What Do We Think About Climate Change

[masrapido]

Originally Posted by Dave Gudeman

No, mas, you misunderstood me! I love governments that control everything and take all of those hard decisions away from people! In a capitalist society, some evil factory owner comes to you and says, "Hey, peasant, you can come to work for me and do what I tell you and take the pay I give you or you can go work for someone else!" But in an enlightened Marxist society, a puppy-loving government bureaucrat comes to you and says, "Hey, comrade, you can come to work for me and do what I tell you and take the pay I give you or you can go starve because no one else is allowed to hire you." See how much more stark that choice is? How much easier to make a decision?

Oh, sure, your options are more limited in the Marxist society, but they make up for that by truly caring about you. You can tell they care about you because they call you comrade and they love puppies. That evil old factory owner doesn't care about you, he just wants to exploit you by giving you money. If you want health care or a fast car or a boat, you have to decide for yourself how to spend that money. What hell!

No such hard problems in the Marxist society --no, sir! That nice puppy-loving bureaucrat will tell you whether you are getting health care or a fast car or a boat (hint: it's going to be the health care). You get what everyone else gets. Isn't that great?

The important thing to remember is that the government knows what you need more than you do. "Oh, sure," you are probably thinking, "those guys in government in Marxist countries are just the most ambitious and the most amoral people who work the hardest at gaining power, just like the factory owners in the capitalist society," and you're right! But don't forget the magical properties of government service --you know, the thing that makes people love puppies and cry for sad babies and never, ever take advantage of their absolute power over you. That same magical influence gives them ultimate wisdom to know what's best for everyone. They know what's best for you better than you know yourself, and without even knowing anything about you! Is that magic or what?

No, mas, don't think for a minute that I'm not a 100% fan of Marxism.

I know. I'm being bad and getting off topic. But I don't know anything about boats so I have to have something to write about.

Dave, let us not derail the threads' original subject. You speak of something you cannot possibly know a single thing. When did you live in a Marxist society to have the authoritative knowledge of how the things are there...? We can go into that through direct communication if you wish, because it is an interesting subject for debate.

Back to the weather...

[hoytedow]

For Marxist info please visit Jokes thread.

[Marco1]

Originally Posted by masrapido

Dave, let us not derail the threads' original subject. You speak of something you cannot possibly know a single thing. When did you live in a Marxist society to have the authoritative knowledge of how the things are there...? We can go into that through direct communication if you wish, because it is an interesting subject for debate.

Back to the weather...

So you live in Chile and you are expert in ... What precisely?
Oh...I forgot you watch the snow on a mountain melt away and it is the fault of the capitalist. Yes makes sense.

Fortunately for the rest of those who are still sane, the cyclical changes in the weather are just that cycles. The older folks have said that the weather is now different for the last 5000 years. THe Chinese use to say so, the ancient Greeks use to complain about the change and so did the Romans.
It is colder, it is warmer and now it is colder or is it warmer again?
Big whoop. Greenland was once green. Global warming if it ever happens, will be beneficial for humanity not detrimental. Consider Canada and Alaska and Greenland and Russia with wheat crops. Patagonia will have nice weather, may be worth looking into some specualtive RE purchases.

Global warming is the new "national socialism" that wants to replace the failed communist experiment. The hell with it, we had enough with Mussolini, Hitler, Peron, Pinochet. We don't want more of the same. Switch on your aircon full blast and feel good about it. Copenhagen will be a showcase for the worst of human kind leading by the nose the do gooders and tree huggers ignoramus that want to "do something". Hitler had them in his boys brigade, the environazi have then in their "climate change action groups"
How much longer until they also get armed with daggers that read "mehr sein den schinen?"

[masrapido]

Hey, genius, which part of "back to the weather" was to enigmatic for you to grasp?

[ancient kayaker]

I still think we should be treating our only planet a little more carefully. Plan for the future. leave our descendants something for themselves. That kind of sucky, stupid stuff. But the vote here seems to be generally, plunder the bastard while we have the chance, for tomorrow we die.

[Guillermo]

Terry, I totally agree with you we must take care of the planet for our descendants. Precisely the problem is that global warming fundamentalism is, surprisingly, pushing in the wrong direction to that end, in my opinion.

