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  #16  
Old 08-21-2013, 05:17 PM
Grey Ghost Grey Ghost is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
Hello Leo Lazauskas and djaus,thanks for your advice,i really appreciate everyones advice,SORRY MY REPLY IS VERY LONG BUT ITS INTERESTING,i have been contacting yachting lawyers but haven't been succesful.
--
I have beached my yacht 3 times before because im learning and you make mistakes while learning and because i was in control those 3 times i unbeached it every time but this 4th time it gently glided onto the stone beach and was perfectly O.K. but 2 people walking past said they would phone the coast guard and i said NO THANKS I DONT NEED THEM but they phoned them anyway and 7 of them arrived at 8pm and CONFUSED THE SITUATION,one said we will come back after midnight when the tide comes back in and tow you to the harbour THEY NEVER CAME BACK,a female coastguard said theres going to be force 6 gales and she was insisting i sleep in my tent in the field WHICH THEY INSISTED ERECTING IT FOR ME and i thought they could have powers like the police to arrest me for not obeying them but i was so exhuasted from a 4 hour sea journey and from being up since 6am i just wanted to rest,so i lay in my tent thinking my yachts going to get damaged and fell asleep within minutes SO I REGRET NOT GETTING BACK ON MY YACHT where i would of put my 2 anchors out the stern and wait for the tide to return and gently pull my yacht of the stone beach WHICH I HAVE DONE IN THE PAST.
--
In the morning my yacht was washed onto its side at the top of the beach with one keel slightly damaged and balast missing,I WAS SHOCKED at the damage and did not know what i should do to repair it or how to get to the nearest town 6 miles away,the coast guard had told me someone would return to see me in the morning and 2 harbour masters arrived early morning.
-
They put a rope around the yacht and used there 4x4 to pull it onto the keels but IF I KNEW WHAT TO DO i would of asked for there phone number and told them to leave the yacht on its side and i would repair the keel and rudder myself within 3 days BUT IT TOOK ME 5 DAYS to find out what i should do and what balast to use,we then drove back to Porthmadog so i could start finding out what to do and they said they would go back out with plywood to put under the keels to drag my yacht off the stone beach and back to Porthmadog harbour.
-
I seen the harbour master later in the day expecting my yacht to be in the harbour but they said they managed to float the yacht but it tipped over and now its going to get flooded and break up when the tide comes in THAT WAS THERE VERY WORDS,i couldn't believe what i was hearing,then the following day they sent me photos of the 2 keels grounded down to the hull and the yacht submerged half on and off the beach.
-
Another few days later after my yachting friend said it was repairable and myself realising i could of repaired it on the first day but now it was getting too expensive too replace both keels so i started thinking of selling parts or giving it away rather than it being destroyed.
-
These harbour masters knowingly wrecklessly dealt with my yacht as if they didnt know what they were doing or if they did know what they were doing they are guilty of willfuly intentionaly vandalising my yacht,SHOULDN'T THEY KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING to be imployed as harbour masters???? car mechanics KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING.
-
My yacht was on a very remote stone beach lined with fields for miles in both directions and there was no urgency in getting it removed,I HAD 3 ANCHORS AND ROPES TO SECURE IT,if it was blocking a harbour entrance then it would be urgent to remove it,so i can only assume they were willfuly trying to sabotage recovering my yacht which CARRIES A 2,500 FINE.
------------------
https://www.gov.uk/wreck-and-salvage-law
QUOTE FROM HALFWAY DOWN,- Summary of offences and penalties ---- S.246 (3) - impeding or hindering attempts to save a vessel, concealing any wreck, defacing or obliterating any mark, and wrongfully carrying away or removing any wreck carries a 2,500 fine on summary conviction
-
