know it today.
This vision you have about a few mizers hoarding their cash demonstrates a childlike view you have of the world, Double D. I'm sorry, but you'll never be capable of grasping an adult perspective if you havn't by now. You are a woman? Often that is the culprit - dolls and make-up and such do not prepare one for the man's world which includes alien subject matter like...reality. You are forgiven and certainly able to interject but please don't be offended and bear in mind that you are at a distinct disadvantage. Even very, very smart people (e.g., Barack Obama) when embracing their feminine side (usually because of confusion wrought of single parent upbringing or exposure to an influential liberal arts prof. at a young age) can F things up that have to do with the real world, the adult world.
The following is an ad. The guy is trying to sell his book or whatever. But listen, just listen while you do something else. I'll bet you stop doing the other thing and concentrate on the words on the screen. If not, you are the type of one of those that will be running in circles screaming (I have actually only seen this twice in my life. It is disturbing and doesn't really get much accomplished. One stabbing victim, one car accident witness) or looting some guy's house because he left to the country to get away from you:
http://www.stansberryresearch.com/pro/1011PSIENDVD/PPSILC41/PR
If you ex out of it, then ex out of the "are you sure", you can just read the thing.
"no one has answered my question of what is money and why does it exist and what happens to an economy when a disproportionate percentage of it is allowed to accumulate in a very few hands."
Pretty simple to look up, thanks, Hoyt. In short, it allows one man to barter with another man if the other man only has something a third man wants. Mix 'em all up and everybody goes home with what they want. You get it? Betty baker sells a loaf of bread to a Bobby butcher but doesn't eat meat (but sure likes the bone!). Rather than take a dead pig home then, in turn, barter that for a quart of hummus, she takes money to Hameed the hummus man who rushes to Bobby, discovers there is only animal protein forbade in verses 2:173, 5:3, 6:145, and 16:115. Hameed read from his Qur'an "He has only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and any (food) over which the name of other than Allah has been invoked." so he blows all three of them up. Allah ak..BOOM!
Hmm, it didn't work in that example but you get the idea.
With no gold or silver standard, money also allows your F'ing government to print more dollars so that they can spend more. This is perhaps the most critical function of money as we know it today.
This vision you have about a few mizers hoarding their cash demonstrates a childlike view you have of the world, Double D. I'm sorry, but you'll never be capable of grasping an adult perspective if you havn't by now. You are a woman? Often that is the culprit - dolls and make-up and such do not prepare one for the man's world which includes alien subject matter like...reality. You are forgiven and certainly able to interject but please don't be offended and bear in mind that you are at a distinct disadvantage. Even very, very smart people (e.g., Barack Obama) when embracing their feminine side (usually because of confusion wrought of single parent upbringing or exposure to an influential liberal arts prof. at a young age) can F things up that have to do with the real world, the adult world.
The following is an ad. The guy is trying to sell his book or whatever. But listen, just listen while you do something else. I'll bet you stop doing the other thing and concentrate on the words on the screen. If not, you are the type of one of those that will be running in circles screaming (I have actually only seen this twice in my life. It is disturbing and doesn't really get much accomplished. One stabbing victim, one car accident witness) or looting some guy's house because he left to the country to get away from you:
http://www.stansberryresearch.com/pro/1011PSIENDVD/PPSILC41/PR
If you ex out of it, then ex out of the "are you sure", you can just read the thing.
mark775
01-07-2011, 01:18 PM
Jeez, Wad, you just dig yourself deeper. Texas is in far better shape to weather this than most. There is already a progressive tax system in place, whereby the more you make, the higher percentage of the more you make has to be paid. The top 10% pays something like 40% of the taxes. The net effect is that the bottom half of the US population pays no tax. Get it, ya knucklehead, that 50% are net drains on society?
wardd
01-07-2011, 01:47 PM
Jeez, Wad, you just dig yourself deeper. Texas is in far better shape to weather this than most. There is already a progressive tax system in place, whereby the more you make, the higher percentage of the more you make has to be paid. The top 10% pays something like 40% of the taxes. The net effect is that the bottom half of the US population pays no tax. Get it, ya knucklehead, that 50% are net drains on society?
what planet do you live on?
the poor pay a far greater percentage of their money in taxes when you consider all taxes and not just cherry pick and buffet disagrees with you and i'm sure he knows a lot more about being rich and taxes on the rich than you do
what planet do you live on?
the poor pay a far greater percentage of their money in taxes when you consider all taxes and not just cherry pick and buffet disagrees with you and i'm sure he knows a lot more about being rich and taxes on the rich than you do
mark775
01-07-2011, 02:08 PM
Buffet is senile, and it is very easy for a ultra wealthy Gates or Buffet to say the rich should pay more taxes. They could give 90% away and still be rich!
The poor pay a little tax (not if they are below the povety level of what $12,000? but realistically, $40,000 is poor in today's world) but they get it back in services! The bottom 50% are net drains on society, I repeat...and don't even get me into the intangables of having to look at their litter, broken cars, drugs, government programs that are not specifically directed at poor but the poor avail themselves to, broken countries because of politicians catering to them for the vote (seriously, I tell you this though you will not believe, "One cannot have more than say, a Fruit-Loop rattling around in that skull or, at most, a muffin and two wires, and still think like a liberal. The entire premise is just retarded or evil - take your pick."
How do you buy anything that guy (Buffet) says when, wasn't he the one, pushes corn ethanol, windmills and ****?
The poor pay a little tax (not if they are below the povety level of what $12,000? but realistically, $40,000 is poor in today's world) but they get it back in services! The bottom 50% are net drains on society, I repeat...and don't even get me into the intangables of having to look at their litter, broken cars, drugs, government programs that are not specifically directed at poor but the poor avail themselves to, broken countries because of politicians catering to them for the vote (seriously, I tell you this though you will not believe, "One cannot have more than say, a Fruit-Loop rattling around in that skull or, at most, a muffin and two wires, and still think like a liberal. The entire premise is just retarded or evil - take your pick."
How do you buy anything that guy (Buffet) says when, wasn't he the one, pushes corn ethanol, windmills and ****?
troy2000
01-07-2011, 02:10 PM
Jeez, Wad, you just dig yourself deeper. Texas is in far better shape to weather this than most. There is already a progressive tax system in place, whereby the more you make, the higher percentage of the more you make has to be paid. The top 10% pays something like 40% of the taxes. The net effect is that the bottom half of the US population pays no tax. Get it, ya knucklehead, that 50% are net drains on society?
Ummm... the whole point of my post was that Texas isn't in better shape to weather this recession than most states. It's basically in the same toilet California is in. As a matter of fact, it may be in worse shape, because its budgets had built-in deficits hidden in them even when times were good.
"Net drain on society"?!?
Even the most rabidly big government-loving liberals don't presume to judge a man's worth to society by how much he's worth to the IRS.
People who don't pay federal income taxes still pay sales taxes, and pay for all the hidden taxes that are built into everything they buy -- including the income tax paid by the store owners. They also pay property taxes (either directly, or with the rent their landlords collect).
The busboys and dishwashers at local restaurants usually don't make enough to file income tax returns. Are you claiming they're making no contribution to society when they provide you with clean dishes to eat from, and take them from the table when you're done? How about gardeners and yard boys? Are they a drain on society when they mow a lawn? How about convenience store clerks, who are behind the counter when you want a snack or some aspirin at midnight? Are they a drain on society, instead of a contributor?
I'd say the fact that so many working men and women in this country don't make enough to pay income tax is an indictment of the country's wage structure, not of its workers.
Ummm... the whole point of my post was that Texas isn't in better shape to weather this recession than most states. It's basically in the same toilet California is in. As a matter of fact, it may be in worse shape, because its budgets had built-in deficits hidden in them even when times were good.
"Net drain on society"?!?
Even the most rabidly big government-loving liberals don't presume to judge a man's worth to society by how much he's worth to the IRS.
People who don't pay federal income taxes still pay sales taxes, and pay for all the hidden taxes that are built into everything they buy -- including the income tax paid by the store owners. They also pay property taxes (either directly, or with the rent their landlords collect).
The busboys and dishwashers at local restaurants usually don't make enough to file income tax returns. Are you claiming they're making no contribution to society when they provide you with clean dishes to eat from, and take them from the table when you're done? How about gardeners and yard boys? Are they a drain on society when they mow a lawn? How about convenience store clerks, who are behind the counter when you want a snack or some aspirin at midnight? Are they a drain on society, instead of a contributor?
I'd say the fact that so many working men and women in this country don't make enough to pay income tax is an indictment of the country's wage structure, not of its workers.
troy2000
01-07-2011, 02:16 PM
Buffet is senile, and it is very easy for a ultra wealthy Gates or Buffet to say the rich should pay more taxes. They could give 90% away and still be rich!
How do you buy anything that guy says when, wasn't he the one, pushes corn ethanol windmills and ****?
I should be so senile. Buffet's still finding ways to make money hand-over-fist, no matter which way the economy goes.
You're probably thinking of T. Boone Pickens when it comes to alternative energy; he's been a lot more visible in the field. But both of them have made substantial investments in it; they're willing to put their money where their mouth is. Considering the track records those two have, I wouldn't bet against them.
How do you buy anything that guy says when, wasn't he the one, pushes corn ethanol windmills and ****?