CO2 is not a pollutant and it's good for life on Earth, as it has been for the last 500 million years at least, in spite of what the EPA says . The kind of irrational fight we are doing against CO2 emmissions, is having the following dangerous consequences at least:

1.- The spoiling of huge amounts of moneys which could be much better used for the sake of the poor people of the planet, fighting back the famine of 2,000 million human beings.
2.- The destroying of at least 2 jobs for each job created in the "green energy" investments. This is presently deepening effects of the present economical crisis.
3.- Covering our lands and seas with the terribly inefficient solar panels and other bizarre creations, which sooner or later will end as very expensive trash to be eliminated.
4.- Distracting money from the real necessities on investigation about massive energy sources, as the nuclear, which wiil save humankind in a not so distant future when the next ice age comes.
5.- Rising the cost of energy for all of us today, as the growing amount of the "green" share is terribly expensive. This goes directly against our pockets and the present and future development of the poor countries.
6.- Putting humankind in terrible risks if some of the bizarre geoengineering ideas come to life, as seeding space around the Earth with millions of small mirrors, or the seas with iron (what has been already tested and luckily failed), etc, etc.
7.- If finally we come to be able to diminish the amount of CO2 in the athmosphere (which thanks God we will not, whatever we do), this will go against the greening of the Earth which has been growing for the last 30 years.
8.- It is more dangerous for humankind a cooling down of the planet, which seems to have greater possibility of happening the next decades, than a growing in warming. It will be not only sarcastic, but most regrettable if we have wasted our efforts nowadays, if humankind finds itself fearing a snow-ball effect of the Earth within a few decades from now (As it was already feared in the seventies)

I'm convinced my children will live in a much safer world if we abandon right now all this histeria about the anthropogenic global warming and devote our efforts and scarce moneys to deepen our knowledge of climate changes (opening raw data to everybody, of course), find adaptational strategies and look for ways of producing cheap energy and enough food for whatever tenths of millions of people our descendants will be on the planet.

Two most important aspects to invest in, in my opinion: nuclear power (fision & fusion) and recicling, recicling, recicling.

Cheers.

[Marco1]

Originally Posted by masrapido

Hey, genius, which part of "back to the weather" was to[o] enigmatic for you to grasp?
.....................
And what exactly did you do in your sorry life? Are you a rich capitalist who knows what he is on about? Because I doubt it. I have a purpose and I am fulfilling it. You? Just killing the time in the twillight of your uneventful life, while waiting for an uneventful exit?

Well, one thing I can assure you of. Thanks to people who in their stupidity defend capitalism, the world is a shithole today. But thanks to the people who think with their heads and bgo to school to prepare themselves to be able to change this shithole into a paradise, capitalism will disappear. Forever. And people will live decently.
.....etc etc etc

Diego

“Usually the nonsense liberals spout is kind of cute, but in wartime their instinctive idiocy is life-threatening.”
Ann Coulter

I have taken the liberty of deleting the initial delirium of grandeur that preceded the above paragraph in order to spare you the bad joke. In future I encourage anyone who dissents with me to openly post your views for all to read. After all that is what is all about, debate.
So I now know that Mr Diego from Chile is a clear enemy of "capitalism" and a defender of ... Well not sure, he did not say...Oh yes, paradise on earth, that's right, just like JW and Mormons, but perhaps with a different slant, time will tell, I am enjoying this immensely.
Meanwhile global warming and the lure of world domination by default seems to have an irresistible charm for Diego, destroy capitalism and spring will...well spring up and turn all green.
Clearly he is not the only one believing this or we wouldn't have a Copenhagen 'fiesta'. My only worry is that after all the fuel burned to get the delegates thee and after all the hot air and CH4 they will emit, global warming may actually start occurring. What the sun couldn't do despite the biggest efforts in falsifying graphs and data, the hot air in Denmark may just push us over the edge.

[Jimbo1490]

Just as a quick 'thumbnail' example of how the 'environazi' tactics of the climate alarmists which Guillermo referred to above will actually hurt rather than help the environment, consider that a huge fraction of the earth's population still heats and cooks primarily by burning wood. All those people in those underdeveloped lands would like to have modern electric heating and cooking. But the 'greens' will not permit them to electrify unless they use 'renewable' energy sources such as wind and solar. As any sane person knows, these cannot compete with fossil fuels. Even during the crude oil price spike, so-called renewables were still non-competitive with fossil fuels. The only way they 'work' is by being heavily subsidised by the government; which is a sort of wealth re-distribution. So WE cannot afford rebewables without massive subsidies, and we are relatively rich. How do you expect that underveveloped nations will be able to afford this 'boutique' power source? The answer is: They can't. This means they will continue to burn wood to cook and heat, with the accompanying huge output of soot and CO2 per unit of heat and deforestation to acquire the wood.

