New Genset Woes - Who To Advise re Design Defect?

[elmaceh]

We are a volunteer based non-profit working in Aceh and Nias. We recently purchased a gen-set from a well known Dutch maker for our aid vessel.

After repeated failures we have carefully analysed the unit and we have discovered a serious design fault causing cooling air to recycle through the silent housing.

The recycling of hot air is causing very high temperatures in the housing and and we are convinced that this has led to the breakdowns. Without question it is compromising the performance and longevity of the unit.

The company is denying any warranty responsibility and being rude and insulting in response to our requests for resolution.

Which organization can members recommend to assist us in seeking either resolution or failing that, a public airing of this unfortunate situation. We believe that ALL the gen sets made by this manufacturer should be recalled for modification and so we contend that this is a matter of public interest.

Hope you can assist.
Rick Cameron
Mission Coordinator http://www.island-aid.org

[safewalrus]

Just a thought, considering your an AID Agency makes you kinda special I believe - people may take notice of what you say! So Find the most influential tabloid news paper in the area of the poor performer (you know the paper I mean - the one with the T-A - L -L stories that everybody buys). they are normally on the lookout for good stories of human interest! OK so the tsunami is old news so make it new tell them all about it, don't mince your words and use a colourful account! With a bit of luck not only will you get the geny's sorted out but you'll get some good publicity as well (all publicity is good publicity, even the bad gets you noticed - this gets you needed funds to help you with your work!)

Well it's only a thought, may work

the Walrus

[Ike]

i spent many years working for the US Coast Guard managing product recalls. You have two problems here. First is what country was the product made in (or the Eurpean Economic Community). Second is where are you? If you bought the product somewhere else the company may have no legal responsibilty other than in the country of origin. Of course this does not excuse their behaviour.

The EEC does have proceedures for product recalls. here is a link to the procedures for product recalls in the EEC. http://www.emea.eu.int/Inspections/Defects.html This document deals with Medical products, but the same procedures apply to all products made in the EU. Try this site. It deals with Consumer Affairs in the EU. http://europa.eu.int/pol/cons/index_en.htm I would try to help you more but my computer keeps locking up. I have to log off.

[elmaceh]

Originally Posted by safewalrus

Just a thought, considering your an AID Agency makes you kinda special I believe - people may take notice of what you say! So Find the most influential tabloid news paper in the area of the poor performer (you know the paper I mean - the one with the T-A - L -L stories that everybody buys). they are normally on the lookout for good stories of human interest! OK so the tsunami is old news so make it new tell them all about it, don't mince your words and use a colourful account! With a bit of luck not only will you get the geny's sorted out but you'll get some good publicity as well (all publicity is good publicity, even the bad gets you noticed - this gets you needed funds to help you with your work!)

Well it's only a thought, may work

the Walrus

You are right Walrus, The unit was made in the Netherlands and I have contacted my good friend Gerard Dijkstra to steer me to the best tabloid rag to get this in front of the makers home audience. The Dutch are pretty good about social responsibility and it was a big surprise to be abused and insulted by this companies service staff. They are of course trying to hide behind their agent in Indonesia where we purchased the unit and of course they know that consumer protection here is almost non existent. When it comes to a recall issue, it does not matter where the complaint come from as long as the authorities concerned take up the matter and study it. They will soon see that the unit has a serious design flaw. Check this forum for more specific detail http://www.network54.com/Forum/493700/

[elmaceh]

Originally Posted by Ike

i spent many years working for the US Coast Guard managing product recalls. You have two problems here. First is what country was the product made in (or the Eurpean Economic Community). Second is where are you? If you bought the product somewhere else the company may have no legal responsibilty other than in the country of origin. Of course this does not excuse their behaviour.

The EEC does have proceedures for product recalls. here is a link to the procedures for product recalls in the EEC. http://www.emea.eu.int/Inspections/Defects.html This document deals with Medical products, but the same procedures apply to all products made in the EU. Try this site. It deals with Consumer Affairs in the EU. http://europa.eu.int/pol/cons/index_en.htm I would try to help you more but my computer keeps locking up. I have to log off.