I should be so senile. Buffet's still finding ways to make money hand-over-fist, no matter which way the economy goes.
You're probably thinking of T. Boone Pickens when it comes to alternative energy; he's been a lot more visible in the field. But both of them have made substantial investments in it; they're willing to put their money where their mouth is. Considering the track records those two have, I wouldn't bet against them.
mark775
01-07-2011, 02:26 PM
Yeah, it was Pickens. Senile, as well. I don't pay any more attention to these anomalies than I do Hollywood.
Net financial drains. You knew of what I was talking.
Net financial drains. You knew of what I was talking.
mark775
01-07-2011, 02:29 PM
I noticed that this is all taking place on the AGW thread. Well, economics or AGW, we disagree on both...
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 02:39 PM
http://www.prairieghosts.com/falls_sky.html
One of the strangest stories of this sort took place on March 3, 1876 when flakes of meat fell over an area 100 yards long and 50 yards wide near the Bath, Kentucky home of Mr. and Mrs. Allen Crouch. The sky was clear at the time of the fall and the flakes of meat were described as being one to three or four inches square and appeared to be fresh beef. However, according to two gentlemen who (for some reason) decided to taste the meat, it was neither mutton nor venison.
One of the strangest stories of this sort took place on March 3, 1876 when flakes of meat fell over an area 100 yards long and 50 yards wide near the Bath, Kentucky home of Mr. and Mrs. Allen Crouch. The sky was clear at the time of the fall and the flakes of meat were described as being one to three or four inches square and appeared to be fresh beef. However, according to two gentlemen who (for some reason) decided to taste the meat, it was neither mutton nor venison.
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 02:42 PM
Rapid Global Climate Shift = hard times aheadRapid Global Climate Shift = bovine scat
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 02:43 PM
2 conservative icons ireland and texas are both in trouble
do i hear anybody say tax the rich their share?I demand the rich be taxed their share; the same percentage as everyone else!
do i hear anybody say tax the rich their share?I demand the rich be taxed their share; the same percentage as everyone else!
CatBuilder
01-07-2011, 02:46 PM
http://www.prairieghosts.com/falls_sky.html
One of the strangest stories of this sort took place on March 3, 1876 when flakes of meat fell over an area 100 yards long and 50 yards wide near the Bath, Kentucky home of Mr. and Mrs. Allen Crouch. The sky was clear at the time of the fall and the flakes of meat were described as being one to three or four inches square and appeared to be fresh beef. However, according to two gentlemen who (for some reason) decided to taste the meat, it was neither mutton nor venison.
WOW! Free dinner!
One of the strangest stories of this sort took place on March 3, 1876 when flakes of meat fell over an area 100 yards long and 50 yards wide near the Bath, Kentucky home of Mr. and Mrs. Allen Crouch. The sky was clear at the time of the fall and the flakes of meat were described as being one to three or four inches square and appeared to be fresh beef. However, according to two gentlemen who (for some reason) decided to taste the meat, it was neither mutton nor venison.
WOW! Free dinner!
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 02:50 PM
From the same link: During the early morning hours of a day in November 1896, a deluge of dead birds fell from a clear sky above Baton Rouge, Louisiana. They fell in such numbers that contemporary accounts say that they “cluttered the streets of the city”. The birds included wild ducks, catbirds, woodpeckers and many birds of strange plumage, some of them “resembling canaries”. The birds were all dead and fell in heaps throughout the city. The only plausible theory advanced as to the source of the birds was that they had been driven inland by a recent storm along the Florida coast and had been killed by a sudden change in temperature around Baton Rouge. The editors of the Monthly Weather Review stated that storms and temperature changes were common, but bird falls were most assuredly not.
Rapid Global Climate Shift? I think not! (That doesn't mean I don't think, Toody.)
Rapid Global Climate Shift? I think not! (That doesn't mean I don't think, Toody.)
CatBuilder
01-07-2011, 02:55 PM
The net effect is that the bottom half of the US population pays no tax. Get it, ya knucklehead, that 50% are net drains on society?
Mark, you're way off on that.
The bottom pays a higher percentage of their income to taxes than the top.
Why?
The taxes on the following represents a higher percentage of their income, in general: Gasoline, sales tax on necessities, automobile taxes, social security, medicare and FICA, car "registration" taxes and fees, municipal taxes such as a "resident tax", taxes on a pack of cigarettes if they smoke... the list goes on and on and on.
When you look at all taxes paid, not simply income tax, you find that the bottom 50% pay *more* in taxes, as a percentage of their income than the top 50%, who I might add can afford accounting services to be sure they don't overpay.
Just a slight correction...
Mark, you're way off on that.
The bottom pays a higher percentage of their income to taxes than the top.
Why?
The taxes on the following represents a higher percentage of their income, in general: Gasoline, sales tax on necessities, automobile taxes, social security, medicare and FICA, car "registration" taxes and fees, municipal taxes such as a "resident tax", taxes on a pack of cigarettes if they smoke... the list goes on and on and on.
When you look at all taxes paid, not simply income tax, you find that the bottom 50% pay *more* in taxes, as a percentage of their income than the top 50%, who I might add can afford accounting services to be sure they don't overpay.
Just a slight correction...
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 02:57 PM
Remove all exemptions and tax dodges. Base all taxes on spending not income and life will be more fair to everyone.
wardd
01-07-2011, 03:01 PM
Remove all exemptions and tax dodges. Base all taxes on spending not income and life will be more fair to everyone.
since the rich spend a smaller percentage of their income on purchases this would be a big tax cut for them
why are you a traitor to your class?
assuming you're not extreamly rich
since the rich spend a smaller percentage of their income on purchases this would be a big tax cut for them
why are you a traitor to your class?
assuming you're not extreamly rich
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 03:04 PM
Never assume.
wardd
01-07-2011, 03:05 PM
if you are then that explains your class warfare on the lower classes
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 03:06 PM
Kiss my royal Irish a....
mark775
01-07-2011, 03:39 PM
yes, you are right, Cat, but with the exception of Medicare, FICA and residence, they are all voluntary. Personally, I like to see more lotto, too - the quintessential tax on people bad at math. The poor are the only ones that fall for this state-run gambit so they are the only ones paying that tax!
I remember a lotto in Washington State, I think, where there was going to be some huge payout but only a certain number of tickets sold so, in effect, the odds were in the favor of the ticket buyers! Guess what happened, A consortium of moneyed individuals went and bought half of all the tickets!
Another thing, as long as my taxes pay for a poor person's rent, medicine, or whatever, he'd damned well better not be smoking cigarrettes (another tax on uneducated and poor), have pets, cell phones, Ipods, big screen TVs, etc.. Do you know any poor people? They ALL have a big screen TV! The first piece of furniture!
I remember a lotto in Washington State, I think, where there was going to be some huge payout but only a certain number of tickets sold so, in effect, the odds were in the favor of the ticket buyers! Guess what happened, A consortium of moneyed individuals went and bought half of all the tickets!
Another thing, as long as my taxes pay for a poor person's rent, medicine, or whatever, he'd damned well better not be smoking cigarrettes (another tax on uneducated and poor), have pets, cell phones, Ipods, big screen TVs, etc.. Do you know any poor people? They ALL have a big screen TV! The first piece of furniture!
wardd
01-07-2011, 03:40 PM
Kiss my royal Irish a....
i thought you were dutch
i thought you were dutch
troy2000
01-07-2011, 04:08 PM
Getting back to the remark about people being drains on society, here's an interesting little bit of trivia from the Tax Foundation: 50% of Alaska residents pay no federal income tax. For California residents, the number is 20%.
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1410.html
More trivia::)
Federal Spending Received Per Dollar of Taxes Paid by State, 2005
Alaska: $1.84
New York: $0.79
California: $0.78
http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/266.html
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1410.html
More trivia::)
Federal Spending Received Per Dollar of Taxes Paid by State, 2005
Alaska: $1.84
New York: $0.79
California: $0.78
http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/266.html
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 04:54 PM
i thought you were dutch
Kiss my royal armer Esel...
Kiss my royal armer Esel...
wardd
01-07-2011, 04:56 PM
don't you mean royal dutch shell?
hoytedow
01-07-2011, 05:51 PM
Toody smaht. Evaboddy els dum. Nooooooboddy edgeikated like Toody.
mark775
01-07-2011, 06:44 PM
Come-on, Troy, You know we have a huge native population here and almost all of the spending is either something to do with them (and they're not paying taxes) or something to do with the military. You want to get into what Alaska oil has done and will do for the US, and its proximity to Japan and Russia have done for the US militarily?
I think each person's share of the non-defence national debt is something like $60,000. I'll gladly pay my shares and say "don't give us any more!" Alaska is actually one of the most independent states of the union... and don't get me wrong! I am no "big time" Alaskan. It's just where I do some business, I like it here, and were I alone, I would retire here (It's not much of a place for women), so don't think I need to stick up for the place! Again, this is happening on the climate thread (on Boatdesign.net?!?!?) I'll stop now and let some people talk about SAGW.
I think each person's share of the non-defence national debt is something like $60,000. I'll gladly pay my shares and say "don't give us any more!" Alaska is actually one of the most independent states of the union... and don't get me wrong! I am no "big time" Alaskan. It's just where I do some business, I like it here, and were I alone, I would retire here (It's not much of a place for women), so don't think I need to stick up for the place! Again, this is happening on the climate thread (on Boatdesign.net?!?!?) I'll stop now and let some people talk about SAGW.