Jimbo

[Marco1]

Originally Posted by Jimbo1490

Just as a quick 'thumbnail' example of how the 'environazi' tactics of the climate alarmists which Guillermo referred to above will actually hurt rather than help the environment, consider that a huge fraction of the earth's population still heats and cooks primarily by burning wood. All those people in those underdeveloped lands would like to have modern electric heating and cooking. But the 'greens' will not permit them to electrify unless they use 'renewable' energy sources such as wind and solar. As any sane person knows, these cannot compete with fossil fuels. Even during the crude oil price spike, so-called renewables were still non-competitive with fossil fuels. The only way they 'work' is by being heavily subsidised by the government; which is a sort of wealth re-distribution. So WE cannot afford rebewables without massive subsidies, and we are relatively rich. How do you expect that underveveloped nations will be able to afford this 'boutique' power source? The answer is: They can't. This means they will continue to burn wood to cook and heat, with the accompanying huge output of soot and CO2 per unit of heat and deforestation to acquire the wood. Jimbo

Yet the new Global Warming Nazional Socialism, is not interested in saving the planet. The criminals that are behind this organisation are after the creation of one world government and the creation of a one world tax system. Just the creation of another layer of power that has nothing to do with left wing little aspirants to the magician's apprentice job.

THe left in every country has fallen for this with the greens and the enviro this or that, in bed with the worst of the right wing power brokers.
And that is the funniest part of it all.

Clearly the crimes committed to produce this science fiction parody will eventually come out one by one and the effort will crumble away, and take with it the little credibility the greens had left.
When that happens, the industries will perhaps swing the pendulum too far to the other side and that is what will damage the efforts in cleaning up the real pollution.
Not CO2 but chemical spills, food contamination, insecticides, GM crops and all the rest that is really worth fighting against.

Oh well, if all fails we can always go to Chile and help Zorro.
__________________

[Guillermo]

Just a quick word to tell you I'm suffering a nice array of personal attacks from the spanish GWA guys, because of the articles of mine which have been published. No scientific arguments defending the anthropogenic warming theory, but personal attacks and appeals to authority. It seems we have the same kind of sad attitudes everywhere. A pity.

Cheers.

[masalai]

So sad when logical debate and any sense of reason flies out the door leaving the 'wankers' and '********s' to grab the floor banging their empty pots and pans - which they probably stole from mummy....

Guillermo, Just keep a low profile for a while - they seem to have a short attention span... The uneducated of the world seem to have been let loose...

[Marco1]

.......No scientific arguments defending the anthropogenic warming theory, but personal attacks and appeals to authority. It seems we have the same kind of sad attitudes everywhere. A pity.

I had an email from a member of another forum telling me that "he was in a position that allowed him to check me over" as a reply to my posts exposing what I consider the Global warming fraud.
Can you imagine what it would be if a world wide political consensus is reached on this issue? The end of democracy and free speech to begin with. Followed by the hunt for deniers and sceptics. Public floggings perhaps?
Thankfully the multiple crimes committed to push forward this parody will slowly come out and erode all credibility to the argument of anthropogenic global warming.
PS
I like the simile of the pots and pans stolen from mum. Glad to hear from a fellow Australian.
Hum may be it was also intended for me?

[masalai]

Marco, welcome to the fray... Only if you mark the man and not the ball... To debate the point and refrain from using personal insults on an individual... I am inclined to "boil" readily but do not call the poster names often, usually resort to "A poster with this view must be firmly of the "troglodyte" or some such sub-species..."

Generally such claims of "identification" are mere masturbation or some such... Use this link and it will tell you where you are - http://en.utrace.de/ip-address/ - by picking up your IP number... In Australia there are privacy protocols, I am beside a lake at the Queensland University - With the IP number of anyone in USA you should get their physical address, but not here...

If you are concerned about keeping your computer stuff private do a google search for Ubuntu, or LinuxMint... I use the latter and am not worried by worms, trojans or viruses... PM me if you want more info, I have a couple of pdf files I could send...

[Marco1]

Yes, haha, troglodyte has a good sound to it. What an old term, come on fess up how old are you?

Actually "El Zorro" sent me a private message with a big long rant about his own perceived status and stature, complete of history and heirloom.
At the same time about how low I am in the food chain, crawling in the gutter. THe usual garbage.

Debate the idea not the person is a good principle. I would add another to it.
And that is never write to a person something you wouldn't like to, or be game to, or otherwise deem to be improper to say in person.
It is that simple in my view anyway.

[hoytedow]

Originally Posted by Guillermo

Just a quick word to tell you I'm suffering a nice array of personal attacks from the spanish GWA guys, because of the articles of mine which have been published. No scientific arguments defending the anthropogenic warming theory, but personal attacks and appeals to authority. It seems we have the same kind of sad attitudes everywhere. A pity.

Cheers.

Let us hope these guys lose the wind from their sails while their mentiras are exposed.