Guns on boats?

[troy2000]

Designing the cabin to my sharpie has gotten a whole lot easier since I faced a few realities. For one thing, it's most likely never going offshore, or doing any long passage-making. As a matter of fact, it'll probably spend its entire floating career on Lake Mojave, Lake Mead and Lake Powell, along the Colorado River, and I doubt I'll ever be aboard it for more than a week at a time. And if it's even that long, I guarantee the wife won't be along....

That changes a whole lot of things. For example, I doubt anyone will ever try to cook while underway. My cooking will either be done at anchor, while tied up, while beached, and fairly often while actually sitting on a beach admiring the desert sunset behind my boat. So I can replace the traditional galley with a portable propane cook unit of some sort; maybe one that has a burner, plus a reversible grill: flat on one side for pancakes and eggs, ridged on the other for steaks and hot dogs. Add my old Dutch oven that I can cook almost anything in, and I'm in business.

Nor will I be in desperate need of a chart table. If I need to spread a chart (highly unlikely), I can use the drop table on the centerboard.

Eliminating those two items creates space on either side of the companionway for the things I consider important. First, I want an enclosed space to one side for a portable toilet, or at least one that has a draw curtain. that way, if I have guests ( especially ladies) aboard, they can have a little privacy without running everyone out of the cabin. I'll also need some sort of a minimal sink for hand washing and dishes, even if it's only a pan I can empty over the side

On the other side, I want a hanging locker, general storage, and a gun cabinet. Yep, a gun locker. I've had guns within reach all my life, and it's a little late to break me of the habit now.

I'm not looking at an arsenal. I just want room for a rifle and a shotgun, a handgun or two, a couple of boxes of ammunition, and a cleaning kit. But a friend of mine told me indignantly today, "you can't have guns on a boat; it's against the law!"

Somehow, I doubt that. I have pretty much the same setup in my motor home, and although I've never really read up on the legalities I use a little common sense: when I'm on the road (including temporary stops for food, gas, shopping, etc.,), the guns stay under lock and key. If I'm hunting or plinking, the long guns go out the door with me after I'm parked, and go back into lockup once I've returned.

After I'm parked and settled in for the evening, a handgun comes out as a safety measure. I assume that once the key's out of the ignition, I have the same right to have it handy as I would in my home, in my shop, or in a motel room.

I've found very few particulars on the internet specifically relating to guns and boats, though. Does anyone have a source for specific federal, California, Nevada and Arizona laws on the subject?

There is no Federal law concerning this. I don't know your state laws but to join the Union in 1849, CA had to agree to the Constitution and the ammendments thereof, including the Second. I'd be curious about CA gun laws, tho - we sometimes get discount boxes of guns as "CA illegal". In Alaska here, they'ed arrest ya' for "stupid" if ya' didn't have a gun. Everyone has at least one of these here...

They go nicely with the FiveseveN

5.7x.28 is the new, improved .22 - but it pisses off anti-gunners so that makes it even better.

[Dave Gudeman]

I'm not an expert, but you probably won't get anyone closer to an expert on this forum :-) . Back when I got my Arizona concealed-carry permit the rules were pretty simple. You can carry any civilian firearm any way and anywhere that you want as long as --it's not concealed (or you have a CCW permit), the owner of the property doesn't specifically tell you you can't, the premises do not serve alcohol (I'm not sure if there was a distinction between restaurants and bars), it's not a federal building, and it's not within 100 feet of a school (which no longer applies since the Supreme Court struck down that federal law). Carrying it in a proper gun case is not considered concealed, so I imagine a gun cabinet would not be either.

California is more restrictive. I didn't bring any guns when I moved here from Arizona because I didn't want to bother learning the new laws and I'd rather beat a mugger to death with my bare hands anyway. :-)

[capt vimes]

you are nuts...

[daiquiri]

There we go again...

[bntii]

Just hearsay but I believe the statute deals with if you sleep on the boat or not.
I you don't sleep there the boat is a conveyance with the statutes applied as in a car.
Sleep there and it's a domicile.

You will appreciate this Troy:


I have always enjoyed match shooting.
These old German match pellets rifles are a joy to use and can be set up for a basement target range at their 10 meter range.

[troy2000]

Originally Posted by bntii

Just hearsay but I believe the statute deals with if you sleep on the boat or not.
I you don't sleep there the boat is a conveyance with the statutes applied as in a car.
Sleep there and it's a domicile.

It seems to me that would be the common-sense way to approach the situation, but of course laws don't always make sense.

You will appreciate this Troy:

I have always enjoyed match shooting.
These old German match pellets rifles are a joy to use and can be set up for a basement target range at their 10 meter range.