Boston
01-07-2011, 11:05 PM
just discovered one of my long time friends was a climate deniers
oh what a world
I'll have her straightened out in no time tho
oh and I invited her come on over and read through some of our crap
might get interesting if she joins the discussion
she's kinda a firecracker you guys would love her
oh what a world
I'll have her straightened out in no time tho
oh and I invited her come on over and read through some of our crap
might get interesting if she joins the discussion
she's kinda a firecracker you guys would love her
mark775
01-07-2011, 11:14 PM
Send her up
troy2000
01-07-2011, 11:25 PM
Come-on, Troy, You know we have a huge native population here and almost all of the spending is either something to do with them (and they're not paying taxes) or something to do with the military. You want to get into what Alaska oil has done and will do for the US, and its proximity to Japan and Russia have done for the US militarily?
I think each person's share of the non-defence national debt is something like $60,000. I'll gladly pay my shares and say "don't give us any more!" Alaska is actually one of the most independent states of the union... and don't get me wrong! I am no "big time" Alaskan. It's just where I do some business, I like it here, and were I alone, I would retire here (It's not much of a place for women), so don't think I need to stick up for the place! Again, this is happening on the climate thread (on Boatdesign.net?!?!?) I'll stop now and let some people talk about SAGW.
I've brought this subject up before. Don't get me wrong. As I've stated in the past, I have no particular problem with the fact that Alaska is 'a net drain on society.' There are explanations for it, which I not only understand but consider to be valid and reasonable.
What I object to is the steady parade of Alaskans who come online (particularly on gun forums) to boast about their frontier-style self-reliance, and carry on about how they're tired of paying California's way and bailing us out -- when in reality, Californians are paying to keep Alaska afloat instead.
I think each person's share of the non-defence national debt is something like $60,000. I'll gladly pay my shares and say "don't give us any more!" Alaska is actually one of the most independent states of the union... and don't get me wrong! I am no "big time" Alaskan. It's just where I do some business, I like it here, and were I alone, I would retire here (It's not much of a place for women), so don't think I need to stick up for the place! Again, this is happening on the climate thread (on Boatdesign.net?!?!?) I'll stop now and let some people talk about SAGW.
I've brought this subject up before. Don't get me wrong. As I've stated in the past, I have no particular problem with the fact that Alaska is 'a net drain on society.' There are explanations for it, which I not only understand but consider to be valid and reasonable.
What I object to is the steady parade of Alaskans who come online (particularly on gun forums) to boast about their frontier-style self-reliance, and carry on about how they're tired of paying California's way and bailing us out -- when in reality, Californians are paying to keep Alaska afloat instead.
mark775
01-08-2011, 01:48 AM
That's not true! - You are forgetting the oil part of the equation! You are forgetting the defense part of the equation!
Are you gonna' call Guamians or Samoans "net drains on society", too, even though we don't do much for them at all but have military bases there? We spend billions on those military bases - it's the same thing. You really should come to Alaska one day. The road system is miniscule, the transportation (ferries) is State, The road sysytem is pretty much from one military base to another with some state-built roads in between. To get matching funds for a hwy project recently, I guess there is a Fed law that there has to be bike paths now, seperated from the hwy by a safety zone. So, several miles of road was cut over one hundred fifty miles from the nearest house with a bike path alongside meandering through the trees! Were it I, I wouldn't take the money. I wish the state had seceded from the union when the AIP, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaskan_Independence_Party , was pushing that hard about fifteen years ago. You people have made such a mess of things and its going to get worse.
Are you gonna' call Guamians or Samoans "net drains on society", too, even though we don't do much for them at all but have military bases there? We spend billions on those military bases - it's the same thing. You really should come to Alaska one day. The road system is miniscule, the transportation (ferries) is State, The road sysytem is pretty much from one military base to another with some state-built roads in between. To get matching funds for a hwy project recently, I guess there is a Fed law that there has to be bike paths now, seperated from the hwy by a safety zone. So, several miles of road was cut over one hundred fifty miles from the nearest house with a bike path alongside meandering through the trees! Were it I, I wouldn't take the money. I wish the state had seceded from the union when the AIP, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaskan_Independence_Party , was pushing that hard about fifteen years ago. You people have made such a mess of things and its going to get worse.
hoytedow
01-08-2011, 05:13 AM
just discovered one of my long time friends was a climate deniers
oh what a world
I'll have her straightened out in no time tho
oh and I invited her come on over and read through some of our crap
might get interesting if she joins the discussion
she's kinda a firecracker you guys would love herHave her read this thread.
All your arguments are here.
Yeah, that will work.:rolleyes:
:P:P:P
oh what a world
I'll have her straightened out in no time tho
oh and I invited her come on over and read through some of our crap
might get interesting if she joins the discussion
she's kinda a firecracker you guys would love herHave her read this thread.
All your arguments are here.
Yeah, that will work.:rolleyes:
:P:P:P
hoytedow
01-08-2011, 05:17 AM
That's not true! - You are forgetting the oil part of the equation! You are forgetting the defense part of the equation!
Are you gonna' call Guamians or Samoans "net drains on society", too, even though we don't do much for them at all but have military bases there? We spend billions on those military bases - it's the same thing. You really should come to Alaska one day. The road system is miniscule, the transportation (ferries) is State, The road sysytem is pretty much from one military base to another with some state-built roads in between. To get matching funds for a hwy project recently, I guess there is a Fed law that there has to be bike paths now, seperated from the hwy by a safety zone. So, several miles of road was cut over one hundred fifty miles from the nearest house with a bike path alongside meandering through the trees! Were it I, I wouldn't take the money. I wish the state had seceded from the union when the AIP, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaskan_Independence_Party , was pushing that hard about fifteen years ago. You people have made such a mess of things and its going to get worse.Guamians and Samoans have probably done more for us than we have for them, on balance. There was a certain George Tweed of the USN for whom many Guamians, or Chamorros, gave their lives keeping him out of Japaneses hands. Samoans make the Pelosi's wealthy without the benefit of a minimum wage(conflict of interest by Pelosi as a lawmaker).
Are you gonna' call Guamians or Samoans "net drains on society", too, even though we don't do much for them at all but have military bases there? We spend billions on those military bases - it's the same thing. You really should come to Alaska one day. The road system is miniscule, the transportation (ferries) is State, The road sysytem is pretty much from one military base to another with some state-built roads in between. To get matching funds for a hwy project recently, I guess there is a Fed law that there has to be bike paths now, seperated from the hwy by a safety zone. So, several miles of road was cut over one hundred fifty miles from the nearest house with a bike path alongside meandering through the trees! Were it I, I wouldn't take the money. I wish the state had seceded from the union when the AIP, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaskan_Independence_Party , was pushing that hard about fifteen years ago. You people have made such a mess of things and its going to get worse.Guamians and Samoans have probably done more for us than we have for them, on balance. There was a certain George Tweed of the USN for whom many Guamians, or Chamorros, gave their lives keeping him out of Japaneses hands. Samoans make the Pelosi's wealthy without the benefit of a minimum wage(conflict of interest by Pelosi as a lawmaker).
Boston
01-08-2011, 06:11 AM
she's still seething over my having disagreed with her on her view that the magnetic pole shift is causing the ice caps to melt
I'm completely baffled how in the world the magnetic shift could effect ice at the poles but oh did I ever set her off by suggesting that the only way that could happen was if there was some reduction in its strength that consequently effected total solar iradiance
which it hasn't based on direct measurements of solar iradiance, magnetic field strength and the last 100 years or so of ice loss. There is no correlation. She went ballistic, and likely will again if she actually gets on here and reads this.
I"d really never seen her freak before but wow
ya shoulda been a fly on the wall
I'm completely baffled how in the world the magnetic shift could effect ice at the poles but oh did I ever set her off by suggesting that the only way that could happen was if there was some reduction in its strength that consequently effected total solar iradiance
which it hasn't based on direct measurements of solar iradiance, magnetic field strength and the last 100 years or so of ice loss. There is no correlation. She went ballistic, and likely will again if she actually gets on here and reads this.
I"d really never seen her freak before but wow
ya shoulda been a fly on the wall
hoytedow
01-08-2011, 07:02 AM
Or, a circle fly, more like.
hoytedow
01-08-2011, 07:06 AM
Obama and the Circle Flies
A cowboy from Texas attends a social function where Barack Obama is trying to gather more support for NASA. Once he discovers the cowboy is from President Bush’s home area, he starts to belittle him by talking in a southern drawl and single syllable words.
As he was doing that, he kept swatting at some flies that were buzzing around his head. The cowboy says, “Y’all havin’ some problem with them circle flies?”
Obama stopped talking and said, “Well, yes, if that’s what they’re called, but I’ve never heard of circle flies.”
“Well Sir,” the cowboy replies, “circle flies hang around ranches. They’re called circle flies because they’re almost always found circling around the back end of a horse.”
“Oh,” Obama replies as he goes back to rambling. But, a moment later he stops and bluntly asks, “Are you calling me a horse’s ass?”
“No, Sir,” the cowboy replies, “I have too much respect for the citizens of this country to call their President a horse’s ass.”