MY OTHER SUSPICION OF WILLFUL VANDALISM IS for 12 years since year 2000 in Tollcross,Edinburgh when myself and other locals constantly complained to the police about violent youths,harrassing,threatening people,kicking footballs against shop windows trying to break them and this going on for weeks i got angry with the police and threatened to do something about it and since then corrupt police have been spreading false rumours instructing people to harrass me and to vandalise my property like slashing bike tyres,buckling wheels telling people the police are trying to get me put in a psychiatric hospital and after 5 years i have found out thousands of other citizens are being subjected to a Stalanist police state system that now runs europe and America and that the recession and banker bailouts are a SCAM to steal peoples money to TRANSFER WEALTH and create an elitist super rich class and a super poor class just like Stalin did where the elites plan to get rid of all the poor class because they say the world is over populated and they plan to reduce world population from 7 billion to 500 million people by year 2030 within the next 16 years,THIS IS STATED in U.N. AGENDA 21 signed by 200 heads of governments,including,Bush senior,Clinton,Obama.
-
Bill and Melinda Gates polio vaccination campaign in India and Africa is a cover to sterilize millions of Indian and African children with hidden sterilization vaccines hidden in the polio vaccine.
-------
George Green is a former investment banker who worked with the people
planning to take over the world,he is now exposing them. http://www.nohoax.com/
-
George Green Interview February 2010 part 1/6 YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMU8o3wH8Gk
At 3;36mins elites plan on reducing world population
At 4:35mins elites plan to get war started in the middle east by year
2000 to then spread to USA as depopulation plan
At 8:25mins the people who rule the planet are the BIS Bank of
International Settlements in Switzerland http://www.bis.org/ they are
controled by the Rothschilds they control 85% of the worlds wealth and
control the legal system,courts,food supply,media,
At 8:32mins the elites headed by the Rothchild family are currently in
process of killing millions of people using ANY WAY NECESSARY because
of ecological unsustainability,THEY ARE DRIVING THE BREAKDOWN OF
SOCIETY.
At 9:55mins George says extraterrestrials engineered our planet to
sustain 500 million people and the ruling elites are currently
reducing world population to that level over the next 16 years by year
2030.
----------------------------
George Green Interview - February 2010 part 3/6
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcYIiHUKjSM
At 7mins there are 50 million Americans who do not pay income tax
because they found out its not written into law now the IRS have no right to arrest anyone for not paying there taxes
-----------------
From Freedom to Facsism a movie by Aaron Russo
-------------
Bank for International Settlements
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_fo...al_Settlements
-
BIS Bank of International Settlements in Switzerland http://www.bis.org/
-
Georgia Guidestones,standing stones engraved by the global elites when Jimmy Carter was president saying they want to keep the world population to 500,000,000 million,its written in 9 languages.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_Guidestones
-
====== EX-ROYAL NAVY LT. COMMANDER Brian Gerrish =========
-
'Charity' Common Purpose investigated by Brian Gerrish | Edge Media
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-HEZXSA2u0
Brian and his ex-Navy friends set up BOAT BUILDING business in Plymouth to help unemployed youth,his business started to get threatened to shut it down he was told COMMON PURPOSE were behind the threats.
-
http://www.ukcolumn.org/ UK Column founded by Ex-Royal Navy Lt. Commander Brian Gerrish in Plymouth,U.K. (WATCH LIVE) 1pm mon-fri,
exposes COMMON PURPOSE installed as secret organisation is dismatling all government and authority organisations in U.K. to bring in police state dictatorship.
----
Lt Commander Brian Gerrish resigned from the Royal Navy because he could no longer follow corrupt orders intentionaly designed to destroy the British fishing industry.
----
Brian Gerrish,UK Column Live - 16th August 2012
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQryI...feature=relmfu
At 44:42mins Brian Gerrish interviews Roger Hayes former member of the UKIP party about the NWO communist One World Government and the intentional breakdown of society and being unlawfully inprisoned for not paying council tax to a corrupt government,Roger Hayes
is now Chairman of The British Constitution Group
http://www.thebcgroup.org.uk/
Now I understand the harbourmaster's actions better.


