Vessel security patrols!

[trouty]

Just a discussion thread to suss out what you boat owners think of my latest idea!

Having moved to a new abode about a month ago - here on the canals - I figured having the new boat tied up outside the house on it's own jetty would be the ultimate....anytime I want to go fish - just turn the key - cast off and go!

Bout 2 weeks after arriving, my eldest son interuppted 2 guys at 2.30 am one tuesday morning trying to break into our vessel to presumably steal it or contents / electronics.

They did a runner in their little dingy.

Had i not been sleepin stark nekkid and still half asleep when the son woke me - I might have had the presence of mind to start the boat and give chase, and run em down, get their ID off the side of their boat - call the police and tail them, until they made landfall again or something along those lines.

Truthfully - by the time I even thought of it, they were long gone.

Sooo...

I got to thinkin - Ok - I am insured - but the damage - inconvenience etc sure is a pain in the butt - and take away from the enjoyment of having a house on the canals and a boat tied up outside ready to go at a moments notice!

Then I got to thinking, - I wonder if anyone does water born marine security patrols of the canals - to keep an eye on peoples boats and to deter thieves from even attempting to break in / steal boats?

I internet searched for Oz and only came up with one company who do so - and definitely not in my area.

Does anyone know if this is a service that IS offered for example in the USA around Florida canals for example (or elsewhere?).

What would it be worth to a boat owner to have a security guard marine patrol, check over their vessel with a weather eye and security eye - for any damage / signs of people attempting to board or otherwise tamper with their vessel a couple times a night?

Would such owners willingly pay say $150/year for such a peace of mind service? (bearing in mind they probably already have marine insurance to cover any such loss?)

I am seriously thinking of starting up such a business, maybe even franchising it nationally eventually.

But I am curious whether boat owners value their boats enough to actually pay an annual fee to have their vessel included in a nightly water born vessel patrol watch circuit, by a qualified security guard....

I know some people really love their boats - but will they actiually pay cold hard cash to protect them from theives?

I have a meeting this week with the company who have the existing patrol in a location up the coast from me - to see if I can offer the service here under their banner....

And I have a meeting with the largest marine Insurance co downunder to see if there is some way they can "sponsor us" / help out with maybe a rebate on insurance premiums for those members who take up a patrol membership for a year.

Do you guys think people would pay to know their vessels being watched regularly thru the wee hours each night?

If so - what would it be worth to people?...a sliding scale for size/value of the vessel - or a flat fee?

What are your gut feelings?

Many thanks in advance!

Cheers!

[yipster]

hmm, you were lucky notting is missing.
maybe its an idea but i dont think people like powerboating in the backyard at night.
i see more in a alarmsystem. good for doing some shopping beeing away also.
made one last year from a 12v motion detector and police horn.
havent really used it but works great and so far it costed only € 15 but dont know if its legal and havent tested it on spiders.
anyway, i'm not so nicely situated and my marina does the security patrols.

[safewalrus]

The idea IS appealing (being in a Naval Dockyard Port the area is Patrolled by Ministry Of Defence Police launches! these guys are armed and do know how to use their guns - unlike the average British copper who don't!) so we're OK! But your average boat owner, like everybody else is rather tight with his money when he does't see any tangible results!
OK once his boat had been broken into he'd then consider such a service but until then, mmmm
then he'd expect you round every five minute for the first month! Forget it after that it cost's too much!
Personally I think it's a great idea in the right place, with the right gear and contact with the local Police. But you need to be careful who you use how you advertise it and just as importantly the style of boat in the locality.

An alternative would be a cooperative of local owners, in teams of two radio linked to the rest and the Police. Each team does either set hours or days within a selected area looking out for each others boats! See how it develops!

[Vega]

An alarm system conected to a central seems the way to go. Like: boat alarm----house central alarm---telephone----Alarm central service--- security quick inspection.

[safewalrus]

Yeah Vega looks good on paper but to catch these guys you need somebody on the water fully booted and spured, and more importantly aware! Even if your at the other end of the patrol when the alarm goes of its lights and alarms full on and make like an American Cop Movie! By the time your series of alarms etc has gone off the thief is long gone (and so is your boat!)

Remember it takes a little time to break in so it needs to be quiet and empty! A patrol boat is enough to keep your thief off the boat/head down until your gone, random and eratic patrols should be enough to get him to go look elsewhere for easier pickings!

[kach22i]

Dog and shot gun...........................old but true.

[RHough]

A combination of random patrols and an alarm system might well work.

You would need a huge number of customers to make it viable though.

I would expect 24/7 coverage, not just after dark. That means at least 6 full time staff in the boat for one area. Security guard pay? $12-15 per hour is $2000-2500 per week. You would need a second boat so one is on the water at all times. Per hour costs of operation (fuel/maintenance/repairs)? $15/hr?
That's $5000 a week or $260,000 per year. At $150/year for the service you need over 1700 customers just to operate at break even. 1700 boats in a marina is one thing, 1700 boats in on patrol-able canal is another. How many miles of canal do you have to cover to get 1700 boats?

