What Do We Think About Climate Change

[Knut Sand]

"No green namby pamby fluffy feel good ideas are going to cut it here"

That was before you yelled, got my attention.... Sorry if you got the idea that I didn't take this issue seriously. I once said that we're probably past the point where a democratic solution is possible...

So; Ok, no apologies needed.

As I see it, we have 2 major problems;
CO2 and all that environmental stuff.
Energy, we need clean available energy fast, and enough of it.

2 issues, related.

Climate changes will force people to move, in large numbers, some won't bother to bring their passport, some may come with AK47's...

The fight over energy sources will also be a possible source for large scale armed conflicts... As usual.

Man, this night I'm gonna pour myself a big one.....

[Manie B]

Well well - from the deep south here

it is frightening how suddenly things can change

technically we are a war zone already over food and energy

http://www.24.com/news/?p=tsa&i=929158

and all of this in five miserable months (=5 only months)

RSA used to have a problem called APARTHEID
it was unfair, 80% of the population had no vote
the "struggle" was to get the vote = power

we had an abundance of power, water and food
we exported food, coal, gold and and and

RSA now has a new 80% representative Government
for 14 lousy miserable years only
now we have no food - no electricity - no waste disposal
and we officially cannot cope with the "people"


our dams are full full full
not enough farming
why
kill the farmer - kill the boer
they will steal it or burn it and still they starve of hunger

we used to say "Africa is not for sissies"

we can now offcially say "Africa is for idiots"

i am sure that there are many rotten spots all over the world, guess what - you just got another

just when you didnt need it

[tinhorn]

While I don't doubt the seriousness of the situation, the rapid increase in gas prices WILL put a damper on wastefulness in the US, I hope. When I go to the big city, I see huge vehicles carrying ONE person clogging the expressways. That's absurd! My immediate concern is for the screwing that fixed-income folks are going to take on heating oil this coming winter. I sure hope they're smart enough to be stocking up now, or replacing their fuel stoves and furnaces.

I've reduced my own gasoline consumption to just a few gallons a week by putting dozens of miles on my bicycle. Seldom rode it before, but it's kind of fun! I need a basket or something, though. Hard to juggle a six-pack on a bike.

I get a kick out of Knut Sand's proposed solutions. It's much easier to understand twisted Norwegian humor than dry British humor.

[tinhorn]

Originally Posted by Manie B

Well well - from the deep south here

it is frightening how suddenly things can change

technically we are a war zone already over food and energy

http://www.24.com/news/?p=tsa&i=929158

and all of this in five miserable months (=5 only months)

Unbelievable, Manie. I clicked a few links to other news stories as well. Simply unbelievable.

[Manie B]

and so after 27 years they still blame colonialism

he he he

you see you silly buggers
it will always be your fault

Chinamasa blamed a third force for the political violence in Zimbabwe, saying it was clear that the British and American government were encouraging the violence.

only one teeny weeny problem
Zimbabwe has got nuttin
no oil - no maize for bio
no nuttin
(used to have tobacco = so out of fashion)

hey hey please send more money
U2 and bono and sir bob geldof whatever
please send more money

ground control to mayor tom
please keep engines on
here i am sitting in my tin can
far far away

i think i am also gonna make a tin foil hat
who the hell suggested that on this forum

http://www.24.com/news/?p=tsa&i=929381

hang on guys climate change is here
maybe not in the shape or form that you expected
batten down the hatches
triple reef the main
up with the storm jib
cast your series drogue
big storms up ahead

i will buy you a beer on the other side

[Meanz Beanz]

What will become apparent in the near future is that very few governments understand just how rapid the drop off in cheap energy will be. The technologies used to pump these wells increase the rate at which they are produced but also ensure the production drop off is dramatic when it comes. Mexico will export its last barrel of oil in just 6 years. I know that we have alternates but it takes a decade to get a well online if we start tomorrow. Most large scale energy solutions take one to two decades to put in place and we have not started yet! This is a liquid fuel issue, we have 100 years of infrastructure, transport, production and food systems that rely on liquid fuel. The point I am trying to make is that none of this can be changed rapidly, no where near as rapidly as the decline in production will be as it arrives and that alternates like coal to liquid, tar sands or even conventional oil take longer to get in place than we have here. Demand destruction will help a little but the production fall off will more than offset that, not to mention the Asian influence. This is not so much a lack of energy problem as a lack of the right sort of energy in a timely fashion. Its the gap between problems arising and our constrained ability to respond that is the major issue. Even if that gap is only a handful of years people will starve, economies will get pummeled and in all probability people will fight.

SA is probably a case study in many ways, we can point at their mismanagement yet it will become apparent that the west has not managed the issue all that well either. As Manie says the change can be surprisingly fast, seriously how many of you have been surprised by the rapid change in food and fuel so far this year? Its just a shot over the bows...

This should be the discussion on our T.V.s, not CO2.... solve this issue and you can solve our real or unreal CO2 issues... neglect this issue and saving your skin will be the priority.

I'm stunned at our leaders complacency and I know they know. How you ask? Howard went to visit Bush a while back. When he came back nuclear was on the agenda, energy was a sudden focus and we where even upping subsides on car LPG conversions... Bush put the wind up him over energy and rightly so. Bush also has a completely energy independent ranch and he is not the only one. They also know they can't sell the issue and the changes required to the people until it becomes critical. When it becomes critical we have run out of time to avoid the gap in continuous supply.

This has become a simple logistics issue over and above a technology issue.