  #17  
Old 08-21-2013, 06:13 PM
Petros Petros is offline
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I doubt there was any intentional vandalism on the part of the harbor master, just plain and stupid negligence. They started out by thinking they were helping you out, but gave you very bad advice, that should have been your first clue. Needless to say, the further they "helped" you, the more damage they did. I would say these people were completely clueless and had no business offering you help, they should have suggested you get someone properly equipped to help you.

If you expect to get anywhere in any official court or action against a government agency, do not mention your conspiracy theories.

A famous British historian once said "never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by stupidity". Which is what he have here.
  #18  
Old 08-21-2013, 10:45 PM
Leo Lazauskas's Avatar
Leo Lazauskas Leo Lazauskas is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
i have been contacting yachting lawyers but haven't been succesful.
Then you will probably lose the case.
It is too complicated for you. You cannot handle this yourself and you
cannot even get your act together to arrange a lawyer.

I might sound a bit harsh in this reply, but I can assure you that you
will face much harsher criticism and questions if your case ever gets
to court.

Your conspiracy theories and some other things you have said suggest
that you might have been under treatment for some kind of psychological
problems in the past. It might be advisable to see a doctor before you
take on a complicated legal case.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
I have beached my yacht 3 times before because im learning and you make
mistakes while learning and because i was in control those 3 times i
unbeached it every time but this 4th time it gently glided onto the
stone beach and was perfectly O.K. but 2 people walking past said they
would phone the coast guard and i said NO THANKS I DONT NEED THEM but
they phoned them anyway and 7 of them arrived at 8pm and CONFUSED THE
SITUATION,one said we will come back after midnight when the tide comes
back in and tow you to the harbour THEY NEVER CAME BACK,a female
coastguard said theres going to be force 6 gales and she was insisting
i sleep in my tent in the field WHICH THEY INSISTED ERECTING IT FOR ME
and i thought they could have powers like the police to arrest me for
not obeying them but i was so exhuasted from a 4 hour sea journey and
from being up since 6am i just wanted to rest,so i lay in my tent
thinking my yachts going to get damaged and fell asleep within minutes
SO I REGRET NOT GETTING BACK ON MY YACHT where i would of put my 2
anchors out the stern and wait for the tide to return and gently pull
my yacht of the stone beach WHICH I HAVE DONE IN THE PAST.
You admit to being inexperienced.

You just told us the coastguard said there was a storm approaching.

You told us you didn't anchor the boat because you were too exhausted.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
In the morning my yacht was washed onto its side at the top of the
beach with one keel slightly damaged and balast missing,I WAS SHOCKED
at the damage and did not know what i should do to repair it or how
to get to the nearest town 6 miles away,the coast guard had told me
someone would return to see me in the morning and 2 harbour masters
arrived early morning.
You have again admitted you don't know how to handle a simple situation
on your own.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
They put a rope around the yacht and used there 4x4 to pull it onto
the keels but IF I KNEW WHAT TO DO i would of asked for there phone
number and told them to leave the yacht on its side and i would repair
the keel and rudder myself within 3 days BUT IT TOOK ME 5 DAYS to find
out what i should do and what balast to use,we then drove back to
Porthmadog so i could start finding out what to do and they said they
would go back out with plywood to put under the keels to drag my yacht
off the stone beach and back to Porthmadog harbour.
You have just admitted you did not know what to do.

It sounds like somebody else decided to take responsibility.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
I seen the harbour master later in the day expecting my yacht to be in
the harbour but they said they managed to float the yacht but it tipped
over and now its going to get flooded and break up when the tide comes
in THAT WAS THERE VERY WORDS,i couldn't believe what i was hearing,then
the following day they sent me photos of the 2 keels grounded down to
the hull and the yacht submerged half on and off the beach.
Why did they send photos to you?
Was there a letter attached to the photos?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
Another few days later after my yachting friend said it was repairable
and myself realising i could of repaired it on the first day but now it
was getting too expensive too replace both keels so i started thinking
of selling parts or giving it away rather than it being destroyed.
You have admitted to not doing anything positive to get rid of the boat.
"Thinking" does not qualify as action.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
These harbour masters knowingly wrecklessly dealt with my yacht as if
they didnt know what they were doing or if they did know what they were
doing they are guilty of willfuly intentionaly vandalising my yacht,
SHOULDN'T THEY KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING to be imployed as harbour
masters???? car mechanics KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING.
Your accusation has no weight at all. That is for a court to decide.
You are close to slandering these people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
My yacht was on a very remote stone beach lined with fields for miles
in both directions and there was no urgency in getting it removed,I HAD
3 ANCHORS AND ROPES TO SECURE IT,if it was blocking a harbour entrance
then it would be urgent to remove it,so i can only assume they were
willfuly trying to sabotage recovering my yacht which CARRIES A 2,500 FINE.
You are again close to slandering these people. You do not know their
motives, which seem quite reasonable to me.

You must get a lawyer. If you are not competent to do that, ask your
"yachting friend" to help arrange one for you.

If you do proceed with legal action and lose, you could be hit with a very
large bill for legal costs of both sides. The harbour authorities might also
decide to charge you for the time and expense of moving your boat.

The lawyers you get might want most of their fees in advance.
Do you really want to gamble a lot of money on winning this case?
Do you really want the psychological stress of taking on this action?
  #19  
Old 08-21-2013, 11:09 PM
djaus djaus is offline
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Well I'm blow away! Sounds like you got the short end of the stick & have been for some time. After what you have stated about the local police having it in for you I don't think it would be worth the effort of trying to sue the harbourmaster's. Logic would depict they are all friends.

It does sound like the harbourmaster went back & dragged your boat deliberately to damage it, possibly beyond repair. There's no way anyone in their right mind would drag a fibreglass yacht across rocks & expect not to do further damage. The yacht wasn't fit for the water anyhow with one damaged keel so why would they do it.