A more realistic estimate would be 1700 boats @ $300 per year so you can buy boats etc. and have operating capital. How many people pay more than $300 per year for their insurance?

[SamSam]

couple times a night?
$150/year


2 x 365 =730 checks per year--$150 / 730 checks = 20.5 cents per check.
That's not much. The labor alone at $15 an hour is 25 cents a minute. Sam

[trouty]

Thanks too to jef for putting this in the right forum... I always seem to end up in the boat design forum - sorry Jeff! (It's where my bookmark takes me).

Anyway in answer to some very good questions...

There are about ~17 nautical miles of canals where I am (but you have to go up and back down almost each one)...so say 35 Nmiles of canals to patrol (at no wash speeds of 5 knots or less...say 3knots at night.

To get to each Canal development, and patrol and come back home is about a 62 Nm round trip...some of it at max 8 or 12 knots zones thru Estuary - some at WOT..

Either way - it's an all night proposition to cover each canal every night just once...until I get the 2nd boat.

There are 10,000 regisered vessels in the area according to the official figures - with growth expected to 46,ooo inside 5 years.

Even if I only got say 10% of the vessels as members...

1000 members in forst year @ say $300/ annum = $300 K

If as predicted in 5 years ownership grows to 46,000 & I still only get 10% of owners as members....(4600 @ $300 / annum)....$1.38M/annum

Of course - if 20% or more could be persuaded to join...then things get a lot better - i.e. - less $ per year to become a member or more patrols per night etc etc..

I think it's definitely "do-able"..

To put the development into perspective...around here...

A vacant lot on a canal frontage (~450 - 500 square meters..or 1/8th acre) starts at $350K - and goes to $1.2 or $1.8M....for the vacant lot.

For one with a family 4 x 2 Home (or better) on it goes from $650K - $2.5M

Lots of $1M+ waterfront places are town houses / appartments (condo's?)

Anyway - there are vessels here over 70 meters length...

It's a millionaires playground (only i ain't no gazzilionaire)...so i need to find something that pays well to continue to live here...and i figure this thing has a heck of a lot of potential...

There are new canal developments going on all around us...

We are only 1 hour by road from Capital City Perth, on a huge estuary / inlet system with 2 rivers feeding it, and year round access to the ocean...it's a boating mecca....

It's west Australia's answer to Queenslands - Gold Coast (Or the USA's Florida).

Heck we have suburbs here on the water actually named Miami, Florida etc.. :rolleyes:

Anyway - I reckon this has legs and will get up n swim, If I can make it work.

I am not advers to the idea of alarms systems for vessels - however, movement sensor alarms could be a problem - virtually all vessels move as others pass by in the canals systems - from wake waves...so movement sensor alarms, could be a problem.

I will keep working away at this...I'm an insomniac anyway - can't sleep at night so might as well be on the water. I reckon theres enough canals / boats etc and dstance between them all to warrant at least 2 patrol boats eventually.

any more feedback welcomed - does anyone know of a service where this already happens?...other than homeland security type armed patrols paid for by govt / taxpayers??

Currious to see - what others may have developed as a service / business - in this respect (if anything).

Boat theft here is a massive problem...not jst the whole vessel itself (which does happen a lot and seems to be well organised crime rings based....probably run by the local Bikers clubs) but theft of expensive electronics and tender vessels etc.

Some Marina's do have "security" patrols but only your normal land based vehocle patrol - nothing actually on the water...and most land based patrols only see the front yard of the house- not the vessel out back in the canals...so are in effect no deterrent at all.

Still workin on this.

Cheers!

[trouty]

I hear you and am still crunching the numbers - trust me!

I think as you've pointed out - that for few members - the cosat would need to go up (considerably - probably somewhere near $600/ annum) for 'break even' at 1000 members.

That said - the problem here is so prolific, and the number of boats / boaters in the community so high - that I have a suspicion - I won't have a great deal of difficulty getting memberships - I think the problem MAY end up being not able to cover the demand at startup!

Time will tell of course.

Some of the vessels here, Particularly the larger ones are worth many many millions of $ each - while others are in the hundreds of 1000's - and yet others, probably not worth the cost to cart then to the refuse site for dumping...i.e. the full range...

I am thinking i will have to have a sliding scale of fee for size / value of boat.

We have huge problems with boat theft...and it is organised. I have no doubts elements the local boating service / sales community are probably involved, The problem stems from, lack of co ordination between state police authorities....

Boats are stolen here, re birthed and trucked east for sale in Queensland the same week... - the same enclosed (pantek) trucks haul vessels stolen on the east coast & reborthed - back here for sale.

There is no national hull number register for example.....it's a state based system, with no cross checks by licensing authorities, to see if a hull or engine is on any register of stolen property in other states.

The reason i suggest involvement of elements within the local boating sales / service industry, is because - these people are 'best placed' to provide the details to the theives - i.e they know what they have sold to whom, where it's kept and what it's inventory of gear is. The theives appear to "steal to order".