End of rant....

Here's to hoping that stupid Ape is so far wide of the mark its funny!

No more yelling.... promise...mebe.

[Guillermo]

You guys are getting too serious. Just to relax a bit, look what I've found when searching internet around on your postings' themes:



"The Telltale is a passive wind indicator for the 2007 NASA Phoenix lander developed and constructed at the Mars Simulation Laboratory at the Aarhus University.

The Telltale consists of a gallows that is mounted on the top of the Meteorological Mast of the Lander. The active element of the instrument is an extremely lightweight Kapton tube hanging in Kevlar fibres. Images taken of the instrument will show the deflection of the Telltale due to the wind. A mirror is mounted below the active part to enable better direction information."

Cheers

[masalai]

I think the "ape" is closer to the mark than many other posters.... - may make an ape of many others he he he

[DanishBagger]

Originally Posted by Guillermo

You guys are getting too serious. Just to relax a bit, look what I've found when searching internet around on your postings' themes:



"The Telltale is a passive wind indicator for the 2007 NASA Phoenix lander developed and constructed at the Mars Simulation Laboratory at the Aarhus University.

The Telltale consists of a gallows that is mounted on the top of the Meteorological Mast of the Lander. The active element of the instrument is an extremely lightweight Kapton tube hanging in Kevlar fibres. Images taken of the instrument will show the deflection of the Telltale due to the wind. A mirror is mounted below the active part to enable better direction information."

Cheers

Yes, that NASA wind sensor was invented and made here in Denmark at Aarhus University. Finally, we danes have something to be proud of!! LOL

[the1much]

we make cheap sensors where im from,,,we stick our head out the door,,,tells ya just how the wind is blowing every time,,hehe

[Meanz Beanz]

Ya know the last time I was screaming about summin was back in 92, can't even remember what it was now... the inter...summin. Anyways the guys I was werking with laughed at it, not sure they are werkin now to tell ya the truth. Anyway this chit knocks that chit into a cocked hat.... serious, nah! Anways I'm just buying better quality meds so that I can keep the smile up fur as long as possible... here... hand me that straight jacket, I'm gunna need it.

[the1much]

if i pass you mine,,,i'll need to rent it to ya,,,they charge me by the month fer mine,,hehe
i think the last time me and 1 of these so called "genius's" had a convo,,,,,ummmm,,,,where are they now?,,,hehe
i may not know how ta read-n-right,,hehe,,but when it comes to "businesses scams",,i'm pretty sure i know 2MUCH ,and when i start asking "common sense" questions,,,,all that "math" doesnt help,,is easy talking round stuff using "science",,but when ya need to answer in "little words" ya cant use the "avoidance" method,,,,hehe

[safewalrus]

Well if thats the alternative it's head back in the sand for me! Us little old fish eaters don't like that ****!!

[Knut Sand]

Originally Posted by Meanz Beanz

This should be the discussion on our T.V.s, not CO2.... solve this issue and you can solve our real or unreal CO2 issues... neglect this issue and saving your skin will be the priority.

No more yelling.... promise...mebe.[/size]

Keep yelling....
You do your part of it,
I'll do mine (continue with the 1 man demonstration walks):
You do have to agree that continuing to use fossil fuel at to day's level/ rate, will bring us close to breakdown (DONT YELL, I know you mean that's this wars are made of..).

So (nag nag nag);
Smaller cars, lesser energy and materials used in building that car, lesser fuel burnt using that car, still better to find some clean alternatives (can buy some time). I'm not saying cars are the main problem, just (again) pointing out an easy solution that will work (for us, as long as not all Chineese, Indian people wants the same as us...(oh ****))

Air traffic... An average increase the last 30 years at 3-5% !! Hey that's a lot, In Norway we can get tickets to more central parts of Europe for 100 euros, Fuel for planes are not taxed as much as other fossile fuels (at least not here in Norway). Just because we have the means to do something, doesn't mean we have the right to do it. I mean, why should we Norwegians travel to Paris/ London /Newcastle for shopping...? (Ok I could do it for: Wine; Paris, Bitter/ stout; London, Nukiebrawn; NC). Too low prices on the fuel, wether its for a plane or a car will result in a level of use that we can't accept for too long.

(I was now suddenly too cynical and posted almost the following; But if we manage to rise the sea level fast enough, we may be able to reduse the population thus making the need for fossuile fuel slightly lower, but then I remembered; those with cars can still drive away even uphill... But I didn't post this)

One night when I'm bored (and have some wine again, but my wife have put a padlock on the cabinet.. ) I'll try to estimate the thickess of CO2 layer, in planes height... I mean, how tricky can it be? I was only wrong by a factor of 4 on my last attempt, and even that result scared me .

And the TV part....
Gray's anatomy, desperate housewives, Total sillycone makeup, top model (I have a inhouse teenager, that keeps me as a pet.....). God gimme some patience to endure.... (I like movies with simple solutions for complex problems, and no "in the next episode") But I mean it; this burning of fossile fuels at this rate, the scenario we may face, and the environmental issues, should be prime time, and also an issue for our "leaders" (hark,krmt. leader...where? Normally they do not have a memory span longer than past the last election..). And reality was never a thing they needed to bother with in the politic camps they participated in, where they "bonded", paved their way into the politic, with no other working experiece than from the above mentioned TV programs....

Is it ok for me to puke?

Logging off.....

[Meanz Beanz]

http://www.cheatneutral.com/

Watch the vid.... shows just how smart some of the T.V. host are!