Need advice on boat plans

[determined_ange]

I found these plans while browsing around and I'm a little skeptical over the design. It doesnt look too sturdy but then again I'm no professional.

Anyone with experience have any advice on whether or not this boat is worth building?

Thanks in advance.

[kengrome]

There's nothing wrong with the design, it's just a very simple and economical small boat. Don't worry about its strength, 3/8 inch plywood is plenty thick and strong enough for it. When you're done if it seems to flex too much just put thicker "shear rails" on it, although I doubt that the boat will need them any thicker than spec'd in the plans.

The plans say to use one sheet of 4x14' plywood but that size plywood hasn't been available for ages, so you will have to scarf two sheets of 4x8 together, or just glue a butt block on the joint to hold them together and forget about the scarfing.

If I were building this boat I would glue all the wood together with epoxy. Then you won't have to worry about the joints leaking or the nails or screws pulling out -- not that they would anyways but epoxy is just a great adhesive to use on wooden boats in general.

Good luck and have fun building it!

[Trevlyns]

Yeah, I thought it was a bit of an overbuild with 3/8 ply. Some ocean going designs only specify ¼ ply but obviously have framing to compensate.

I agree with kengrome about screws and nails. Keep all such hardware out at all costs – it will only lead to problems later.

Good luck and let us have some pictures of the build too.

[determined_ange]

Thank you guys for the help and especially on the 4x14' sheet issue. I was going crazy looking around for a sheet that size since the only size around are 4x8.

Do you guys think the depth overall may be too short? It is only 1' and im worried about capsizing the boat.

I will definitely post pictures as soon as I have them. I should start building today and plan to finish sometime this week.

Once again thank you guys so much for your help.

[Trevlyns]

Don’t worry about the 1 foot sides. It would have been designed by a competent person and looks about average for a boat of this type and size. Also it has a flat bottom which will make her quite stable and capable of supporting quite a bit of weight. All in all, quite a neat little boat - can't wait for the pics! ;)

[Ike]

I just bought the plans for a very similar boat and it calls for 2, 4 X 8 foot sheets of 3/8 and 2 of 1/4. The pieces are butted togther with a butt block and it works well. I haven't started the build yet but will this fall.

What you have looks very reasonable. As was said you don't have to have 14 foot sheets, it just makes it more convenient. You can use 4 X 8 sheets and get just as good a finished product.

This is a typical small rowboat. Have fun building and have fun using it.

[VKRUE]

I like it for the simple little boat that it is.

I'm considering building something very similar myself after my current boat is finished. May even use the same design.

[determined_ange]

VKRUE, if you decide to use the same design send me some photos so I can compare how well I did with mine because this is my first boat and I don't think it's coming out too great.:(

I have the sides and bottom cut out so far but they came out quite crooked and I don't have a block plane to plane it out. Tried sanding but it doesnt do much.

Also, the plans say to first place the plywood sides then after attach the chines and sheers. Would'nt it work better the other way around?:confused:

[VKRUE]

Mornin' D. A.

I'd stick to the plans.
As for me, I've been working on my boat for 2 1/2 years now and still have quite a ways to go. I'd be glad to post pics though if I ever get around to the building of this boat.

Ike will most likely start and finish his boat long before I do mine so, you might watch his postings and PM him from time to time.

A plane is a good thing to have... also you might think about purchasing whats called a surform (this is kinda a cross between a plane and a file). I use my surform much more than the plane.

Gotta go to work... I will be back to talk more later though, I've got a few things to dig up for you.

[determined_ange]

Morning VK,

Thanks for the help. I searched up the surform and their way less expensive than a block plane...but would it work the same as a plane?

If you notice in the picture attached, I need to bevel out the bottom edge of the sides and plane it out to the transom bottom. Would a surform work in this case?

Thanks for your help so far.

[VKRUE]

A plane would sure make a cleaner edge. I can't tell a lot by the drawing that you included. Is it just a small notch that you need that fits into the transom somehow or does the entire lower edge of the sides need to have this bevel ? Could you possibly use a small saw (carefully)?

The surform, like I said, is kinda like a file... it will leave a slightly rough edge... try one on a piece of scrap and you'll see what I'm talking about.

I've used the surform to shape my cabin's beams... top and bottom sides. These beams have an arch about them. I rough cut them to basic shape and then shaped them in finer detail in a jig on my bench with the surform and yet again after they were installed (temporarily) in the cabin.

Maybe a slightly rough edge won't hurt anything in your case... it certianly will work good for any surfaces that are going to be glued or epoxied.

Like I tell everybody though...

I'm not a woodworker nor a boat builder. (and I never claim to be either)
Just a humble truck driver who bought a boat and is learning a great deal.

Have you checked out my web site ? My blog that is...
It's listed below my signature... If you read the entire first page and then follow up with the other pages in the archives you'll get an idea of who I am and what I've done. It is a bit of reading though... don't say I didn't warn you. Lots of pictures though. I've also got some pictures posted in my gallery too (here on boat design).

Also, I'm guessing that you don't have much in the way of tools.
If you are limited on funds (like I am) you can acquire some tools (who knows what ??? ) at garage sales. I like to go with the wife on weekends to view the yard / garage sales... you never know what you'll find.
I bought both of my surforms at garage sales... one for .50 cents and the most recent one for .25 cents (american). I also recently bought a (brand new in the box) battery charger... 50 amp / three stage w/ boost for a $10.00 bill. Have acquired many other things in the line of tools and stuff for the shop (garage) this way. Beware of electrical items like saws or drills as they are usually junk... but, test them out anyway... sometimes people just don't want something anymore or don't know what they have and maybe think that it's wore out or whatever due to their own ignorance.