They are easey to spot - they 'cruise the canals' - in "party barges", drinking and pretending occasionally to be fishing or scooping prawns etc as a cover story - all the while - they are casing vessels to return to under cover of darkness.

The local Boating sales / Service fraternity are very mobile - travelling interstate often to meet others within the boating sales / service fraternity in the Eastern States etc - where "shopping lists" are exchanged, payments etc made and deals done.

It's organised crime and big time stuff...

The police know this but do nothing to stop it - lots of them are 'on the take' - to keep quiet and to ensure no national register of stolen vessels equiipment ever gets underway...and that no "co-operation" between state police services ever happens - otherwise a very lucrative "theft / rebirthing industry" within the legitimate boat sales / service industry - would dry up overnight.

I don't expect to "cure the problem" at all - other than to catch those at the bottom of the rung...

Most likely, those at the top of the rung - will be out to shut me down before I get started - but we will see...

Way i see it - the more these scum bags keep stealing - the more people - will want my services, and be prepared to pay...so in effect - it's not really in my interests to interfere with the existing status quo.

I just see a role - where perhaps I can spin a buck is all.

Time will tell.

Cheers!

[yipster]

i imagine at the inlet of the resort some optical sensors can save lots of U hauls, money and time.
informed ahead of iregularitys you would have time to prepare for the upcoming high speed open water chase.

[trouty]

Chase Yipster? :confused:

Wot chase? ....I wuz figurin on just blowin em outta the water 'n ask questions later! :D :cool: :rolleyes:

I guess maybe I should post up a scan of the area I'm talking about - theres a lot of open water in the estuary and a couple rivers they can run up - or they can run to sea - if they think they have the fuel range to get to the next port I guess...

Thing is, mines a ex patrol & rescue vessel for the Marine & harbours / Fisheires dept....meaning it's built to run down boats stupid enough to try 'n do a runner...or alternatively to be able to stay at sea for extended periods to search for missing vessels / boaters.

Ain't no one going to outrange or outrun me - period.

All I really need to do - is stay with em and relay the info to Police, so they can intercept them when they make landfall.

Now think about this...

IF they tried to run to sea...(dumb azzed idea)...they hafta actually MAKE it to the next port...round here - threres no guarantee of that, of course - I guess if they steal one of the 200 ft plus luxury cruisers they could probably make New Zealand without refuelling..so - maybe tailing em that far might be a problem. :(

Yeah - sensors might help....but I think if you see the type of canals system i'm speaking of....you will see - that any sensor will be going off 100 times a night from all the boat traffic in and out of every canal.

You see Yipster, lots of wealthy retirees live here, and they are forever going in and out in boats all times of day (and some nights) for prawning, crabbing, fishing etc etc etc. Some just take their boat to go visit other retirees and get on the Wooobla all day so they can wobble on home at night in their boat on the canals and not get caught by booze bus, driving cars home drunk... :rolleyes:

At Holidays time (like now Christmas / New Years & School holidays) the place is just crawling with holidaymakers in boats all comming and going all times of day and night in boats....it's busier out front of my place than a main highway intersection in the city!

Sensors might not be the easey solution - you think. (in my opinion for this situation, Yipster).

The crooks - come here ostensibly for a "holiday" with family (kids) as a cover story usually - they stay at cheap "caravan parks" - and put their small 12 ft (3.9 meter) aluminium dingys in the water with small 4 stroke OB's (some even use silent electric trolling motors for stealth).

They drive up & down the canals in daytime with the kids - "fishing", while really they are casing the houses to see who is home and which are holiday homes that are vacant...

Many of the holiday homes which are vacant have boats penned out front of each house. Maybe no one will be home for 3 months at a time or sometimes more.

So - when they spy a nice boat (or equipment -- radar colour sounders and chart plotters etc...llots of expensive fishing gear...and most particularly the inflatable RIB's type tenders with new 4 stroke OB's - you often see on the foredeck of flybridge cruisers), they take note.

Then under cover of darkness, midweek, early hours of morning when canals are free of boat traffic, they come in dingy (kids are by now asleep in Caravan at Caravan park)...with silent outboard - very quiet down canal.

They tie up to your boat...and board - break in and steal whatever they want, and away they go - with your Rib tender boat & outboard, your electronics, and probably your deep sea fishing gear.

On a well stocked boat they may get say...

Rib Tender & OB =$10,000
Electronics = $20,000
Fishing gear = $10,000

Not a bad nights work for 1 hour! :rolleyes: :mad:

They steal to order.... Furuno electronics...(not cheap black n white stuff)...
New tenders & OB's etc etc.

They tend to take boats for re-birthing, that are mainly trailerable type...you know the type - say 18 - 20 ft (6 - 7 meters) maybe worth $50,000 - $100,000,

What they do - is steal a suitable trailer from unattended launch ramps during the day - to suit the type of vessel they plan to steal that night!

So - you might be out fishing all day and come back to launch ramp - only to find - your vehicle there - but boat trailer gone? :confused: :confused:

Who would want just a boat trailer???? :confused: :confused:

I tell you who - the guy who is going to steal a boat that will fit on that trailer - the same evening which he has spotted tied up in a canal at a house jetty...where it appears no one is home!!!

