What Do We Think About Climate Change

[masalai]

or lies? either way it will point the thinking person in the same direction

[Pericles]

"However dare to criticize and you are socially ostracized, everyone is a rabid climate change cheer leader now!"

Not for much longer as the world's economic slowdown continues. There is a sea change coming.

http://www.sepp.org/publications/NIPCC-Feb%2020.pdf

As for sense and sensibility, here is Scotland about to the first to freeze. It's crazy, because there is still plenty of coal to be mined and clean coal technology without CO2 sequestration is very efficient for generating electricity.

http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/200...mentalism.html

We need massive amounts of CO2 for growing food.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_coal

It's a long journey, but the first steps have been taken.

Perry

[masalai]

I think I am as ready as I can for whatever transpires... Just a matter of sitting and watching... and doing what masalais do - play at throwing little red fishes...

Not forgetting to keep watch in case there are some changes to be made or available...

[Meanz Beanz]

Its great isn't it, we have a sense of entitlement when it comes to energy, turn the power out and listen the complaints. We want it cheap, we want it reliable and now we want to tell the industry all the things they can't do to generate it, which with the NIMBY crew down here includes many "green " alternates. We decree that the most expensive and impractical means be used requiring massive investment in dubious technology yet we balk at any increase in cost. Yikes... something has to give!

Clean coal tech looks viable down here but there is massive resistance to both that and nuclear. Push will come to shove at some point and some compromise will be made, the people will not tolerate excessive energy bills for long.... that's a government changer.

I would settle for seeing a greater degree of intellectual honesty in the dinner table debate, just seeing the populace armed with more in the way of facts about the real choices they are making, filling in the grey between the black and white sound bites we receive via the main stream media.

MBz

[masalai]

Hi Heinz,
I had a beaut response all typed up, went to post and I had dropped out somehow - Oh well ...
Last first, Even if a Poly had the desire and opportunity to make a useful decision several things woiuld interfere... - The bureaucrats would have great difficulty in using their brains as devices to implement thoughts into actions - need for 10 tons of documentation to authorise and indemnify the decision makers implementing the first decision by the politician... - The media would not be able to run with it as it could not be made into a sound bite/flash image... - the NIMBY or and all who feel disenfranchised or adversely impacted would cry long and loud... The good idea would quietly get placed on the too hard shelf...

I am not (and never have been) keen on nuclear power... - Wind is a bit variable and capital intensive for the output, (no research just a feeling from media - ?reliability?) - - - On the plus side, PM Rudd has espoused favour with CO2 sequestration to the extent of promoting and facilitating that with China on his recent visit, . . . This suggests that it could see implementation in Aussy... I would also like to see geothermal power given more support and encouragement as this and coal is in abundance in Aussy...

On a personal level, endeavour to be as self sufficient in all the things that make life comfortable. Grow ones own food, use the $8000 subsidy to set up solar photovoltaic power, harvest ones own water for drinking, showers & laundry etc., recycle water for garden and septic flushing. Done that, and found it quite a rewarding and satisfying activity...

I will be installing solar within 6 months. water tanks will be part of the new home on a slightly bigger block. This house will become a boat... Just the boat design to be sorted...

[Meanz Beanz]

I want to build a house, a passive solar house inside out to the way we do it now. Thin skin, good insulation and thermal mass on the inside. With the right sun protection to allow winter sun in and keep summer sun at bay and the correct ventilation it could come close to not requiring extra heating or cooling. Double gazing would be required to manage heat flows but aside from that I think it should not be an overly expensive exercise.

There is a Canadian idea for heating that is a simple pile of blue stone enclosed in a long hut that is basically just a 45 degree pitched roof, double glass on one side and insulation on the other and at the ends. Its orientated to collect heat during the day and the glass can be covered by night to contain the collected heat. A simple fan is used to circulate the air from the house through the hut and it collects heat from the blue stone. Apparently its very effective and heats for the cost of running a fan.

Solar power intrigues, lighting is very doable now with LED. I would like to see better storage tech and I don't know about running heavy loads like washing machines etc.

Lived off tanks before, that's easy and we had not even gone as far a recycling water via reed bed systems or anything like that. Great improvements to be made there. Don't know about composting loos... need convincing on that one.

You are right, there is a certain satisfaction in not being overly reliant on the system... there are plans in the works but life circumstances don't permit a move yet, maybe soon but not yet.

Veges from Woolies are getting so crook that growing my own is under serious consideration if only to taste a decent tomato once again!

Sounds like Tom and "The Good Life" LOL

[Pericles]

Guys, guys, guys! What words do we not understand? Carbon Dioxide is good for all living creatures on this planet as it fuels plant growth. Famines occurred in past centuries when CO2 levels dropped to around 200 ppm Tomato growers burn propane to raise the level of CO2 in their greenhouses to 1000 ppm. Current levels of CO2 are about 390 ppm.

As we enter a period of global cooling and with a population in excess of 6.2 billion people, of whom many millions are starving now, what will be the result of reduced levels CO2 on plant growth?

However, the CO2 situation palls into insignificance alongside the reality that because growing seasons will be shorter and the grain growing lands of North America will not be so large, even those of us living in the 1st world will have to tighten our belts.

I grant that it is difficult for some to let go of the propaganda hammered in by the greens, the idea that each individual must reduce their own personal carbon footprints and reducing CO2 emissions is good, but you have been lied to. Therefore, let there be no more discussion.

Rudd, Bush, Brown, Sarkozy, Merkel and the rest of western politicians are useless buggers. Luckily, both India and China will continue to emit CO2. Even CO2 at 600 ppm will not stop global cooling, but it will maximise crops.

http://www.sepp.org/

http://www.globalgoldtalk.com/invest...an-caused.html

Who said said “‘global warming’? We never meant ‘global warming.’ We meant “‘global climate disruption’!”

