Global Warming? are humans to blame?

[Knut Sand]

Originally Posted by Raftman1979

Stern said the results are living proof that virtually ALL Obama's black supporters are voting for him simply because he is black!! They don't know, or care, what his policies are -- only that he has black skin. Very revealing, huh?? Not to mention very, very DANGEROUS!!

Would be even more interesting if he had made a blind test, targeting the white people, changing the politic platform for each candidate...?

The fact that he probably didn't... tells you something about him too....?

Will probably only prove that the "face factor" matters...
(said by me, who have a face for radio, and a voice for silent movies.. .).

What said above here about spelling mistakes / spell checker:
I don't like to change the spell checker to some minor language (english) from one of the major languages of the world just to make a crappy post in a substandard language. Get a grip on reality folks; educate yourself; learn Norwegian....

[Raftman1979]

White people would probably fail the test too. Nearly every person I talk to is ignorant about the candidates policies and voting records, thanks to the lies spread by the Obama campaign ads and the liberal media. I don't like McCain's policies, however Obama's are much, MUCH worse.

I've only been old enough to vote in the last two Presidential elections. In both cases, I voted for the "lesser of two evils". Bush and Bush.

And one more thing. I vote for the candidate who I feel is best to lead the United States of America, not the candidate who the rest of the world thinks I should vote for. I am a citizen of the United States, not a citizen of the world. I am not concerned with what life is like in other countries and I don't want my wages taxed to help other countries. If the people in these countries are starving, perhaps they should look to their own governments to adopt the free market capitalism that made the United States what it is today, or at least what it WAS, before socialists started taking over the media and brain-washing Americans into thinking there is something wrong with free markets.

[Pericles]

Knut and Raftman,

Two and now four great and insightful posts. Obama has such a smooth seductive voice and such a very pleasant mien that one almost wishes that what he is saying and promising were true. However, the moment he jumped on the CO2 band wagon, that was the very moment that I realised he is totally the wrong person to be elected to the White House. The adoption of the "CO2 is a pollutant" policy is the most wrong, the wrongest even, (if you will forgive the term please ) proposal in his election manifesto, that it were possible for him to embrace

That said, I am reminded that two of America's greatest presidents, when they were in office, did the very opposite of what they had promised whilst they were on their campaign trails. Lincoln promised to preserve slavery and Franklin D. Roosevelt promised to balance the Federal budget. We should all know what happened.

It is just possible that Obama is saying what he thinks is necessary in order to become president and then, when elected, he will announce a change of heart. His choice of Biden for running mate makes that very unlikely. Obama is scientifically and mathematically challenged. His forte is words, not numbers, as far as I know.

Palin, on the other hand is entirely sceptical of AGW. Coming from Alaska, she can see the evidence that global cooling is returning with a vengeance. That gives me hope that she will be able to offer guidance to McCain, should they be elected.

America's next president needs to do and know two things.

1) Tell the American people that for over a generation they have been living on credit, fuelled, by ever increasing house prices. They will not want to hear that. It's not comforting, but leadership is about telling people what they don't want to hear and then, securing their agreement to knuckle down and use their intellectual curiosity to understand the reality of the situation they are in and what it will take to mend it. It's very likely to get much worse before they see results, but by doing their duty they should be able to lead their nation to greatness once again. My concern would be that America already has more dunces and ditherers than doers amongst the population and that this decline is terminal and non reversible. We shall see.

2) Do any of you know how this £700 billion bailout is supposed to work? I don't, because fear and panic are endemic in the stock market just now and that money is not enough to bring steadiness and courage back amongst the investors. They are frightened and are even prepared to sell the world's future prosperity just so they can salvage a few bucks. We don't need these parasites and the sooner they are totally broke and on the scrap heap, the sooner sense and sensibility will return to the global markets. Now it would be nice to have a president in the White House who really understands how these things work. It's entirely possible that one of the candidates understands what has been going on and that the other doesn't, but right this minute, I have not been able to discern from their speeches so far, which one that is! I could really do with a little help here please.
America needs a president who can restore America. Not looking too good is it?

Perry

[schakel]

Originally Posted by Raftman1979

Yes, I think it's a shame that people who can't even spell the words they're trying to say think their opinions matter more than mine.