Hey Ike, Thanks for these links. Exactly what I am looking for. We are a US based non-profit working in Sumatra http://www.island-aid.org

We purchased the Dutch genset new in Indonesia so very much an international affair and therefore the makers can run and hide behind their local agent as regards warranty responsibility. We want to take this to the next level and ensure that all these flawed gensets are recalled for modification. If we have to live with a dud genset then so be it but we are determined that others should not have to deal with the stress we have endured.

Our aid yacht has only one diesel genset aboard and when it fails we are in trouble. We carry a small petrol unit as a back up but all our trips since buying this unit have experienced gen set failure in the first couple of days.... and the unit has not yet done 200hours!!! Will try those links and report on progress.

[Ike]

Now that I have my computer working right again I can give you some more information. In the Netherlands the authority for product safety is Voedsel en WarenAutoreteit at http://www.vwa.nl. The site is in four languages. However I don't believe that is who you are supposed to contact.

The Consumer Complaint form can be found at http://europa.eu.int/comm/dgs/health...x/rapex_en.cfm along with instruction on how to use it and where to send it. On the top of the page is a menu. Select Asserting Consumers Rights and select Consumer Complaints from the drop down menu. This will take you to a page that has instructions and the form. Apparently you are supposed to work through a consumer organization. In the Netherlands it is

Pays-Bas/The Netherlands
Consumentenbond
Postbus 1000
NL - 2500 BA Den Haag
Tel: + 31 70 445 45 45
Fax: + 31 70 445 45 90

ALso on the first page can be found information on a producers responsibilities. On the left hand side click on Product Safety In Europe. There is a download of a PDF file that is the Guide book for producers conserning product safety.

I hope this helps.

[Sander Rave]

Hi Rick,

As I have experience in designing / engineering gensets, I'm interrested in your troubles conserning yours. Can you please send me your case, data/photo's, model etc? I don't know if you're still strugling with the same problems?
You can mail me or use a private message if you like.
Thanks in advance.

[elmaceh]

Originally Posted by Sander Rave

Hi Rick,

As I have experience in designing / engineering gensets, I'm interrested in your troubles conserning yours. Can you please send me your case, data/photo's, model etc? I don't know if you're still strugling with the same problems?
You can mail me or use a private message if you like.
Thanks in advance.

Thanks for helping Sander. I've posted the loads and brief specs at this link.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/493700/

We are based in West Sumatra so seawater temps are at 28deg to 29deg C
Air temps are about 28deg C to 35deg C. The unit is mounted in a large lazz compartment and not in the engine room so it is in a well ventilated environment with an extract fan for additional cooling. Let me know what else you need to know.

[elmaceh]

Originally Posted by Ike

Now that I have my computer working right again I can give you some more information. In the Netherlands the authority for product safety is Voedsel en WarenAutoreteit at http://www.vwa.nl. The site is in four languages. However I don't believe that is who you are supposed to contact.

The Consumer Complaint form can be found at http://europa.eu.int/comm/dgs/health...x/rapex_en.cfm along with instruction on how to use it and where to send it. On the top of the page is a menu. Select Asserting Consumers Rights and select Consumer Complaints from the drop down menu. This will take you to a page that has instructions and the form. Apparently you are supposed to work through a consumer organization. In the Netherlands it is

Pays-Bas/The Netherlands
Consumentenbond
Postbus 1000
NL - 2500 BA Den Haag
Tel: + 31 70 445 45 45
Fax: + 31 70 445 45 90

ALso on the first page can be found information on a producers responsibilities. On the left hand side click on Product Safety In Europe. There is a download of a PDF file that is the Guide book for producers conserning product safety.

I hope this helps.

Peter, thanks again for your help. I've mailed everyone that your links led me to including Consumentenbond. Found The European Consumers Organization http://www.beuc.org and have mailed them as well. Lets wait and see what transpires. My partner and deputy mission coordinator Jane holds a UK passport and the maker is Dutch so it should not matter where we purchased the unit in the end. Especially with respect to a general recall.