So... - he hides trailer in bushes off a backroad out of town for remainder of day, then retrieves it at night from hiding spot...and takes it to nearest launch ramp - where he plans to steal boat from canal to suit trailer.

This is how the game is played...there is a ring involved - they steal up to 3 boats & trailer simultaneously, i.e - there are 3 groups of guys all doing this in different area's around the estuary canals systems at the same time!.

Each group may get up to 3 or more boats each per night!

Then - the transport truck arrrives - on back road out of town - the thieves tow stollen boats and trailers, out to meet truck and load up truck. 6 or 8 boats & trailers, plus electronics / tenders etc all stacked in pantec body of truck, (this is road train type - 3 dog trailers, with roll down tarpaulin sides to cover load and make not visible).

Boats are on the highway headed east (3000 miles trip) (averaging 60 miles per hour)...50 hours , i.e. 2 days straight, non stop driving (one driver - no sleep!!) :rolleyes: across entire continent.

By time you wake up in morning and say "Oh god - my boat is gone" and report to Police - Insurance company etc - your boat is already 1000 miles and 3 states away!

There are so many truck across nullarbore plain (entire country) in both directions each day that it is not humanly possible to check each and every one manifest / cargo...many with shipping containers even (full of boats / stolen gear).

They are delivered to boat dealers who "ordered" certain types / styles they know they can sell straight away - re birthed in their workshops (new paint colour, new pin stripes design & colour, re trimmed upholstery in new colour, different trailer (stolen) each of which is re-licensed in new state with no checks by authorities on hulls id or trailers VIN (Vehicle Identification Number) purely because their IS no "National" register!!!. :rolleyes:

(Where can possibly be excuse for that in todays day and age of computers???:confused: :mad: )

Honest people buy near new "stolen / rebirthed boats trailer packages" in this country every day and don't know it. In many cases the owners wouldn't recognise their own boat within 1 week after it is re-birthed!

The crooked dealers, "meet" each other to swap "shopping lists" for stolen boats - at "boatshows".

Yes - we who love boats and pay $ to go to every boat show to see new boats, inadvertantly fund the criminals who use these shows as "cover" under their legitimate businesses, to meet and do dishonest business. This happens at night after hours of boat show - at restaurants / hotels etc, when industry members all go out to "network" with other industry members.

So - the boatshows is how crooked dealers, do business with their likewise crooked dealers interstate!

It is purely "organised crime" Yipster and is big scale over here, we are after all - a continent with extremely high boat ownership rates - since the entire continent is surrounded by water...

So stolen boat traffic goes both directions, (east & west) - the same truck returns with boats stolen in Eastern States - to be re birthed by the crooked dealers in the west & vice versa!.

This I know I can't stop Yipster, but - the people who do the stealing...I CAN "catch" (follow and provide details to police and insist that police "intercept" as they make landfall).

I think - when organised crime finds out that security patrols on water exist...the lower rung people who actually do the stealing - will get scared to do the task! In many cases - these are employees of the boatyard (mechanics / electronics etc) who are experienced in gear installations etc...they know boats and gear - they are experts who "shop to order".

It is a "paid holiday with the kids operation" - they are "on holidays from work, keeping the misuss and kids happy during the day, by fishing etc with them - then at night - they make extra holiday pay by stealing to order for their boss - what he has contracted to deliver to his "partners" in the east and vice versa.

The honest boater does not have much of a chance...if he has a boat they want. They KNOW who has this boat - because, often they sold it new to the client!!!! They do the servicing - they have the address! They have the opportunity to make new keys etc for the boats while it is being serviced!!!

It is a big time rackett Yipster.

Probably I will walk into a bullet for spilling the beans!:(

Ohh well! :)

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

Two things here Trouty - as you've already said "you'll probably walk into a bullet for spilling the beans" And once the crooks realise theres patrols about they'll have armed lookout men to sort the patrols out! this puts the wages up a tad for the patrolmen/women - if you can find any!:rolleyes:

Secondly if you know that much why are you wasting your time looking after the boats -you know your on a looser. Go join a gang and make some real money! Whilst I wouldn't suggest that you do anything dishonest it would appear that that is the sensible option or am I missing the point?:confused:

[trouty]

Safewalrus!

Yes - & that is - the participation by security firm employees in the theft / industry!

Who better than securty staff to provide the inside scoop to crooks on whats stored where, by whome and when the patrols check it out?

Of course - security men... :rolleyes:

Maybe I'll be approached to suss out for the crooks...which are the best boats and best times - to be stolen? :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

I dunno Safewalrus - why'd you hafta go n open that can of worms....:(

I could be talked out of this crazy idea you know...

A bullet would do it! :eek:

Hmm - crooks...bad crowds to be messing with...

That is a definite downside - i will admit tothat much - cost of patrols needs to go up some...(so I can pay someone with a bone head to be on the front lines!...while I direct the action from a safe distance!) :D :cool:

Hmm - sounding better all the time...