“That’s a good thing,” Obama responds and begins rambling on once more.
After a long pause, the cowboy, in his best Texas drawl says, “Hard to fool them flies, though.”
Originally told on another site about health care but its all BS anyway.
A cowboy from Texas attends a social function where Barack Obama is trying to gather more support for NASA. Once he discovers the cowboy is from President Bush’s home area, he starts to belittle him by talking in a southern drawl and single syllable words.
As he was doing that, he kept swatting at some flies that were buzzing around his head. The cowboy says, “Y’all havin’ some problem with them circle flies?”
Obama stopped talking and said, “Well, yes, if that’s what they’re called, but I’ve never heard of circle flies.”
“Well Sir,” the cowboy replies, “circle flies hang around ranches. They’re called circle flies because they’re almost always found circling around the back end of a horse.”
“Oh,” Obama replies as he goes back to rambling. But, a moment later he stops and bluntly asks, “Are you calling me a horse’s ass?”
“No, Sir,” the cowboy replies, “I have too much respect for the citizens of this country to call their President a horse’s ass.”
“That’s a good thing,” Obama responds and begins rambling on once more.
After a long pause, the cowboy, in his best Texas drawl says, “Hard to fool them flies, though.”
Originally told on another site about health care but its all BS anyway.
CatBuilder
01-08-2011, 09:04 AM
I've brought this subject up before. Don't get me wrong. As I've stated in the past, I have no particular problem with the fact that Alaska is 'a net drain on society.' There are explanations for it, which I not only understand but consider to be valid and reasonable.
What I object to is the steady parade of Alaskans who come online (particularly on gun forums) to boast about their frontier-style self-reliance, and carry on about how they're tired of paying California's way and bailing us out -- when in reality, Californians are paying to keep Alaska afloat instead.
Check mate.
I think Troy proves a valid point here. Just as we were saying some people were "net drains on society" because they don't pay income taxes that are as high as others, or possibly no income taxes at all due to being poor, we see this factual information about Alaska.
A direct comparison to the working poor can be made with the state of Alaska:
The working poor pay a tiny bit if taxes, if any at all, yet are entitled to receive all the same benefits a "more wealthy" person does.
Same story with Alaska as a state.
Mark argues that Alaska is a net producer because it has natural resources. Guess what? The working poor are also net producers because they are putting resources (labor) into society for a very *very* cheap rate. Labor and oil are both commodities that add to society's overall production or GDP.
I like many of your posts, Mark, but I think this time Troy really nailed it. Oil and labor are both resources. Both Alaska and the working poor are "welfare cases" when it comes to tax revenue, but both add something to the economy and society that is beneficial: Alaska adds cheap oil. The working poor add cheap labor.
The similarities are striking.
What I object to is the steady parade of Alaskans who come online (particularly on gun forums) to boast about their frontier-style self-reliance, and carry on about how they're tired of paying California's way and bailing us out -- when in reality, Californians are paying to keep Alaska afloat instead.
Check mate.
I think Troy proves a valid point here. Just as we were saying some people were "net drains on society" because they don't pay income taxes that are as high as others, or possibly no income taxes at all due to being poor, we see this factual information about Alaska.
A direct comparison to the working poor can be made with the state of Alaska:
The working poor pay a tiny bit if taxes, if any at all, yet are entitled to receive all the same benefits a "more wealthy" person does.
Same story with Alaska as a state.
Mark argues that Alaska is a net producer because it has natural resources. Guess what? The working poor are also net producers because they are putting resources (labor) into society for a very *very* cheap rate. Labor and oil are both commodities that add to society's overall production or GDP.
I like many of your posts, Mark, but I think this time Troy really nailed it. Oil and labor are both resources. Both Alaska and the working poor are "welfare cases" when it comes to tax revenue, but both add something to the economy and society that is beneficial: Alaska adds cheap oil. The working poor add cheap labor.
The similarities are striking.
troy2000
01-08-2011, 09:07 AM
That's not true! - You are forgetting the oil part of the equation! You are forgetting the defense part of the equation!
Are you gonna' call Guamians or Samoans "net drains on society", too, even though we don't do much for them at all but have military bases there? We spend billions on those military bases - it's the same thing. You really should come to Alaska one day. The road system is miniscule, the transportation (ferries) is State, The road sysytem is pretty much from one military base to another with some state-built roads in between. To get matching funds for a hwy project recently, I guess there is a Fed law that there has to be bike paths now, seperated from the hwy by a safety zone. So, several miles of road was cut over one hundred fifty miles from the nearest house with a bike path alongside meandering through the trees! Were it I, I wouldn't take the money. I wish the state had seceded from the union when the AIP, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaskan_Independence_Party , was pushing that hard about fifteen years ago. You people have made such a mess of things and its going to get worse.
I'm using pretty much the same definition of 'net drain on society' for Alaska that you used for individuals.:)
And Alaskans have been grabbing federal funds having nothing to do with oil, indigenous people or the military for years, especially Homeland Security funds. I didn't realize how good they had gotten at it, until I started looking it up this morning.
• Between 2003 and 2007, Wasilla received at least $1.4 million in homeland security grants, including $987,550 from the Assistance to Firefighters Grant program, for which fire departments apply to the Federal Emergency Management Agency on their own. The state of Alaska received $18.2 million from the assistance to firefighters program between 2002-2008 on top of what it had already won in other homeland security grants.
• Using $244,500 in funding from the 2005 grant cycle, Wasilla constructed a 100-foot tall communications tower for its small police force. An additional $148,000 came during 2007, to improve law enforcement communications and to raise the new tower 50 feet after the city realized the one it built wasn't tall enough.
The borough that surrounds Wasilla – Alaska's equivalent of a county jurisdiction – has received at least $2.8 million in grants from the Homeland Security Department over the last five years. The Matanuska-Susitna Borough, or Mat-Su as locals call it, spent nearly $70,000 to install security equipment at two fire stations in Wasilla and also acquired a $410,000 mobile command communications vehicle outfitted with a conference room and an incinerator toilet. It's kept in Wasilla, as is a $427,000 hazardous materials truck the borough purchased that contains a computer program for plotting potentially deadly chemical plumes.
Wasilla has further enjoyed a windfall of federal money for other public safety purposes outside of Homeland Security Department grants. That amount is more than $5 million since 2006 alone, mostly from earmarks.
City budget documents show that Wasilla had a total operating budget in 2008 of $13.7 million. But it received for its small police department $986,643 in federal aid for radio repeaters and to outfit its patrol cars with wireless mobile computers, which connect to police headquarters and an emergency dispatch center.
Records also show that Wasilla was granted $4.2 million in federal earmarks last year from Congress for a pilot broadband communications project designed to link law enforcement and medical personnel together between Wasilla and the Mat-Su Borough allowing them to, among other things, transmit video and audio back and forth. Local officials say the project is one-of-a-kind in the state.
Wasilla is by no means the only rural, lightly populated Alaska town benefiting from the post-9/11 surge in federal largesse. The city of Whittier located 60 miles southeast of Anchorage has a population of about 175 people. But it boasts of attracting tourists and various cruise lines. It spent $28,400 in federal grants to purchase two SABRE 3000 Anthrax detectors, $24,000 on an "incident command vehicle" and $15,000 for two Kawasaki 4x4 ATVs with winches, state records show.
There's never been a reported case of Anthrax infection in Alaska history, according to the state's Department of Health and Social Services.
The western Alaska port city of Bethel, with fewer than 6,000 people, spent $6,287 to buy a "surveillance shotgun listening device," $44,000 on seven ATVs and $22,000 for video surveillance of its water treatment plant.
The fishing village of Dillingham in southwestern Alaska, which contains about 2,500 people, spent $2,050 on an "impact-resistant door" and $202,000 on a wireless surveillance system that blanketed its downtown and port areas with 80 cameras. The cameras so irked some local residents leery of government intrusion that the longtime mayor who pursued them, Chris Napoli, resigned under persistent criticism in 2006.
The borough that surrounds Wasilla, Matanuska-Susitna, also benefited from federal funds. It has more governmental responsibility than Wasilla overseeing schools and fire emergencies, for example. It is an area of south central Alaska about the size of West Virginia and has roughly 80,000 people.
According to an examination of state spending records, of the nearly $3 million it received in Homeland Security grants since 2003, the borough spent $66,200 to install surveillance cameras and a key-card entry system at two fire stations in Wasilla, $25,000 on infrared cameras, $14,277 on four laptops and $2,193 on 15 bullhorns. Borough officials also acquired a $410,000 mobile command communications vehicle specially outfitted with a four-wheel drive chassis to accommodate Alaska's rugged terrain, a conference room with a projector screen and an incinerator toilet, which operates without water.
Another $60,000 in grant funds was needed to outfit the new truck with interoperable radios that could reach the state's emergency communications system, and $70,769 more was spent installing a satellite system for Internet access and video conferences.
http://centerforinvestigativereporting.org/tags/sarahpalin
I'm putting the computer away now; see everyone Monday evening. Enjoy your weekend.