That's quite a pellet gun; thanks for the picture. I've never seen one with a peep sight before. I installed a peep sight and fiber-optic front sight on my Winchester 1894 (.30-30 lever-action carbine), because it ejects the shells straight up and a scope isn't practical. I like the setup so much I'm considering doing it to some of my other rifles, instead of scoping them.

[wardd]

you forgot a deck gun, preferably a dual purpose 5" 38 cal with proximity fuses

[bntii]

I have been shooting rifle matches for some time.
These Olympic competition rifles from this era are remarkable machines.
They are in the lineage to the rifles that are currently used in international competition, including the Olympics.
That Walther in the pic above in not mine though I am considering buying it.

This is a 1969 FWB300 that I regularly shoot for score:



Though long obsolete for Olympic competition it it's still a fine platform for marksmanship.
In firearms I shoot the old Winchester 52C. Again a older style .22 match rifle though still remarkably well suited for the fine art of marksmanship.
Here it the 52C set up with one of the vintage Unertl scopes from the same period as the rifle:



For your 1894 I would look into the period Lyman peep sights. Maybe the #66?

[troy2000]

Very nice indeed. Precision shooting is a world away from what I do, which is a bit of hunting and a lot of plinking. I also collect Mosin Nagant rifles.

Here are some pic's of my oldest and newest Mosins. The M91 was made by New England Westinghouse for the Czar's Army in 1915, but never delivered because of the Russian Revolution. It's in a Finnish Arctic birch stock, because bubba got hold of the original American walnut one. The shorter one is a 91/59, the last model produced in Russia.







And the stuff that makes them go boom: my last purchase of Bulgarian surplus.

[troy2000]

Forgot to add: I have a Williams peep sight on my Winchester 94. It's pretty much the same thing as the Lyman, but the model I bought doesn't have the wheels for adjustment; it takes a screwdriver. That's fine with me; I leave it set for 100 yards anyway, and it's less likely to snag on clothing or anything else. combining it with a good quality fiber optic front sight is what makes it a pleasure for my 60 year old eyes. I bought the peep sight alone and a friend gave me the front sight, but Williams also sells them as a set they call "Fire Sight."

[troy2000]

Originally Posted by wardd

you forgot a deck gun, preferably a dual purpose 5" 38 cal with proximity fuses

I'm hoping to be a beta tester for the concrete deck guns when they go into production....

[bntii]

I am still kicking myself.
One of my sisters husband was a class III guy and had a hundred or so cases of ammo. 30 or so of what you have above.. also .223, 9mm, .45 ..
I could of had any of it - free for the asking- but told her to sell it all off when her husband passed away.
Does not pay to be too nice..
He also had a couple of the WWI Maxims- whole kit- tripods, water cans, belts and loads of ammo.
Museum quality stuff.
Nice rifles you have, I don't know too much about these.

You have it right on the concrete deck guns..
I believe they were tested on U-boats during WWII to some success.

Maybe apex will weigh in on this weighty topic..

Back to topic..

Aren't bullets more or less the state bird in Arizona there are so many flying around.
So you think there is any cause for concern there with regs?

[troy2000]

Originally Posted by bntii

I am still kicking myself.
One of my sisters husband was a class III guy and had a hundred or so cases of ammo. 30 or so of what you have above.. also .223, 9mm, .45 ..
I could of had any of it - free for the asking- but told her to sell it all off when her husband passed away..
Does not pay to be too nice..
He also had a couple of the WWI Maxims- whole kit- tripods, water cans, belts and loads of ammo.
Museum quality stuff.
Nice rifles you have, I don't know too much about these.

Mosin Nagants were adopted in 1891 by the Russians. They were a blend of two designs: one submitted by a Russian, and the other by one of the Nagant brothers of Belgium. They fire 7.62x54R, which is a rimmed .30 round roughly equivalent to the American .30-06. They have five-round fixed magazines that can be loaded with stripper clips.

Like most Russian firearms, they're reliable and virtually indestructible. They can also be very accurate. Russian snipers in WWII were armed with rifles that were selected off the assembly line and modified, instead of being purpose-built. Finland still builds sniper rifles built on Mosin Nagant receivers, some of which are antique receivers from the 1890's.

They're also dirt cheap, because so many were made. Here in the States, you can buy a 91/30, or an M-44 (with folding bayonet) for $79.00.

[Submarine Tom]

Your right troy2000, laws don't always make sense but they often do at the time they were made , trouble comes when they get out dated and nobody changes them.

All I can add is don't bring your boat and guns into Canada without declaring them or you'll end up in a heap of trouble. Like jail, losing all your guns and perhaps your boat. No offence (personally I mean) but the laws about that stuff are pretty strict here and I've seen lots of friendly Americans completely shocked to be going off to jail for the weekend.
Again, don't get me wrong, although I don't own any guns I am a card carrying member and use them intermittently.

-Tom