I acquired a perfectly useable riding lawn mower with a 15 hp engine this way... Sears Craftsman even. The guy thought that it was junk because it smoked really bad. As it turned out... the smoke was caused by a loose head bolt leaking oil & fuel onto the exaust manifold. Lots of smoke !
I tightened up the bolt and used the mower for two years during which time I also replaced two tires, the belts and the battery. I sold that mower for $100.00 (which is what I had into it) and that guy sold it a year later for yet $100.00 again... and that guy sold it to someone else for $250.00... this guy put a new paint job on the mower and was offered $500.00 within a week for the same mower that I acquired for FREE ! Go figure ????

Gotta go..................

[thudpucker]

Go with the plans. They look like something out of the 50's and maybe the designer was not real confident in the 1/4" Plywood of those days.

As a Kid, I helped a guy build some MaKenzie River drift boats. I was just a helper!
This guy used 1/4" for the bottoms. The Bottoms got scraped up pretty badly and had to be replaced often. Some we replaced a couple times in the summer and winter Fishing seasons. That bottom was put on with about a million 1/2" brass screws. We used a "Yankee" screwdriver. Today it'd be a battery powerd drill driver with an adjustable clutch.
I think the sides and other stuff might have been 3/8th" and and the only piece of real wood was the Oak stiffener up in the bow. We scrounged through Pallat boards till we came up with the ones it took two guys to carry. They had Oak 2X4's in them. He made the prow out of them.

I made a Dingy out of plans from Mechanicx illustrated, and used 1/4" plywood. My Uncle was the General contractor on that boat and it was a bueat. I had more use out of it than almost any other boat I ever owned.
1/4" plywood is very strong. Dont be afraid to try it.

[lewisboats]

info removed

[determined_ange]

Ok here are some of some of my pics as promised. Sorry I took so long but I've been pretty busy and more problems have risen than I expected.:( I have everything ready and just need to be attached.

I would finish today but I've run into a small dilemma. Attaching the extra 3 feet to the 8 feet long sides has proven to be harder than just simply applying a butt block. As you can see in the photo the two butt blocks are already attached to the right side, but once I attach the 3' board on the other side, bending becomes a problem. As soon as I start to bend those last few feet the joint starts to crack nearly comes apart. Any ideas as to how I can do this?

Also, I don't think you can tell by the photo too well but when I curved the sides instead of bending into one smooth curve it bent into this wavy shape.:confused: I'm hoping that once I install the chines it will form the smooth curve I'm looking for.

[thudpucker]

I think you may have the cart before the horse.
When extending the length of Plywood, you really need a 'Scarf' joint.
If you bevel the edges (there's a correct forumula) I'll guess at 1 Foot per 1/4inch of thickness.
You would have a scarf of 18 Inches for a 3/8ths inch piece of plywood.
The best way of course is to lay your 3/8" in a jig and use the electric plane to make the bevel. etc etc!

But.....if your going to stick with that Butt joint you might try Dry heat bending the last three feet in a jig.
Then you can put the formed piece up to the Butt joint and glue it.

Dry heat is kinda dangerous if you get in a hurry. However in SA this time of year you might be able to put your wood in the form out in the sun and get the job done while your at work.

[determined_ange]

Would it work if I used plywood as a butt block and attached it with wood instead of these bulky blocks I'm using

[VKRUE]

I agree with Tpucker...
The scarf joint would have been the way to go but, we live & learn. Good to see you making progress though and, taking pictures too.

I am lagging behind in everything that I'm doing, especially my boat.

What kind of plywood are you using ? Is it marine grade ? How many plies ?

I'm guessing that your not spending a lot of $$$ on marine grade for your first boat... (good thinking) however, 4x16' plywood can be had. Have you tried your local Menards store... they've told me that they can custom order special plywood to my preferences ??? Just a thought.

For someone who wants to spend the $$$ a fella can buy 4' x 16'... 18' or even 5' x 20' sheets from Boulter http://www.boulterplywood.com/ if he wants to.

The reason that I asked about the # of plies in your plywood is that plywood that has fewer plies tends to be more difficult to bend because each individual ply is thicker whereas plywood that has more plies is more supple because each ply is thinner. The plywood that I used to repaire the hole I cut into my boats hull (to replace a section of the damaged keel) was 3/8" but it had 7 plies and I was actually able to achieve a slight compound bend with it. Bending plywood in two oposite directions (compound bending) is not easy with most plywood. I used dry heat though by laying these patch boards on my shops furnace before applying the epoxy and attaching them to the boat. http://photos1.blogger.com/x/blogger2/532/1075966638257981/760/z/792530/gse_multipart57500.jpg It's not exactly easy to see the compound bending in the photo but like I said... it's slight. I noticed to that there is a slight twist in it too.

[determined_ange]

The scarf joint would have surley been a better joint but, as you have stated before, I'm at a shortage of tools. So making a scarf joint was almost impossible.

As for the plywood, it is not marine and only consists of 3 plies but is still somewhat susceptible to bend. Your right I'm not investing a lot of money because of the fact that this is my first boat and is just a fun and expirimental project. This boat is just to learn and gives me an opportunity to make as many mistakes as possible because the more mistakes I make the more I learn and the more wiser I am.

I am planning on building a second boat that hopefully will come out way better. This time I know what is needed, how much time I need to take out of my day in order to finish at a reasonable time, and the money involved in all this. So I hope that I can use my new found knowlegde to build a top quality boat that will last me for years to come!:)

[Geoh]

Check out this free site... updated const technique that probably was not around when those plans were first drawn http://bateau2.com/content/view/46/28/

Geoh

[Geoh]

http://boatbuildercentral.com/help/Stitch_and_glue.htm