Are you gonna' call Guamians or Samoans "net drains on society", too, even though we don't do much for them at all but have military bases there? We spend billions on those military bases - it's the same thing. You really should come to Alaska one day. The road system is miniscule, the transportation (ferries) is State, The road sysytem is pretty much from one military base to another with some state-built roads in between. To get matching funds for a hwy project recently, I guess there is a Fed law that there has to be bike paths now, seperated from the hwy by a safety zone. So, several miles of road was cut over one hundred fifty miles from the nearest house with a bike path alongside meandering through the trees! Were it I, I wouldn't take the money. I wish the state had seceded from the union when the AIP, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaskan_Independence_Party , was pushing that hard about fifteen years ago. You people have made such a mess of things and its going to get worse.
I'm using pretty much the same definition of 'net drain on society' for Alaska that you used for individuals.:)
And Alaskans have been grabbing federal funds having nothing to do with oil, indigenous people or the military for years, especially Homeland Security funds. I didn't realize how good they had gotten at it, until I started looking it up this morning.
• Between 2003 and 2007, Wasilla received at least $1.4 million in homeland security grants, including $987,550 from the Assistance to Firefighters Grant program, for which fire departments apply to the Federal Emergency Management Agency on their own. The state of Alaska received $18.2 million from the assistance to firefighters program between 2002-2008 on top of what it had already won in other homeland security grants.
• Using $244,500 in funding from the 2005 grant cycle, Wasilla constructed a 100-foot tall communications tower for its small police force. An additional $148,000 came during 2007, to improve law enforcement communications and to raise the new tower 50 feet after the city realized the one it built wasn't tall enough.
The borough that surrounds Wasilla – Alaska's equivalent of a county jurisdiction – has received at least $2.8 million in grants from the Homeland Security Department over the last five years. The Matanuska-Susitna Borough, or Mat-Su as locals call it, spent nearly $70,000 to install security equipment at two fire stations in Wasilla and also acquired a $410,000 mobile command communications vehicle outfitted with a conference room and an incinerator toilet. It's kept in Wasilla, as is a $427,000 hazardous materials truck the borough purchased that contains a computer program for plotting potentially deadly chemical plumes.
Wasilla has further enjoyed a windfall of federal money for other public safety purposes outside of Homeland Security Department grants. That amount is more than $5 million since 2006 alone, mostly from earmarks.
City budget documents show that Wasilla had a total operating budget in 2008 of $13.7 million. But it received for its small police department $986,643 in federal aid for radio repeaters and to outfit its patrol cars with wireless mobile computers, which connect to police headquarters and an emergency dispatch center.
Records also show that Wasilla was granted $4.2 million in federal earmarks last year from Congress for a pilot broadband communications project designed to link law enforcement and medical personnel together between Wasilla and the Mat-Su Borough allowing them to, among other things, transmit video and audio back and forth. Local officials say the project is one-of-a-kind in the state.
Wasilla is by no means the only rural, lightly populated Alaska town benefiting from the post-9/11 surge in federal largesse. The city of Whittier located 60 miles southeast of Anchorage has a population of about 175 people. But it boasts of attracting tourists and various cruise lines. It spent $28,400 in federal grants to purchase two SABRE 3000 Anthrax detectors, $24,000 on an "incident command vehicle" and $15,000 for two Kawasaki 4x4 ATVs with winches, state records show.
There's never been a reported case of Anthrax infection in Alaska history, according to the state's Department of Health and Social Services.
The western Alaska port city of Bethel, with fewer than 6,000 people, spent $6,287 to buy a "surveillance shotgun listening device," $44,000 on seven ATVs and $22,000 for video surveillance of its water treatment plant.
The fishing village of Dillingham in southwestern Alaska, which contains about 2,500 people, spent $2,050 on an "impact-resistant door" and $202,000 on a wireless surveillance system that blanketed its downtown and port areas with 80 cameras. The cameras so irked some local residents leery of government intrusion that the longtime mayor who pursued them, Chris Napoli, resigned under persistent criticism in 2006.
The borough that surrounds Wasilla, Matanuska-Susitna, also benefited from federal funds. It has more governmental responsibility than Wasilla overseeing schools and fire emergencies, for example. It is an area of south central Alaska about the size of West Virginia and has roughly 80,000 people.
According to an examination of state spending records, of the nearly $3 million it received in Homeland Security grants since 2003, the borough spent $66,200 to install surveillance cameras and a key-card entry system at two fire stations in Wasilla, $25,000 on infrared cameras, $14,277 on four laptops and $2,193 on 15 bullhorns. Borough officials also acquired a $410,000 mobile command communications vehicle specially outfitted with a four-wheel drive chassis to accommodate Alaska's rugged terrain, a conference room with a projector screen and an incinerator toilet, which operates without water.
Another $60,000 in grant funds was needed to outfit the new truck with interoperable radios that could reach the state's emergency communications system, and $70,769 more was spent installing a satellite system for Internet access and video conferences.
http://centerforinvestigativereporting.org/tags/sarahpalin
I'm putting the computer away now; see everyone Monday evening. Enjoy your weekend.
wardd
01-08-2011, 10:12 AM
'Sarah Palin's Alaska': one and done? You betcha, says one report.
Entertainment Weekly is reporting that the former half-term governor of Alaska turned reality TV caribou murderer Sarah Palin will not see her TLC program, 'Sarah Palin's Alaska,' return to the air for a second season.
Seems she did as well on tv as she did as governor, not to mention as vp.
Entertainment Weekly is reporting that the former half-term governor of Alaska turned reality TV caribou murderer Sarah Palin will not see her TLC program, 'Sarah Palin's Alaska,' return to the air for a second season.
Seems she did as well on tv as she did as governor, not to mention as vp.
CatBuilder
01-08-2011, 10:36 AM
'Sarah Palin's Alaska': one and done? You betcha, says one report.
Entertainment Weekly is reporting that the former half-term governor of Alaska turned reality TV caribou murderer Sarah Palin will not see her TLC program, 'Sarah Palin's Alaska,' return to the air for a second season.
Seems she did as well on tv as she did as governor, not to mention as vp.
I don't think the GOP even finds that lady to be a viable candidate. She's just a pawn for generating publicity - and it looks like her 15 minutes is nearly up.
Entertainment Weekly is reporting that the former half-term governor of Alaska turned reality TV caribou murderer Sarah Palin will not see her TLC program, 'Sarah Palin's Alaska,' return to the air for a second season.
Seems she did as well on tv as she did as governor, not to mention as vp.
I don't think the GOP even finds that lady to be a viable candidate. She's just a pawn for generating publicity - and it looks like her 15 minutes is nearly up.
wardd
01-08-2011, 10:39 AM
I don't think the GOP even finds that lady to be a viable candidate. She's just a pawn for generating publicity - and it looks like her 15 minutes is nearly up.
for her it was a lucrative 15 minuets
for her it was a lucrative 15 minuets
cthippo
01-08-2011, 12:20 PM
I don't think the GOP even finds that lady to be a viable candidate. She's just a pawn for generating publicity - and it looks like her 15 minutes is nearly up.
They don't find her to be a viable candidate, they find her to be the greatest threat to the GOP brand in a long time. If she runs for the nomination it's going to create a huge circus and if she is nominated no one will take the party seriously for a couple of decades.
Which means I will will be donating generously to her primary campaign fund :D
I don't actually have a problem with the grants. With a bargain basement new fire engine running $200,000 and modern SCBAs close to $5,000 these small towns need all the help they can get. Likewise, Alaska has communications challenges not seen in many other areas and so better systems are a benefit to the public. These grants allow smaller public safety agencies to offer reasonable levels of service to their communities, despite their small tax base.
Oh, wait, that's socialism again, isn't it?
They don't find her to be a viable candidate, they find her to be the greatest threat to the GOP brand in a long time. If she runs for the nomination it's going to create a huge circus and if she is nominated no one will take the party seriously for a couple of decades.
Which means I will will be donating generously to her primary campaign fund :D
I don't actually have a problem with the grants. With a bargain basement new fire engine running $200,000 and modern SCBAs close to $5,000 these small towns need all the help they can get. Likewise, Alaska has communications challenges not seen in many other areas and so better systems are a benefit to the public. These grants allow smaller public safety agencies to offer reasonable levels of service to their communities, despite their small tax base.
Oh, wait, that's socialism again, isn't it?
mark775
01-08-2011, 02:14 PM
You guys are idiots. (Read no further - That about sums it up!) First, Sarah only had intentions for one series of shows.
Second Troy, It is absolutely not the same, giving things to natives to keep them satisfied and in their remote locations rather than deal with their anachronistic, or shall I say "differing" ways and out of society writ large. (not that they wouldn't fit, more that the two societies don't fit that well together). Dillingham and... what'd you say?, Point Hope? No...Bethel. No matter. Notice you didn't say "Nome" or some other non-native town - A big difference there. I really don't know the amount of fed money spent on typical small towns (Wasilla, I assure you, was practically not on the map BSP, Before Sarah Palin) other than that it was probably the fastest growing town in a Alaska in the years you mentioned. Whittier is home to the HydroTrain and is of military and national security significance (the Hydrotrain is a series of large barges brought in tandem from outside. They contain... I'm going way back to when I worked on the Hydrotrain here...something like thirty railcars each and connect to our train system here. Some non-military stuff crosses there but a lot of olive drab, too.