Might hafta draft me a employment advertisement...

Wanted - thickhead, can drive a boat!

That oughtta do it! ;)

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

Trouty

sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings but -

Fact

In the UK alone 60% of retail theft is done by the security guards!

If it's happening here must be happening elsewhere (Incidentally I've done some time (?) as a Security Guard (Shift Supervisor actually, posh see)! and no I didn't - it was 'roads security' different to 'retail security' unfortunately!

Whatever best of luck with the idea - I do think it's a good one apart from the 'devil's advocate' bit!

the Walrus

[Vega]

Yeah - sensors might help....but I think if you see the type of canals system I’m speaking of....you will see - that any sensor will be going off 100 times a night from all the boat traffic in and out of every canal.


About sensors, talk to a good hi-tec. company specialized in security and put to them your problem (regarding sensors and boats in the water). You can have sensors with two or three different scanning abilities and they only go off if all parameters are jeopardized.
I have had some problems with false alarms with the system I had at home till the moment I have changed to more sophisticated sensors (dual ones). They only go of if they detect body temperature and movement. With one of those you can rock your boat that it doesn't go off.... unless you have also a "big warm animal" inside :p

[SamSam]

[QUOTE=trouty]There are about ~17 nautical miles of canals where I am (but you have to go up and back down almost each one)...
[QUOTE]

So if you have to go up and back down the canals past all the boats (if someone on the end wants your service) it would seem that people wouldn't have to pay you anything but they would still benefit. How do you get around that? You would only report crime happening to your costumers? Sam

[SamSam]

As long as Gadzillionaires are involved it would seem to be worth the effort to try and make some sort of scheme work. Perhaps a security system somewhat like a residential system might work. Some sort of wireless system adapted to boats that would notify you, sitting back home next to the beer cooler, that some scoundrel way over somewhere else was farting around with one of your costumers' boat, whereupon you would alert the authoritys and let them deal with it. You would make money by 1-selling the system, 2-installing the system, 3- maintaining the system, 4- managing the system, 5??- maybe having your own security force you would send over, some sort of quick response team. If nothing else maybe it would alert you and set off some kind of siren to dispel the crooks and you would go over and make an inspection and reset the alarm. Sam

[trouty]

your making a lotta sense...

And I am listening!

You left out the bit where the fast response team carry baseball bats...but otherwise - it's sounding great! ;)

I'm all ears - believe me! (and taking notes!)

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

Trouty

Fast response team to carry baseball bats! shame on you, :eek: thats's aggresive, don't know much about this security stuff do you.

I'm afraid all the poor response team carry are Maglite 6 cells (go look at a picture of one buddy) so they can see where they are going!:cool: :p

Carry it military style (by the head over the shoulder holding the light end cupped in the hand) if some poor scroat comes on aggresively it's a mere flick of the wrist to bring the body end of the torch down on his poor unsuspecting head - almost a natural reaction! :D Easy to wipe the blood of too! What could be more natural! Don't forget that one of your team must carry a camera (selective aiming) to gather information for prosecutions and counter prosecutions!:idea:

That'll do 'ee for starters

[trouty]

I have the 6 D cell Maglite already and am welll versedin it's "correct" useage.

Mine maglite actually has a "name" it is called "Milo".

Because - when you get into a stoush It's marvellous what a difference Milo makes

:D ;)

(You probably have to be of my era to remember the Milo advert on TV with that particular catch phrase!)

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

Nope, don't remember that one! Is it Oz only or are you really that old? :confused: didn't realise they had TV's then!:D

[Corpus Skipper]

I tried a similar thing out here in the Corpus area. Lots of folks from San Antonio, Austin, Dallas.... Keep boats here unattended for months at a time, and since I check MY boat at LEAST once a week I figgered these folks might like someone to come by and look at theirs, make sure the pumps work, batteries are topped off, engines start, mooring lines o.k., etc... Nothing worse than driving 300 miles to find your batteries are dead, right? Couldn't get ONE owner to sign up, even with good references and being bonded. Those fancy lads don't like to part with their greenbacks, and I guess they figure that's what insurance is for. Oh well. I do love the patrol idea though! Probably wouldn't fly here as the canal homes are too spread out and Texans are known for their affinity for large caliber firearms:D :D

[seadogs20]

Trouty,thats a great idea for your area,the only prob I can see is gettin the ppl to pay.Call the commercial agents squad in Perth and they will give you all the info....you have to get a Security Agents Lic first and do a few courses, you could probably use jet skis?

[trouty]

Have spoken to the commercial agents licensing squad in Perth already.

They are working on it (and going to get back to me...) seems they can't determine if the security agents act has application to the marine environment! :rolleyes:

Have a security guard course booked for end month - 5 days gets me the security license (cert 2), (I already have the senior 1st aid meaning two days I don't have to complete).

Probably i could get away with recognition previous learning, having held "law enforcement" powers for Wildlife officer in the past (i.e qualified to arrest, investigate, take witness statements and prosecute a case)...so security for me should be a doddle.