Answer, John Holdren.

http://www.heartland.org/NewYork08/newyork08.cfm

Why don’t you put an official NOAA temperature sensor over concrete?
Because the measurements will be wrong. Garbage in, garbage out.

http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/

Perry

PS This is real time image of sun. Where is Sunspot cycle 24?

http://sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov/data/...24/latest.html

[masalai]

OK I will endeavour to respond as I read (well past my bed-time as I arise early for "caring duties"... At last someone in Victoria interested in "passive solar" instead of double brick... Site orientation has a significant impact. Have one gable (sloping surface facing north ish to carry your solar hot water panels (thermal) and photovoltaic panels at an angle such that it is close to right-angles to the winter noon sun.

A good thermal capacitor is a central positioning of large water tanks - no heating as the temperature is stabilised and holds remarkably steadily. The hot water can be fed into this tank in the mornings (after shower needs) if the core temperature needs boosting - need a really cold stretch to need that... Totally passive... to cool ensure cross flow ventilation can accept prevailing breezes. Surround northern and western verandahs and courtyards with table grape vines - prune after harvest for winter warmth...

For nor do not worry about batteries, sell the surplus to the electricity supplier and reduce your electricity bill. Low energy "fluro" globes are good value at 14 watts and less leave the leds for 12 or 24 V systems in your boat...

I have used dry/composting loos, but yes I prefer the standard water cistern too...

If you intend to stay in the frozen south then a glasshouse for year round production would be advisable... Well done, between the both of us we have solved most of the worlds problems....

[Meanz Beanz]

Perry this is more about liveability than any CO2 phobia. I take what you say but I will always seek to create efficient elegant solutions to problems, current standard building practice is neither IMO. There are many benefits of building the right way, mostly just creating a great environment in which to live and get the best of our climate.

[Meanz Beanz]

Originally Posted by masalai

A good thermal capacitor is a central positioning of large water tanks - no heating as the temperature is stabilised and holds remarkably steadily.

Yes, I have read about building around a 10,000 gal concrete tank...

Bed time.. CYA.

MBz

[Pericles]

PRESTO FROM SIDC - RWC BELGIUM Tue Apr 22 2008, 1149 UT

Solar activity is expected to be extremely low for the next 48 hours.
Geomagnetic activity is expected to be active within the next 48 hours. The first 24 hours of the forecast period are expected to be mostly quiet. Unsettled to active conditions might occur in the second half of April 23rd, due to a recurrent coronal hole.

http://sidc.oma.be/

Consequences of sunspot activity.

ABSTRACT.

We have recently suggested that one solar cycle was lost in the beginning of the Dalton minimum because of sparse and partly unreliable sunspot observations during 1790s (Usoskin et al. 2001). So far this cycle
has been combined with the preceding activity to form the exceptionally long solar cycle #4 in 1784-1799 which has an irregular phase evolution (known
as the phase catastrophe) and other problems discussed in earlier literature. Based on a re-analysis of available sunspot data, we have suggested that solar cycle #4 is in fact a superposition of two cycles: a normal cycle in 1784-1793 ending at the start of the Dalton minimum, and a new weak cycle in 1793-1800 which was the first cycle within the Dalton minimum.
Including the new cycle resolves the phase catastrophe and leads to a consistent view of sunspot activity around the Dalton minimum. It also restores the Gnevyshev-Ohl rule of cycle pairing across the
Daltom nimimum. Here we summarize these findings and show that the existence of a new cycle is supported by the auroral occurrence in Europe in
late XVIII century.

http://spaceweb.oulu.fi/~kalevi/publ..._lostcycle.pdf

Hell's teeth! These reports are an education in themselves.

Perry

[Pericles]

MB,

"seek to create efficient elegant solutions to problems, current standard building practice is neither IMO."

I could not agree more! Building regulations and planning permissions in the UK also work against innovation. Land is next to impossible to buy and even sheds cost a fortune. Look at this 1950s prefabricated concrete panel house with thin and poorly insulated walls.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetai...a_n=1&tr_t=buy

The answer has to be to live on a boat and enjoy a beautiful environment whilst moored up.

http://photography.nationalgeographi...pod_image.html

Perry

[charmc]

Brian, Perry, Guillermo, and MB/Heinz,

Not much time here (myself), posted a rant in crude oil. Al Gore was hyper-defensive when asked how his family's multiple fuel-hogging vehicles and energy wasteful homes and general lifestyle were justified as he preached radical policy and practice changes for all the world. Mumbled something about buying energy credits, shouted that his entire family had a "carbon-neutral footprint, if you even understand what that means", and has never allowed another interview by that news organization. Meanwhile Al continues as the wealthiest former Vice President in history, fleecing the eco-freaks for all they're worth.

Many good reasons to minimize consumption and fossil fuel use; more sense shown here than in the halls of most governments (obvious but tragic).

Gads, you guys are youngsters! I was studying macro and micro econ and thinking Keynes was maybe good theory, but what gave anyone the right to play Robin Hood (least of all governments, which by nature rob from everyone and give to themselves and their friends/backers), in the mid 1960s.

[Meanz Beanz]

Originally Posted by charmc

Many good reasons to minimize consumption and fossil fuel use;

That's my feeling, yes lets make OUR environment healthier but lets not wreck peoples livelihoods in the process. Lets understand why its best to move away from carbon and its real supply limitations and not be panicked into bad moves by carnival barkers.

[masalai]

Endorsed, (Charles, Perry, Guillermo & Heinz) with a chuckle of approval - sorry no soundbites available...