So, I suppose Wasilla was applying for federal funds in its growing pains, and shouldn't have received anything not having to do with national security. It seems like a lot to me because I pay taxes but is the money Wasilla received out of line with what other similar places receive? Was it cherry-picked because you found one of your liberal sources doing investigative reporting to find things wrong with Alaska, in general, and Wasilla, in particular,because Sarah is from there? Everything else you mention is delineating my point exactly.
In short, there is not a lot of "stuff" in Alaska. We've got less road system than any other state though we are nearly as big as all of the outside states combined. The improved parks (parking lots, groomed trails, bathrooms) are state parks. An occasional port facility, arguably for national security, and nothing else. I don't think you get this place. There is not a lot of "stuff". Education, schools? That's your's, the Feds, and the state's bag. Yes, it is more expensive to have a school in the middle of nowhere than it is in a place of existing infrastructure. I wouldn't have any public schools anyway, so don't blame me! At least we don't have this $578M monument to failed government largesse:
52163
Yes, that is a school. You can learn anything from Korean "community union" to hip hop, rap, whatever they call that **** (mathematics, sciences? I'm not so sure...). From the school's introductory page, 50% of the students are "English language learners" (read "largely illegal"), and 89% are low-income. Yes they say it is being payed for by a bond levy on the user group...Uh huh.
None of this addresses the net monetary contribution of a lower income individual. The bottom half of the wage-earners (including those who earn no wages) are a net drain on society. There can be no argument there. They receive more than they give - by the government's own numbers! You progressives are so miotic, you now qualify "worth" with gardening ability? I'm sorry, I never intended to imply that we don't have a place for low wage earners...It's just that in this aspect, "do they take in more dollars than they pay?" the answer is unmitigated, and "yes".
Moving on to California... (Did you mention something about $28,000 "here", $66,000 "there" in Wasilla?) Let's make this short and brutally F'ing (bitter)sweet:
The latest report, http://www.treasurer.ca.gov/bonds/debt/201008/authorized.pdf, from current state Treasurer Bill Lockyer says the state now has $77.8 billion in outstanding general obligation bonds and an additional $42.8 in authorized but unissued bonds. (That's Billions - with a "B"!) General obligation bonds must be paid from revenues coming from the state's general fund. The state doesn't take in that kind of money. There are pensions and a declining revenue base that are going to meet at the point of insolvency. There is not enough **** to sell in California to pay off what is owed and what will be owed. What next - selling off government buildings like Arizona so that you can continue spending like Baracks on payday? Give me a break! California will drag this country to its knees.
Second Troy, It is absolutely not the same, giving things to natives to keep them satisfied and in their remote locations rather than deal with their anachronistic, or shall I say "differing" ways and out of society writ large. (not that they wouldn't fit, more that the two societies don't fit that well together). Dillingham and... what'd you say?, Point Hope? No...Bethel. No matter. Notice you didn't say "Nome" or some other non-native town - A big difference there. I really don't know the amount of fed money spent on typical small towns (Wasilla, I assure you, was practically not on the map BSP, Before Sarah Palin) other than that it was probably the fastest growing town in a Alaska in the years you mentioned. Whittier is home to the HydroTrain and is of military and national security significance (the Hydrotrain is a series of large barges brought in tandem from outside. They contain... I'm going way back to when I worked on the Hydrotrain here...something like thirty railcars each and connect to our train system here. Some non-military stuff crosses there but a lot of olive drab, too.
So, I suppose Wasilla was applying for federal funds in its growing pains, and shouldn't have received anything not having to do with national security. It seems like a lot to me because I pay taxes but is the money Wasilla received out of line with what other similar places receive? Was it cherry-picked because you found one of your liberal sources doing investigative reporting to find things wrong with Alaska, in general, and Wasilla, in particular,because Sarah is from there? Everything else you mention is delineating my point exactly.
In short, there is not a lot of "stuff" in Alaska. We've got less road system than any other state though we are nearly as big as all of the outside states combined. The improved parks (parking lots, groomed trails, bathrooms) are state parks. An occasional port facility, arguably for national security, and nothing else. I don't think you get this place. There is not a lot of "stuff". Education, schools? That's your's, the Feds, and the state's bag. Yes, it is more expensive to have a school in the middle of nowhere than it is in a place of existing infrastructure. I wouldn't have any public schools anyway, so don't blame me! At least we don't have this $578M monument to failed government largesse:
52163
Yes, that is a school. You can learn anything from Korean "community union" to hip hop, rap, whatever they call that **** (mathematics, sciences? I'm not so sure...). From the school's introductory page, 50% of the students are "English language learners" (read "largely illegal"), and 89% are low-income. Yes they say it is being payed for by a bond levy on the user group...Uh huh.
None of this addresses the net monetary contribution of a lower income individual. The bottom half of the wage-earners (including those who earn no wages) are a net drain on society. There can be no argument there. They receive more than they give - by the government's own numbers! You progressives are so miotic, you now qualify "worth" with gardening ability? I'm sorry, I never intended to imply that we don't have a place for low wage earners...It's just that in this aspect, "do they take in more dollars than they pay?" the answer is unmitigated, and "yes".
Moving on to California... (Did you mention something about $28,000 "here", $66,000 "there" in Wasilla?) Let's make this short and brutally F'ing (bitter)sweet:
The latest report, http://www.treasurer.ca.gov/bonds/debt/201008/authorized.pdf, from current state Treasurer Bill Lockyer says the state now has $77.8 billion in outstanding general obligation bonds and an additional $42.8 in authorized but unissued bonds. (That's Billions - with a "B"!) General obligation bonds must be paid from revenues coming from the state's general fund. The state doesn't take in that kind of money. There are pensions and a declining revenue base that are going to meet at the point of insolvency. There is not enough **** to sell in California to pay off what is owed and what will be owed. What next - selling off government buildings like Arizona so that you can continue spending like Baracks on payday? Give me a break! California will drag this country to its knees.
hoytedow
01-08-2011, 02:51 PM
So Troy brought us down to his level and beat us with experience?
mark775
01-08-2011, 03:04 PM
"...that's socialism again, isn't it?" Yes, it is.
The more I hear the loony left make fun of Sarah Palin, the more I think I need to throw my full support behind her. There are some conservatives that don't like her or yet trust her. Let's see..who would she have to beat? Not Barack (my cat could beat that idiot now), maybe Hillary or Joe Biden? John Edwards? John Kerry? This is going to be fun!
The more I hear the loony left make fun of Sarah Palin, the more I think I need to throw my full support behind her. There are some conservatives that don't like her or yet trust her. Let's see..who would she have to beat? Not Barack (my cat could beat that idiot now), maybe Hillary or Joe Biden? John Edwards? John Kerry? This is going to be fun!
wardd
01-08-2011, 03:15 PM
"...that's socialism again, isn't it?" Yes, it is.
The more I hear the loony left make fun of Sarah Palin, the more I think I need to throw my full support behind her. There are some conservatives that don't like her or yet trust her. Let's see..who would she have to beat? Not Barack (my cat could beat that idiot now), maybe Hillary or Joe Biden? John Edwards? John Kerry? This is going to be fun!
send her all your money, she'll take it
The more I hear the loony left make fun of Sarah Palin, the more I think I need to throw my full support behind her. There are some conservatives that don't like her or yet trust her. Let's see..who would she have to beat? Not Barack (my cat could beat that idiot now), maybe Hillary or Joe Biden? John Edwards? John Kerry? This is going to be fun!
send her all your money, she'll take it
mark775
01-08-2011, 03:22 PM
I consider the woman very Reaganesque. I guess it depends upon what direction you want the country to go...Further down the shithole of socialism and corruption or towards the pride and prosperity of the Reagan era. If there is a more suitable Republican candidate than Sarah, I'll be all for him! Right now, unless Chris Christie runs, there is nobody else. (And I have a problem with him...if a person cannot control his own weight, how can he be entrusted to important matters of others? He is doing a good job, however)
wardd
01-08-2011, 03:25 PM
i don't remember prosperity under reagan
i remember a lot of layoffs
and spending like a drunken sailor
i remember a lot of layoffs
and spending like a drunken sailor
hoytedow
01-08-2011, 03:39 PM
i don't remember prosperity under reagan
i remember a lot of layoffs
and spending like a drunken sailorBah!:rolleyes::mad:
i remember a lot of layoffs
and spending like a drunken sailorBah!:rolleyes::mad:
Boston
01-08-2011, 07:32 PM
Ole Sarwa would gaff herself right out of the race in no time. Put her in the limelight and watch the show begin. I kinda can't wait. I think if Hillary would learn some oratory skills she could win assuming Obummer doesn't go for a second term. At which point the Dems are in trouble and any old horses ass could will against then.
my two cents
oh
I'd almost register as a republican if it meant helping ole Sarwa get on the ticket, great way to ensure that the republicans loose. I think the Dems need to come up with a dark horse ( no pun intended ) and present a fresh face with some actual idears
my two cents
oh
I'd almost register as a republican if it meant helping ole Sarwa get on the ticket, great way to ensure that the republicans loose. I think the Dems need to come up with a dark horse ( no pun intended ) and present a fresh face with some actual idears
mark775
01-08-2011, 08:28 PM
Yeah, "dark horse" - that's the jackass, methinks!
"I'd almost register as a republican if it meant helping ole Sarwa get on the ticket, great way to ensure that the republicans loose." That's how the Dems got McCain in in the primary, it's a long-time Democrat strategy.
