Sea Planes

[lazeyjack]

for those really into planes dial up tupolev, he was perhaps the most proflific designer of any and all aircraft
You all know my admiration for thing s Ru in ships , aviation, they had and have 100,s of seaplanes and amphibs

[charmc]

Seaplanes and the big ground effect "planes" make sense for the eastern half of Russia, given the long distances and need to gain access to remote areas where large land airbases have not been built yet. Development of designs usually follows needs and the most cost effective solution. Russian designers have been outstanding in developing simple and rugged aircraft able to be maintained in remote areas.

The Pan Am Clippers and other big seaplanes enabled flight to less developed areas without hard runways; they were necessary in their time. WW II aviation developments meant that there were both large long range aircraft and hard runways in many parts of the world, so the need for large seaplanes declined.

Salt is definitely a problem for seaplanes. In Miami there was a fatal crash of an amphibian a few years ago. The wing snapped off as the plane was climbing out after takeoff. The small airline was once family owned; they were obsessive about maintenance. More recently it was bought by a holding company, maintenance became the bare minimum needed to keep FAA certification ...

[lazeyjack]

Originally Posted by charmc

Seaplanes and the big ground effect "planes" make sense for the eastern half of Russia, given the long distances and need to gain access to remote areas where large land airbases have not been built yet. Development of designs usually follows needs and the most cost effective solution. Russian designers have been outstanding in developing simple and rugged aircraft able to be maintained in remote areas.

The Pan Am Clippers and other big seaplanes enabled flight to less developed areas without hard runways; they were necessary in their time. WW II aviation developments meant that there were both large long range aircraft and hard runways in many parts of the world, so the need for large seaplanes declined.

Salt is definitely a problem for seaplanes. In Miami there was a fatal crash of an amphibian a few years ago. The wing snapped off as the plane was climbing out after takeoff. The small airline was once family owned; they were obsessive about maintenance. More recently it was bought by a holding company, maintenance became the bare minimum needed to keep FAA certification ...

read Shutes book abt the Reindeer, , a story abt metal fatigue in tail spar of the plane NO HIGHWAY, that's an order
I have flow out of Kemerove Siberia on Tups and to St Pete, I have absolute faith in Ru pilots in snow

[Bergalia]

Lazey makes the (THE) valid point - maintenance. And it's on that, that I suggested 'saltwater' was 'no problem'. The RAF/Navy were meticulous in their maintenance schedules for the escort Sunderlands (less so for their crews). As an afternote my brother suggests that the three aircraft used on the Scottish West Coast for convoy patrols eventually found their way down south and did brief service during the 'Berlin Airlift'. He's still looking for the photos of the old feller and his crew.

[lazeyjack]

Originally Posted by Bergalia

Lazey makes the (THE) valid point - maintenance. And it's on that, that I suggested 'saltwater' was 'no problem'. The RAF/Navy were meticulous in their maintenance schedules for the escort Sunderlands (less so for their crews). As an afternote my brother suggests that the three aircraft used on the Scottish West Coast for convoy patrols eventually found their way down south and did brief service during the 'Berlin Airlift'. He's still looking for the photos of the old feller and his crew.

ok mate, those grummens were built 52, and I think THEY MAY BE STILL FLYING aK

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by lazeyjack

read Shutes book abt the Reindeer, , a story abt metal fatigue in tail spar of the plane NO HIGHWAY,

This book is about an aircraft engineer who said the metal fatige would eventually cause the tail to fall off. However he got his hangar temperature wrong or more like dis regarded it . When corrected his mathamatics proved to be correct and it fell off.

Riveting stuff!

[lazeyjack]

Originally Posted by jack frost

This book is about an aircraft engineer who said the metal fatige would eventually cause the tail to fall off. However he got his hangar temperature wrong or more like dis regarded it . When corrected his mathamatics proved to be correct and it fell off.

Riveting stuff!

but jack you just spent a week telling us you don't read fiction?
So if you read that you MUST have read SLIDE RULE?

[Frosty]

I didnt look the book I read the film.

Dont have time for books --my eyes can take in information thousands of times faster than the written word.

[Bergalia]

Hey Stu - is there any way we can ensure this man doesn't pollute the human gene pool.....

[Poida]

Land based air travel is here to stay, and the flying boats only occupy the niche markets that require them, i.e. bush and small island service.

Oh jehardiman me mate, what a left brain thinker you are.

Now what if the Wright Brothers thought like you.

It crashed doesn't work, give up.

There was a time in aviation history, where I don't know, when single wing spans were banned as too many crashed. It was just a matter of getting the right design.

Seaplanes could be used in emergency relief, sometimes airports are too far from the effected areas. Transporting a few hundred troops in a hurry to basically any coastline in the world.

Also in times of war enemy airstrips are bombed to prevent their planes from taking off. Imagine hangers around the coast where planes could take off and the list goes on, or it would if I could think of anything.

Poida

[Bergalia]

A point that jehardiman seems to overlook is that the majority of population centres i.e. world capitals, cities, and conurbations are built on or near a waterfront. Land in these capitals, cities etc is fast becoming a premium asset - and unlikely to be 'sacrificed' for airport extensions. Instead it would logical that a greater emphasis will be placed on air transport that can use the relatively 'cheap' water space for access.

[Poida]

I wish I could have said that Bergalia.

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by Guillermo

"Belly of the plane"....Some photos, already posted somewhere else in these forums.

The Bell Aerospace Air Cushion Landing System. I have somewhere a once classified paper/pdf on many more designs and configurations. PM me if you are into that stuff and I'll try to dig it up.

[Bergalia]

Originally Posted by Poida

I wish I could have said that Bergalia.

It's what was at the back of your argument Poida...It's just that (being really old) I've got more time on my hands to flesh out your original theory....

[lazeyjack]

not sure whether this girl was built
http://www.329amphibian.com/Largest_...n_Aircraft.htm