Sounds like you need to cut your losses & emigrate elsewhere!

Have you considered asking locals (like farmers) for private assistance, get your yacht out of the water & fit a single keel, this would be a quicker repair job than having to do 2 keels. I actually have in my possession some plans for a 21ft twin keel yacht. The required ballast for the 2 keels is 200kg each (roughly 150/180 pounds). These keels can be moulded with concrete by utilising holes dug into soil or sand. Dragging this situation to court will take forever so don't bother. Move onward & upward from here.

Get the boat out of the water with a crane, forklift or tractor & make good on repairs. In future don't get grounded or rebuild the keels from a material that can withstand a thrashing.
__________________
Dirk.
  #20  
Old 08-21-2013, 11:36 PM
Leo Lazauskas's Avatar
Leo Lazauskas Leo Lazauskas is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djaus View Post
It does sound like the harbourmaster went back & dragged your boat deliberately to damage it, possibly beyond repair. There's no way anyone in their right mind would drag a fibreglass yacht across rocks & expect not to do further damage. The yacht wasn't fit for the water anyhow with one damaged keel so why would they do it.
And maybe the harbour master saved the life of someone who is not
competent and who cannot secure their boat for an approaching storm.
Maybe he even saved the boat from blowing away and hitting other vessels.

Did you read the bit about the storm and how the OP fell asleep before anchoring the boat securely?

There are several sides to this sad story. Don't judge it on one version alone.
  #21  
Old 08-22-2013, 02:43 AM
tomas tomas is offline
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Leo is correct.
  #22  
Old 08-22-2013, 05:13 AM
Ultimate Design Ultimate Design is offline
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Hello djaus/Dirk,you have a clear understanding of my situation and thanks for that.The harbour master did destroy my yacht and that is not slander its factualy what has happened and he should pay me the costs but going through courts and lawyers could increase the problem.

Yes its looking like im just going to have to cut my losses and emigrate and learn to avoid a situation like this happening again but with the increasing Stalanist police state system even in America "the land of the free" America is becoming a Stalanist police state aswell.

I phoned the farmer and he was willing to let me keep my yacht in his field for no more than a week until i repaired the keels but the harbour master had allready caused more damage to the keels by the time i found out who the farmer was,i had to contact every farmer in the area of my yacht before i found the farmer who owned the field next to my yacht and the farmer was not at home for 2 days.
-
================
-
Hello Leo Lazauskas,the coast gaurds told me there was an approaching gale force 6 storm but there was NO STORM arrived that night,the water was VERY WARM and there was no danger to me but only danger to my yacht.

I LIVED ON MY YACHT FOR A WEEK MOORED ON A BEACH IN Wales in 70mph winds IN APRIL when ships going to Ireland WERE CANCELLED,so this beaching my yacht on stones in calm seas wasn't a serious problem but the 2 guys walking on the beach insisted on calling the coast guards.

The coastguards anchored my yacht to the stone beach at 9pm at night BY PILING LARGE STONES ONTO THE ANCHOR and detered me from staying on my yacht to save it.
The coastgaurds told me they would come back after midnight and tow my yacht off the beach and they were in control of the situation,THEY NEVER CAME BACK with there boat.

I have beached my yacht before and recovered it safely on my own by throwing my anchors out the stern and NOT BY ANCHORING IT TO A STONE BEACH.

The coastguards CONFUSED the situation and they are authority figures and i have been treated badly by police authority figures who are BULLIES who demand that you are obedient to there authority or they punish you by locking you up,SO SHOULD I DISOBEY THESE AUTHORITY FIGURES AND SAVE MY YACHT or obey these authority figures and risk my yacht being damaged,THATS WHAT I WAS THINKING,rational thinking says I SHOULD SAVE MY YACHT,irrational authorities thinking says i have to obey authority.

For EXAMPLE: Tony Martin the farmer defended his property and life from known thiefs who regularly broke into his and other peoples property and farms but Tony Martin was inprisoned for 3 years but the police are allowed to defend there lives and property,so the message is clear authority says YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO DEFEND YOUR LIFE and property or you will be punished.

In London a police officer violently pushes Ian Tomlinson to the ground for no reason and Ian Tomlinson dies 10 minutes later but the police officer is not inprisoned as a dangerous person,this makes me worried that authority figures have freedom to do what they want even kill innocent people.

For EXAMPLE: Americans demand equal individual control over there lives as authority has over society,in communist countries individual freedom is not allowed and authority has complete control over the individual citizens WHERE NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO OWN A YACHT.