Obama CAN'T go for a second term - He will not survive the primary - unless it's a pity ff-ff- forfeiture by Hillary - Can't imagine that old carbuncle waiting untill '16, though.
Actually, I think we should put McCain up again. That will be good for America.
"I'd almost register as a republican if it meant helping ole Sarwa get on the ticket, great way to ensure that the republicans loose." That's how the Dems got McCain in in the primary, it's a long-time Democrat strategy.
Obama CAN'T go for a second term - He will not survive the primary - unless it's a pity ff-ff- forfeiture by Hillary - Can't imagine that old carbuncle waiting untill '16, though.
Actually, I think we should put McCain up again. That will be good for America.
Boston
01-08-2011, 08:39 PM
I dont think any of them have a clue
they are all just in it for self aggrandizement and payola
after all we are talking about politicians
hang em high and leave the corpses for the crows
they are all just in it for self aggrandizement and payola
after all we are talking about politicians
hang em high and leave the corpses for the crows
cthippo
01-09-2011, 10:02 AM
I think the Dems need to come up with a dark horse ( no pun intended ) and present a fresh face with some actual idears
Keep in mind most of us on the left are pretty happy with Obama. We may complain about the compromises that it's taken to get legislation through, but he has gotten a LOT of things done that have been on our to do list for a long time. While there may be a bit of grumbling about a primary challenge, it's not going to happen.
The next two years should be pretty interesting. I foresee the Rs remaining the party of NO, but also going through a bit of a civil war within their own ranks. The Tea Party movement will get discouraged when they realize the people they elected can't get anything done either.
I don't see the Health care law being repealed, either. The new provisions are already taking effect and if they repealed it now it would do some politically impolitic damage to people, especially seniors. Can you see the ads now? "Congressman <insert name here> voted to RAISE drug prices for seniors, what will he do to the rest of us?". Likewise, there were some deals made to get the insurance companies on board with the plan. If the Rs tried to repeal the individual mandate but keep the popular bits of the law they would be running up against a huge lobbying wall.
I'm also wondering if we're going to see another government shutdown in the next few months. You remember how well that worked out for the republicans last time. The Rs are also going to need to figure out how to keep their small but vocal bigoted minority from staining the entire brand. Having a bunch of significant players pull out of CPAC because the gay republicans were going to be there isn't helping their image.
The economy will continue to slowly creep back over the next two years, but it remains to be seen how much, and if the rate of change is rapid enough for anyone to notice.
Keep in mind most of us on the left are pretty happy with Obama. We may complain about the compromises that it's taken to get legislation through, but he has gotten a LOT of things done that have been on our to do list for a long time. While there may be a bit of grumbling about a primary challenge, it's not going to happen.
The next two years should be pretty interesting. I foresee the Rs remaining the party of NO, but also going through a bit of a civil war within their own ranks. The Tea Party movement will get discouraged when they realize the people they elected can't get anything done either.
I don't see the Health care law being repealed, either. The new provisions are already taking effect and if they repealed it now it would do some politically impolitic damage to people, especially seniors. Can you see the ads now? "Congressman <insert name here> voted to RAISE drug prices for seniors, what will he do to the rest of us?". Likewise, there were some deals made to get the insurance companies on board with the plan. If the Rs tried to repeal the individual mandate but keep the popular bits of the law they would be running up against a huge lobbying wall.
I'm also wondering if we're going to see another government shutdown in the next few months. You remember how well that worked out for the republicans last time. The Rs are also going to need to figure out how to keep their small but vocal bigoted minority from staining the entire brand. Having a bunch of significant players pull out of CPAC because the gay republicans were going to be there isn't helping their image.
The economy will continue to slowly creep back over the next two years, but it remains to be seen how much, and if the rate of change is rapid enough for anyone to notice.
mark775
01-09-2011, 10:52 AM
You poor fool. At first I thought I didn't like you, but it is pity now. Of course there are some leftists that still like Obama - and they are dim bulbs, just as you. Step away from the Psilocybes, B'head.
Boston
01-09-2011, 11:01 AM
not so much around here, maybe in your neck of the woods but Colorado voters are pretty dam disappointed. His handling of the economy has been pedestrian at best and irresponsible at worst, granted he got handed a back of ****, but borrowing our way out of debt he leaves us all in a far worse place than where we were two short years ago. The economy is teetering on the edge. Bernake was a whopping huge mistake.
He has caved in to the Republicans at nearly every turn. Shown no spine at all when it comes to either domestic or foriegn policy and is, to put it mildly, all rhetoric and no substance. The excuse for universal health care can best be summed up by the simple fact that he left 40+ million americans out in the cold and the rest paying into a system almost exactly like the unfunded mandate of car insurance, but gave comprehensive universal health care to 60+ million Iraqi's and Afghanistan's. what a crock.
And Gwod forbid a foriegn country get aggressive with us, anyone remember a guy named Chamberlain walking off an airplane waving a treaty in his hands. I also remember some pretty interesting campaign promises, stuff like every child who wants to go to college should be able to, and I'll get us out of these illegal wars of aggression
At which point I might mention I voted for the lying sack
He's basically reneged on just about every campaign trail moment in BS he threw at the American public and in the end its
you guessed it
Business as usual
except for a lack of
effective economic policy
effective domestic policy
effective foriegn policy
and a failure to produce a single success story when it comes to campaign rhetoric
in short
the man is incompetent
He might have learned how to BS his way in a college setting ( so did I ) but the real world is something different entirely, deal is a lot of the egomaniac professor types don't transition well to the real world. Hillary pegged his BS early on.
not sure how people in Washington are thinking but I do stay involved here in Colorado and folks are downright pissed off with him around here
I doubt he would carry the state again unless the Republicans do something completely stupid like front ole dimwits herself as the party nominee.
nope
Obummer is likely a one term president unless he gets off his ass and actually does something meaningful with his opportunity.
He has caved in to the Republicans at nearly every turn. Shown no spine at all when it comes to either domestic or foriegn policy and is, to put it mildly, all rhetoric and no substance. The excuse for universal health care can best be summed up by the simple fact that he left 40+ million americans out in the cold and the rest paying into a system almost exactly like the unfunded mandate of car insurance, but gave comprehensive universal health care to 60+ million Iraqi's and Afghanistan's. what a crock.
And Gwod forbid a foriegn country get aggressive with us, anyone remember a guy named Chamberlain walking off an airplane waving a treaty in his hands. I also remember some pretty interesting campaign promises, stuff like every child who wants to go to college should be able to, and I'll get us out of these illegal wars of aggression
At which point I might mention I voted for the lying sack
He's basically reneged on just about every campaign trail moment in BS he threw at the American public and in the end its
you guessed it
Business as usual
except for a lack of
effective economic policy
effective domestic policy
effective foriegn policy
and a failure to produce a single success story when it comes to campaign rhetoric
in short
the man is incompetent
He might have learned how to BS his way in a college setting ( so did I ) but the real world is something different entirely, deal is a lot of the egomaniac professor types don't transition well to the real world. Hillary pegged his BS early on.
not sure how people in Washington are thinking but I do stay involved here in Colorado and folks are downright pissed off with him around here
I doubt he would carry the state again unless the Republicans do something completely stupid like front ole dimwits herself as the party nominee.
nope
Obummer is likely a one term president unless he gets off his ass and actually does something meaningful with his opportunity.
mark775
01-09-2011, 01:46 PM
In one regard, I feel he has been perfectly successful with his campaign promises. He has fundamentally transformed America. He got us pretty much out of Iraq (well, on the schedual that was already happening). He did close Club Gitmo, didn't he? (Oh, no, I forgot, he just signed legislation to never allow Gitmo detainees to come into the US proper). His Cloward-Piven plan is well in place and successful beyond all imagination. He has disrespected our Judiciary in a most high-schoolish manner. He bows to foreign leaders as he apologizes to them for America being America, He paid off his voting constituancy, I might add, almost immediately! He has divided America along socio-economic lines like it has not been in my lifetime. He has brought urban chic (and mountain gorilla chick, ha!) to the Whitehouse. He has nailed more pictures of himself up in the Whitehouse than all other presidents combined (Why? Because every pres. before now has had the grace to let someone else do it later if warranted). He is the first president to get cracked in the lip playing ghettoball. He signed away advantage in a Russian treaty. He allowed gays to not be left alone in the military like they have been forever under "Don't Ask, Don't Tell". And he's Fired up! http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/ofasplashflag/
He also got us paying and obligated to pay more for healthcare and encouraged untold thousands of potential doctors to switch fields of study to something that makes more sense in the coming Barack times - possibly government work (who knows?) He brought real meaning to the phrase "It's Bush's fault". He coerced democrats to vote for healthcare even though the American people had allready given it a "no!", thereby damaging the Democratic Party in such profound ways that it will likely take decades, if ever, to recover. One fifth of Americans get plenty of time to persue other interests under Barack.