Heck I think I've held a couple corporate concealed weapons licenses too in the past (armed payrol officer & wildlife officer duties) so I can't see much problem getting past the beaurecracy!.

(But the beaufort gun on the foredeck, might raise a few eyebrows!) ;) :D

I suspect getting folks to part with their hard earned mightn't be so easey - but I guess I'll never know unless I give it a go.

The fact holding a firearms license here is so tough - might mean theres a difference betwixt us and Texas - at least I hope so, in as far as people being prepared to "pay"...

Course - the other incentive I guess...could be - I "arrange" for the crooks - to steal from every boat on the canals, NOT covered by me!! :D :D

(Joking of course!). :rolleyes:
Hm - reminiscent of the old Mob standover tactics...'protection $' I think it was called! ;)

Getting off track here, back to bidness!

Cheers!

[seadogs20]

well thats one way of doing it :)....The other prob would be,if you had a guy signed up at the end of the canal, why would the guy at the beggining ned you...your passing him and all the others first....this was a prob we had when we started something similar....still think its a good idea tho

[trouty]

have thought about that..

Unless I have details of boat and owner that I am watching - I'm not about to aproach anyone on anyone elses boat to query what they are doing?.

How would I know if they were lying when they said it's my boat so - pizz off! :confused:

If it's a boat who is my member:-

a) I have the owners name and contact details for a quick mobile phone check to see if he's authorised anyone to be onhis boat at 2 am in the morning midweek!

b) I know all my members boats and owners because I have a photo of each on my laptop, linked to the nmea out put of my GPS so both photo's (owner and boat) scroll up on the laptop as I cruise past each gps position!.

Virtually - I will already know if it is the owner or not...before I ask the question, whereas - while pasisng non member boats -If I don't have that info - whats the point questioning anyone - even if they are acting suspiciously?

Who would I report them too - other than maybe the police..

I think a membership thing will work - I have Sat Mobile phone so can call anyone (owner or police) from anywhere basically...and if I have all the details on laptop as I go past - I SHOULD have my crap together when I spot anyone on a members boat and have suficient detail to determine whether they have a right to be on board!

Least thats the plan!

Cheers!

[trouty]

Volvo Penta in the USA have something called "Sea Key" which is some kind of Sattelite GPS transmitting device - concealed within the vessel, that can be remotely activated...

If I were to sell / install something similar (for obviously a higher fee0 I could track 24/7 the movements of such a members boat - even after it's stolen!

GMH (General Motors Holden) downunder have something similar (As I belive Low Jack do in the USA) where vehicles can be sat tracked...

One poor car thief here stole a so equipped commodore a few months back, and as he pulled into this own driveway with new vehicle he'd just heusted - the cops pulled in behind him and cuffed him!

Couldn't for the life of him figure out how he got nabbed! ;) :D

I am thinking this would be the "gold member" type protection for the more well heeled cutomer!

Still workin on that aspect!

So - Seadog - you wanna be my pardner?...I reckon i need 2 boats to cover all the vessels / canals already here! :)

Cheers

[seadogs20]

I do like it Trouty, believe it or not, I had the same idea some years back..but with the houses to...the idea was to patrol the canals and also the houses from the street...alround protection...If I wasnt tied up with this asia thing .....

[seadogs20]

also if you need any printing doin give me a yell:)

[trouty]

Peter,

Youra saviour,

Indeed I do need printing done. Quite a bit in fact and tracking someone down to do just that - was my very next task!.

I will be in touch soon - as I already have your email addy!

Understand about the Asia thing completely - you have a fair bit ahead of you!

Will talk soon - am actually in Perth at moment (Mutha's place in Morley) so will get back to you about details as soon as I get home and have access to my own machine with all the printing / brochures / photo's type stuff on it.

Cheers!

[seadogs20]

No probs mate, it seems you have been thinking about this for a while...check out some other places first, get some quotes...but I know we will beat any quote you get......We always look after small business :)........

Pete

[trouty]

will do,

Did you happen to see todays (Sat) West?...Boating section...arrtivcle from Barry Wiseman, on a new security stsem for boats???

As it happens I had a meeting with the importer of the said device this morning - looks promising - i think i have secured the agency for it for the Mandurah area...

Will send you an email.

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

Hey Trouty go for it mate, best of Luck with Venture - we're all rooting for yer!!!

Please keep us posted how it pans out

the Walrus

[trouty]

It's bout time I set myself and the missus up for retirement...

I've been looking around for an "opportunity" to have a go at something for a while- it was originally going to be a sea tow franchise...but I've backed away from that because the local volunteer sea rescue group get 70% of their income from 'donations' for towing broken down boats...so I don't want to put the local volunteers outta bidness - not a good look for a new chum in town.

So - this looks like it has potential...

I figure, if I can make it work.....that theres a lot of other canal / boat places like here - where maybe I could franchise the bidness...

If it works - maybe we can retire to a life of fishing, and living by the water afterall.