From my experience since year 2000 i have noticed we have a communist police state dictatorship George Orwell system becoming more powerful every year to take away peoples freedoms.
  #23  
Old 08-22-2013, 06:12 AM
Grey Ghost Grey Ghost is offline
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For freedom to leave your boat on any beach, go somewhere unpopulated.
  #24  
Old 08-22-2013, 01:33 PM
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Manie B Manie B is offline
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Jeez and I thought SAFA was bad, Johannesburg is a picnic spot
  #25  
Old 08-22-2013, 07:25 PM
Petros Petros is offline
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You are describing the kind of distopia as depicted in the British cult classic film "Brazil".

sounds like "Brazil" has arrived to the UK. I think this film was where I first heard the expression "were from the government, we are here to help". And "we are the government, we do not make mistakes".

The film is about a controlling intrusive government who sends out SWAT teams to find a guy going around repairing people's heating and air conditioning systems, and not charging any money for it.
  #26  
Old 08-22-2013, 07:47 PM
djaus djaus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo Lazauskas View Post
And maybe the harbour master saved the life of someone who is not
competent and who cannot secure their boat for an approaching storm.
Maybe he even saved the boat from blowing away and hitting other vessels.

Did you read the bit about the storm and how the OP fell asleep before anchoring the boat securely?

There are several sides to this sad story. Don't judge it on one version alone.
Q: why does EVERYONE believe that no-one is as competent as themselves? YES, I read the OP's thread.

The OP said he was exhausted & this is why he fell asleep. The harbour master had nothing to do with "securing" the yacht, He dragged it across a stone shoreline!

I believe it went like this: the OP had his yacht beached, a comfortable spot in no-one's way where he could make minor repairs.

Then the locals took it upon themselves to "interfere" as "they new best"!

The coast guard tried to help by advising of bad weather & securing the yacht. The yacht would have been better beached away from the shore or on a mooring when the next tide rolled in.
Considering what happened next (the yacht rolling over) I guess the OP made the right choice at the time as per the coast guards suggestion & camp in the field. THE COAST GUARD SHOULD HAVE RETURNED TO HELP THIS MAN! They abandoned The OP & his yacht by NOT returning to assist.

Then the harbour master stepped in to help by righting the yacht, he should have left it alone so the OP could fix the keel while it was upended. Then he returned without the OP's knowledge or permission & dragged the yacht across 20m of rock! How f___ing stupid can you get???

The harbour master is liable for damages, there's no doubt in my mind.

Lot's & lot's & lot's of people beach their yachts to make repairs. IT'S NORMAL! Dragging a damaged vessel across rocks to "refloat" it is crazy talk.

Twin keels yachts are designed with beaching in mind, again THAT'S NORMAL!. C'mon people, think before you post anymore "advice". It's better to have people think your a fool, than to open your mouth & remove all doubt.
__________________
Dirk.
  #27  
Old 08-22-2013, 08:06 PM
djaus djaus is offline
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If you decide you want to rebuild your yacht or a new one, I can help. I own 2 set's of design sheets for 2 twin keel yachts. A 21ft & a 26ft. Both designs are from the 60's, both are proven seaworthy, the 21ft is very similar to your yacht ironically. Please follow the link to see them.

http://www.gumtree.com.au/m-my-ad.html?adId=1023663001

I would gladly part with either of these design plans for you, for free. The 21ft plans could be used to fix your keels. They can be emailed in PDF form & opened with Adobe reader software. The Crusader is definitely something you can live on comfortably.
__________________
Dirk.
  #28  
Old 08-22-2013, 08:49 PM
Titirangi Titirangi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitepointer23 View Post
go and find the harbor master and give him a good punch in the face, might need the lawyer after that. i feel for you , it is not right that people can do that to your property
Intelligent advise I don't think
  #29  
Old 08-22-2013, 10:21 PM
Leo Lazauskas's Avatar
Leo Lazauskas Leo Lazauskas is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djaus View Post

The harbour master is liable for damages, there's no doubt in my mind.
Guarantee a loan for the advance in lawyer's fees then
There's no risk to you.
Of course, if the OP hasn't given us the whole story because he was as exhausted as a judge on the night in question...


  #30  
Old 08-22-2013, 11:04 PM
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rwatson rwatson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Design View Post
......
Bill and Melinda Gates polio vaccination campaign in India and Africa is a cover to sterilize millions of Indian and African children with hidden sterilization vaccines hidden in the polio vaccine.....
I wouldn't trust anyone who subscribes to rubbish like this, to present a sane and accurate account of anything.
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