Here's a black perspective (Over 90% of blacks favor him so one can only surmise that blacks are not yet critical of him) http://www.bvblackspin.com/2009/11/25/barack-obama-black-men-112509/ Basically, it says there is the positive of "He has inspired us" and the negative of "He hasn't got us out of prison yet", "Get us jobs", "Make us mainstream America". That might take a little time considering that I, for one, pretty much forgot what racism was until Barack came along - now I routinely see, hear, "Nigger", which only happened in rap videos for the last twenty years. (One thing that has struck me is how blacks fall for being used by the Democrats for their votes time after time only to suffer through more humiliation and broken promises, rather than go with the party that says we are all born equal and can succeed if we work hard enough. One has to admit that the Republican Party is the more color blind of the two)
Ahem... Cap and Trade to stifle US oil production and encourage imports. And he won the Nobel Peace Prize! (His number one accomplishment)
He also got us paying and obligated to pay more for healthcare and encouraged untold thousands of potential doctors to switch fields of study to something that makes more sense in the coming Barack times - possibly government work (who knows?) He brought real meaning to the phrase "It's Bush's fault". He coerced democrats to vote for healthcare even though the American people had allready given it a "no!", thereby damaging the Democratic Party in such profound ways that it will likely take decades, if ever, to recover. One fifth of Americans get plenty of time to persue other interests under Barack.
Here's a black perspective (Over 90% of blacks favor him so one can only surmise that blacks are not yet critical of him) http://www.bvblackspin.com/2009/11/25/barack-obama-black-men-112509/ Basically, it says there is the positive of "He has inspired us" and the negative of "He hasn't got us out of prison yet", "Get us jobs", "Make us mainstream America". That might take a little time considering that I, for one, pretty much forgot what racism was until Barack came along - now I routinely see, hear, "Nigger", which only happened in rap videos for the last twenty years. (One thing that has struck me is how blacks fall for being used by the Democrats for their votes time after time only to suffer through more humiliation and broken promises, rather than go with the party that says we are all born equal and can succeed if we work hard enough. One has to admit that the Republican Party is the more color blind of the two)
Ahem... Cap and Trade to stifle US oil production and encourage imports. And he won the Nobel Peace Prize! (His number one accomplishment)
hoytedow
01-09-2011, 04:10 PM
Ole Sarwa would gaff herself right out of the race in no time. Put her in the limelight and watch the show begin. I kinda can't wait. I think if Hillary would learn some oratory skills she could win assuming Obummer doesn't go for a second term. At which point the Dems are in trouble and any old horses ass could will against then.
my two cents
oh
I'd almost register as a republican if it meant helping ole Sarwa get on the ticket, great way to ensure that the republicans loose. I think the Dems need to come up with a dark horse ( no pun intended ) and present a fresh face with some actual idearsI think they could use audio of Hillary C and Nancy P to extract info in Guantanamo.
my two cents
oh
I'd almost register as a republican if it meant helping ole Sarwa get on the ticket, great way to ensure that the republicans loose. I think the Dems need to come up with a dark horse ( no pun intended ) and present a fresh face with some actual idearsI think they could use audio of Hillary C and Nancy P to extract info in Guantanamo.
hoytedow
01-09-2011, 04:15 PM
You poor fool. At first I thought I didn't like you, but it is pity now. Of course there are some leftists that still like Obama - and they are dim bulbs, just as you. Step away from the Psilocybes, B'head.psilocybes:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Carville
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Carville
hoytedow
01-09-2011, 04:17 PM
"...irresponsible at worst..."?
Criminal at worst.
Criminal at worst.
wardd
01-09-2011, 04:18 PM
i wonder which of marks rights have been taken away
i keep hearing about a lot of lost rights but not what they are
trying to give people a better life is not taking their rights away
otto bismark, that socialist, was all for health care
i keep hearing about a lot of lost rights but not what they are
trying to give people a better life is not taking their rights away
otto bismark, that socialist, was all for health care
mark775
01-09-2011, 04:48 PM
Rights? Freedoms? Yes, if I cared to think about it, there are problems.
The single biggest factor is, as proven here, California, Europe, the USSR, or anywhere else, spending other's money doesn't work. Spending more than you take in DEFINITELY doesn't work.
They are coming after the internet now, BTW.
The single biggest factor is, as proven here, California, Europe, the USSR, or anywhere else, spending other's money doesn't work. Spending more than you take in DEFINITELY doesn't work.
They are coming after the internet now, BTW.
wardd
01-09-2011, 04:51 PM
under normal circumstances when inflation is low a deficit is a sign of a growing economy
and isn't systemic inflation low now?
and isn't systemic inflation low now?
rberrey
01-09-2011, 05:28 PM
Is inflation low? They,er not using the same math they used when Mr. Carter was pres. rick
wardd
01-09-2011, 05:30 PM
oil and food are rising but it's not general inflation
Landlubber
01-09-2011, 05:30 PM
wardd,
"can anybody tell me what money is for?
why does it exist?"...this has not been answered for you, but please spend the time to listen to all of this, he does go on rather slowly, but the info is very real, and needs to be addressed asap, if you expect anything left of the USA for your children to live in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5Yf3FCZ5FY
"can anybody tell me what money is for?
why does it exist?"...this has not been answered for you, but please spend the time to listen to all of this, he does go on rather slowly, but the info is very real, and needs to be addressed asap, if you expect anything left of the USA for your children to live in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5Yf3FCZ5FY
wardd
01-09-2011, 05:36 PM
until the inherent problems in our current economic system are addressed there is a built in boom and bust cycle
and if we don't also address the coming social and technological changes coming within a generation there will only be the haves and havenots and the usa will resemble the world of robo cop
and if we don't also address the coming social and technological changes coming within a generation there will only be the haves and havenots and the usa will resemble the world of robo cop
mark775
01-09-2011, 08:59 PM
Inflation is low as politicians and other people that don't understand inflation's serious implications define it. I define it differently and my definition is always spot on correct on this. You can get this as it is not complicated.
Forget, absolutely throw it out, erase from your mind M1, M2, etc.. Forget even "The overall general upward price movement of goods and services" or whatever similar definition the people who would have you confused and the people who are confused themselves talk about.
One can dink around with the money supply in a lot of different ways but long-term trends always comes back to one thing - how much money there is. Third world shitholes, without the insight to hire an economist or with evil intentions or with a person in control unwilling to listen to his economists (Nixon, for example was taught that stupid "price controls" can't work and he, for politics or ignorance, placed them anyway. Barack, Geitner, etc., who can figure what they smoked to come up with a spending and printing plan to get us out of a hole caused by...too much spending? Yes, it was a third-world shithole thing to do.) spend more money than they have, then print money to pay back debts. Sorry, while we're on Barack, keeping Kinko's working 24/7 for two years does not constitute a "jobs program".
Forget, absolutely throw it out, erase from your mind M1, M2, etc.. Forget even "The overall general upward price movement of goods and services" or whatever similar definition the people who would have you confused and the people who are confused themselves talk about.
One can dink around with the money supply in a lot of different ways but long-term trends always comes back to one thing - how much money there is. Third world shitholes, without the insight to hire an economist or with evil intentions or with a person in control unwilling to listen to his economists (Nixon, for example was taught that stupid "price controls" can't work and he, for politics or ignorance, placed them anyway. Barack, Geitner, etc., who can figure what they smoked to come up with a spending and printing plan to get us out of a hole caused by...too much spending? Yes, it was a third-world shithole thing to do.) spend more money than they have, then print money to pay back debts. Sorry, while we're on Barack, keeping Kinko's working 24/7 for two years does not constitute a "jobs program".
mark775
01-09-2011, 09:09 PM
I addressed money in post 11260. It was a tad tongue-in-cheek so I suppose your attachment is a better learning tool.
"Actually, I think we should put McCain up again. That will be good for America." - I posted this two days ago and there was no response. I imagine folks from other countries may not even know him, but US citizens get a "D"...or an "A" depending on if you got that the reason putting him up would be good for the country is that he is perhaps the only one able to lose to Barack. Four more years of Barack and even the diehard racist blacks and Wads of the country will get the point driven into their heads - "It doesn't work".
"Actually, I think we should put McCain up again. That will be good for America." - I posted this two days ago and there was no response. I imagine folks from other countries may not even know him, but US citizens get a "D"...or an "A" depending on if you got that the reason putting him up would be good for the country is that he is perhaps the only one able to lose to Barack. Four more years of Barack and even the diehard racist blacks and Wads of the country will get the point driven into their heads - "It doesn't work".
wardd
01-09-2011, 09:41 PM
it was the big banks that created wealth with money that didn't exist
a huge amount of us currency is squirled away by people in other countries and used in the local economy, leaving a dirth of currency here at home, a lot of money printing is to make up for that
gold and silver is a lousy basis for money supply in the modern world
the money supply has to be adjusted for economic conditions
no matter what you use for exchange there has to be a common agreement on it's worth and the worth of goods sold, be it paper or gold
a huge amount of us currency is squirled away by people in other countries and used in the local economy, leaving a dirth of currency here at home, a lot of money printing is to make up for that
gold and silver is a lousy basis for money supply in the modern world
the money supply has to be adjusted for economic conditions
no matter what you use for exchange there has to be a common agreement on it's worth and the worth of goods sold, be it paper or gold
Boat Design Net Moderator
01-09-2011, 10:33 PM
It appears this thread has veered more into politics than climate change now;
with little if any direct relevance to boats or boating, and after 750 pages, I think it's time to close this one.
with little if any direct relevance to boats or boating, and after 750 pages, I think it's time to close this one.
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