Winches for sail lines

[Fanie]

When one use a winch to trim a sail, can one use a clam cleat to hold the line, or would a cleat be better to tie the line to ?

Thanks

[souljour2000]

You are a smart builder with some time on the ocean...what do you think...I would trust whatever your own judgement is in this case Fanie..cam cleats are great for light loads on my H-20...with nothing but a single block taking the rest of the load...This is hard on cam cleats though I suspect without a cheek block to take more of the load...with a winch or a a block on track I think cam cleat works usually in smaller boats under 22 feet at times...sometimes you need the cheek block in the middle during high wind loads... for sure...beyond that is beyond my experience...

[alan white]

I think a horned cleat works best sheeting with a single turn and pinched under rather than normal "X" cleating---- emergencies can arise from sheets getting hung up, but rarely because a sheet lets go.
A clam cleat makes good sense when used with a winch. It requires no more than a quick one-handed motion to release it, and that's what you want.

[Itchy&Scratchy]

Why not just use a self tailing winch - job done, especially if you are sailing on your own

[Manie B]

Here is the setup that i worked with on the Beneteau 35 - very good all round
self tailing winches are a must - and two speed
and Fanie for the sizes of sails that you are looking at these winches are a bit small - go one size up
when i was tired, i had a hard time winching in the jib flat in a close hauled tack, even the bigger guys that were with me pulled hard.

[jonr]

I agree, self tailing if it is being changed frequently. A cleat for something like halyard tension.

[Fanie]

Thanks everyone for your comments.

You are a smart builder with some time on the ocean...what do you think

I have power boat experience, and very little sailing experience with larger sails, but looking anxiously foreward to getting some
In the mean time I try not to think about it, it just makes me land sick... sick of sitting on the land

I have made a prototype of an oversize clam cleat, the idea was to pull the line into it and then tie it to a cleat. The clam cleat btw does not work, I'll figure out later why it doesn't clamp the line properly.

I would like to make my own winches, half the stuff is here already, and motorised if possible especially for the anchors. I'm not sure if I can make the self tailing part myself, maybe if I have one to see exactly what it does.

What do you mean one size up Manie, the smaller the winch the slower it is and the more leverage you're supposed to get. Ok, ok, I know what you mean.

even the bigger guys that were with me pulled hard.

He he... so was that every one else

And my sails are not that big Manie, they will only be 45 to 50 sq meters each...

Is that big ?

[Zed]

Clutches for halyards...

Have a go at one of these...

http://www.mauriprosailing.com/lewmar-rope-clutches.htm

+ if you are winching too much you are doing something wrong, learn to sail rather than upsize your winches.

[Fanie]

Thanks Zed - good link there. I KNEW someone had to make clutches for lines. that's what will keep a boat from capsizing !

[Itchy&Scratchy]

Hey Fanie, those jammers are nice and are fine for halyards, where you are coming off a winch for the uphaul, spinnaker etc and then through a jammer.

But no use for your fairleads, one winch, with a self tailer on each side, or if you want to save some dosh and be a tight arse, you could have one central mounted winch.
If you really want to look windgat ( flash) you could have nice carbon fibre grinder to drive the winches, couple of nice blondes in G strings to grind..................50 thousand buck boat with a 150 thousand buck grinder....

Tell me what size winches you are after and Ill have a look here in the UK, we have a massive choice of stuff here.
I am loading my container to leave UK early March , so if theres anything that you or Manie want-within reason- let me know.
regards
J

[Manie B]

hey what is this all about

are you coming back this way?

I am loading my container to leave UK early March

i would like two of the smallest self tailing winches that is available - i think that is 80mm = 3"
what price can you getthem at?

if theres anything that you or Manie want-within reason

nothing fancy - nothing wayout

[Manie B]

i went racing

if you are winching too much you are doing something wrong

we did win - my skipper is a slave driver
he gets so exited that i get scared

now i know that i am a "cruiser' - waaaaay to old for racing
they are experienced - i am just plain old

[capt vimes]

fanie
as itchy mentioned...
cluthes for halyards and stuff - winches (self tailing) for sheets - foresheets that is...
mainsheet arrangement usually looks like this on smaller boat (http://www.solent-sailing.de/grossschot1.jpg)...
what do you want clamcleats for sheeting?

[Zed]

Originally Posted by Manie B

i went racing



we did win - my skipper is a slave driver
he gets so exited that i get scared

now i know that i am a "cruiser' - waaaaay to old for racing
they are experienced - i am just plain old

Its normally the wingnut on da wheel that is the problem if you are winching to hard! Tell the skipper to steer right....

[Zed]

Self tailing is nice but horns are OK on a crusier. Just make sure that the main is easy to release and that the vang is also easy to blow. Should the poo hit da fan,--> drop the main quickly going uphill and blow the vang then main sheet going down hill. Then worry about the head sails...

Put a good clutch that can be released under load on the vang.