If not - it'll just get chalked up as another of troutys crazy Idea's that never made jack shyte - like the deer farm, the Timber mill furniture factory or trout fishing tours, deer hide products, venison sales to restuarants etc etc that seem to have consumed my life ourtside the public service!

I'll have a crack at it - why not....

I must be doin something right - afterall..

Ya see - I've already had one death threat phone call - something about finding me dead in a canal if I go ahead with my plans... :rolleyes:

Could be the theives, could be the boating industry people involved, or indeed the security firm folks getting worried I'll take their existing canal based clients away from them... :?:

Never let the threat of death stop me before - ain't going to start now!

Maybe I will however - go collect my firearms from my friend who's holding them for me...can't hurt to carry heat afterall. Thankfully, putting serious holes in living things never gave my conscience any trouble....and the stint roo culling means, I rarely miss what I aim for! :)..

(Ever seen how small a kangaroos head is in comparison to it's body)?...every shot has to be a headshot, or the carcass is rejected...by the pet food industry, every decent size roo is about 60 kilo gutted & tailed - worth 80 cents a kilo - i.e each one represents a $50 note - on the hop.

You don't miss many with the right incentive ($)..

Most reckon hitting 5 shots within 1 inch circle at 100 yards is a good shot (MOA ..or minute of angle).

To do that on the brain spot of a roos head at 400 yards...is 1/4 MOA shooting...

I'd get on average 1.5 tonnes a night... (@60 kilo a carcass...or 25 big boys a night) sometimes 5 nights a week for 6 weeks straight...

Try shooting 1/4 moa every shot, one after another - night in night out when your tired - eyes full a dust, out the window of a idling diesel ute...

I love it when people threaten me with death - I've meeted out more real death in a week than they have seen in a average lifetime of waching cowboy movies! :rolleyes:

Sheeessh - I hope they realise I might actually shoot back! (or worse - shoot first!).

Ya hafta wonder about the mentality of some folks...

Cheers!

[seadogs20]

What a great idea, I could do with one of them myself.....what will they think of next??....I think you might be onto a winner with that....hey you might be able to use it for cars as well???

[seadogs20]

actually the more I think about it, the applications for it's use are limitless....sole distributer for W.A might see you retiring alot sooner :)

[trouty]

Someone already Has Australian rights...I was lucky to get mandurah area rights to sell / install / service / monitor.

It has application for vehicles as well as building sites etc.

As best I Know it is the ONLy one that can sms you and feed video of the crooks for later use in prosecution - as well as disable the vessel / car / boat or whatever and send live voice to car radio speaker / vessel radio speaker etc
Hey crook - get off my boat / outta my car - I've disabled it the cops are on the way -, i have your photo, and If I get there before them your dead meat!

Yep - that should be enough to do it! :D

I still really want to be able to track down a boat thats been / or is in the process of being, heisted!

That way - you can intercept it and also tell the authorities - where it is and where it's headed! Course if it's "disabled" via the mobile phone...finding it becomes MORE of an imperative...

Ergo...if it hits a reef or whatever and theives lives are lost their MAY be legal implications for the disabler... :rolleyes: (What a crazy world we live in when that should be a consideration...

Course, If I catch them first and they end up lobster bait in a lobster trap - with no rope, set off the edge of the continental shelf...well - they will always just be "missing persons" won't they! ;) :eek: :cool:

Cheers!

[rogerm]

my suggestion is to maybe try n use this new techology known as web cams. Rig up cams on the boats ( some can see in the dark suprisingly well by the way, then u can sit home n scan n that will take all the problems out of the system from dishonest guards to motion detectors etc,,just a suggestion...........:D

[safewalrus]

Only one wee problem with all this electrickery, it's known to breakdown fairly easily when mixed with water especially seawater! In cas you guys ain't noticed that's what this little post is about - boats!:rolleyes:

Trouty is right visual regular patrols are the only foolproof way of guarding these vessels, which is his intention, electrickery helps but see above! :D

[SamSam]

I've been looking around for an "opportunity" to have a go at something for a while-
every decent size roo is about 60 kilo gutted & tailed - worth 80 cents a kilo - i.e each one represents a $50 note - on the hop.
I'd get on average 1.5 tonnes a night... (@60 kilo a carcass...or 25 big boys a night) sometimes 5 nights a week for 6 weeks straight...

So, how much money do you need? I could sure live on $1250 a day! Anyway, if nothing else works, you could always try politics. :) Sam

[safewalrus]

Hey Sam h'ed have to be able to distort the truth for that job! Seafaring people have a problem with that :rolleyes: (there again have a look at the Gennleman who masquerades as our Deputy Prime Minister [whatever that job is?] But there again he was a steward on a passenger liner - not renowned for their ability.......:rolleyes:

Enough that's politics and should not be encouraged, an I can understand why!!!!

[trouty]

how much do I need?...very little, I learned very early on to make do without, which is why now i don't have too! :)

How much do I want, on the other hand is a toally different story! ;)

I have 3 kids who think it grows on trees.

Politician?
Yes Sam - your correct, I was accidentally vaccinated with a grammaphone needle at birth and haven't shut up much since! I surely missed my vocation! (I did once acieve pre selection to run for public office ...the Fishing party go figure!!) but sadly cannot any longer do so, for family reasons.

Cheers!

[Wellydeckhand]

If I may suggest for the thief infested boat owner....... get 10 snake..... non poison type of course......... let them wander around within the cabin only....... refrain from using your boat for a month.......:)

When the thief pry their tade and touch something cold and slippy in the dark nite..... well they might just convince the boat owner is mad or just too much a snake love to stomach up............

word get out and you will be happy......

[Wellydeckhand]

Ok......Ok........ Just get you nephew with a gun and sleep on board:D:D:D...... New ways to get rid of family members LoL..........:D:D:D

[trouty]

Well.

I've been away at Security Officer school, to get necessary qualifications to run security patrols, by law.

Now I can recognise bombs - throw drunks out of hotels and do patrols / alarm responses and recognise false ID (False Drivers licenses!).
(put UV light on your Drivers license and see the hidden govt info!) ;) (ours has the kangaroo in a box!) :rolleyes:

I'm a expert...on just about everything.:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

But i am "qualified"...and 'licensed"...:)

Enjoyed it a lot and did actually learn a great deal...

Especially enjoyed the bomb detection unit...(Tis the pyromaniac in me!)...:D :cool: :rolleyes:

Hmm...101 ways to make a bomb - every school boys dream!:rolleyes:

Yes this will be of great use while patrolling the canals...at night, in a boat - I will be able to detect a floating letter bomb as it drifts bye!:rolleyes: :D :D

I dunno - I am a cynical bugga!

All the rules and regulations in this world are pretty dumb when you stop and look at em with a critical eye. Theres always someone wants $ out of you - training fees, license fees and so on and so forth and you know what?..

Most of it is a farce........

I don't think the terrorists have to defeat us we will die from entaglement in our own red tape! :D :p

Ahh - good to be home again!

Cheers!

[Wellydeckhand]

How true.......mmmmm.......

This is dangerous......... I actually agree with you.......... better change prescription........on my belly itch........:D:D:D

[trouty]

Yes, keep taking the medication!:D

A handfull of happy pills and I'm everyones best mate!:) Without em, you'd think ya just walked into a bears den 10 seconds after he woke from 6 months hibernation! :eek:

In the morning people don't ask me how I am - even my own family - first thing they ask - "you had ya happy pills yet?" :D

Yes I'm a happy chappy - but it comes in a bottle! :rolleyes:

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

All depends if there's an 'E' in it!

[trouty]

Whiskey or Whisky? (personally I prefer scotch, a nice Glenfiddich single malt!).

But it don't make me a happy chappy - I get real downright nasty when I drink - which is why I don't usually drink (unless I'm alone - in which case the only one I can upset is me!) One makes me nasty - to the point i wanna hit someone - two makes me happy chappie and 3 sends me to sleep.:rolleyes:

Never did learn to hold my drink - my old man drank mine and a few others lifetimes full! :mad:

Vowed I'd never do that to my kids and I haven't...yet - but - the weeks not over yet!:D

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

Each to his own I guess,:cool: but if it makes you naughty leave it alone and find something else - the only time it makes me naughty is if the bottles empty and it's time for bed - try stopping me, could ruin your whole day!:(

[Vega]

Hey! Get a photo of your burglar in your nokia:p

http://www.mobycam.com/

[trouty]

I have saved that link for future reference...yachtcam..specifically!

Thanks indeed!

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

In this modern PC world (were you ain't allowed to call a spade a spade) you'd probably have to give HIM first choice of the photo's after all he's got his rights!

[SamSam]

In this modern PC world (were you ain't allowed to call a spade a spade) you'd probably have to give HIM first choice of the photo's after all he's got his rights!
As long as your talking about spades it's allright. Sam

[trouty]

well said - but don't ever let us catch him using those words about a shovel - right?;) :D

Cheers!

[safewalrus]

Have a 'Heart' fella's you trying to 'Club' my style

what did you rough 'Diamonds' think I was talking about?

[Wellydeckhand]

what did you rough 'Diamonds' think I was talking about?[/QUOTE]

For What I know family jewel are very hard to steal..... most probarly they steal your boat............ dont think they like walrus meat balls....:D:D:D....

Mmmmm........sorry....... just found a remote internet access in one of those dayak village........:p

[safewalrus]

bloody hell Welly thats amazing - the internet access in a dyak village I mean, when i was sloping into those places electricity was as rare as hen's teeth never mind internet access -you laff your head of at it (if you still have one that is!!):cool: :cool: :p

[Wellydeckhand]

Yep.... Try on hand research on river transport and monsoon effect on river.....:D :D :D satconnection:eek: :eek: :eek: .......... very costly but is an addiction anyway........ partly due to your sick comment.....:D :D :D ....... I am always glad your'r the black ship of the forum........:D :D :D :D :D ...... now how about trying walk the plank routine........:?: :D :D :D