Believe it or not, Howard Stern, whom I hardly ever listen to, and don't care for that much, pulled off an absolutely brilliant piece of journalism this week! He upstaged everyone on talk radio with the man-on-the-street interviews he did on his show. He and an assistant interviewed at random black people on the streets of NYC, where his show originates. He had the assistant ask questions about the election and whom they were voting for. Naturally, 98% of the blacks were for Obama. Then, in follow-up questioning, they switched Obama's platform with McCain's; had Obama proposing what John McCain and Sarah Palin are advocating. When asked if they approved of Obama's "policies," the ALL said they did. Yep. Sure do. And when asked if Sarah Palin was a problem as Obama's "running mate," they all said they had no issue with it at all; that she'd do fine. Stern said the results are living proof that virtually ALL Obama's black supporters are voting for him simply because he is black!! They don't know, or care, what his policies are -- only that he has black skin. Very revealing, huh?? Not to mention very, very DANGEROUS!!

Nobel price award winning Al Gore isn't black. Does that make him incompetent to signing the Kyoto protocol like the rest of the world, if he was running the campaign for the democrats this year?

To sign the Kyoto protocol is what the democrats are dividing from the republicans for a long time. Nevertheless what happened in New Orleans. Neither the new hurricane season that is not over yet, Nor the melting of the arctic ice seems enough evidence. But what is very rewarding to fill your wallet with, are the new concessions that have to be drilled in the Arctic since the ice is gone. Perhaps Oil connections and a Business school degree is sufficient enough to be the next president.

Ladies and gentleman: Fill your wallets.... Vote for .....

Isn’t that were the credit crunch is all about? These fine politics lead to destruction of the capitalistic system that was good under Alexis the Toqueville philosophy. (Democracy in America. Don't bother.. nobody read it.) And those people call themselves conservatives while they don't conserve anything for the next generation: Neither Oil, a reliable money system, stable climate, nor stable sea levels. Not to mention the bad blood they cultivate to the other countries of the world. But hey.. That is what our expensive defence system and our war on terror is equipped for.

When Greenland melts, all harbour towns in world will have to move to higher ground for 6 meters. Calculated what that will do for your country.

It will be the biggest destruction of money in the world so far.

Well all those PHd's can't be right of course. Lets hire some to prove the opposite....

That is what in psychological warfare is happening and that is what is happening now. IPCC is a part of the UN and it's heavily under fire because some influentials want to fill their pockets and improve their power. Guess they are going to make money from the mass migrations that will take place within 20 years.


There is a visionary science fiction about this: Mad Max. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0079501/

A world that goes the drain because of greed.....

[Pericles]

schakel, you cretin,

Can't you ***king read, you stupid person?

"Nobel price award winning Al Gore isn't black. Does that make him incompetent to signing the Kyoto protocol like the rest of the world, if he was running the campaign for the democrats this year?" What the hell does that mean? What the hell do you mean? You make no sense at all! Twerp.

"When Greenland melts, all harbour towns in world will have to move to higher ground for 6 meters." You actually believe this, you tosspot? You are an ignoramus! I wanted to write ignoranus, but you are definitely too illiterate and mathematically dumb to understand the jibe.

Greenland's ice is not in danger of melting away, the oceans are not rising and you couldn't find your arse with both hands.

http://wattsupwiththat.com/?s=Greenland%27s+ice

As for the rest of the drivel in your post, I invite others to point out your errors, for your information. I haven't got time for you. Drop dead!

[Knut Sand]

Originally Posted by Pericles

Greenland's ice is not in danger of melting away, the oceans are not rising and you couldn't find your arse with both hands.

http://wattsupwiththat.com/?s=Greenland%27s+ice

Pericles; your link, links to this:
http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v...s/ngeo316.html

I read that as they are concerned about underlying melting water, below the ice, increasing the speed of melting, reducing the friction (increasing breakaeay ice).

Quote:
Suggested explanations for the speed-up of Jakobshavn Isbræ include increased lubrication of the ice–bedrock interface as more meltwater has drained to the glacier bed during recent warmer summers4 and weakening and break-up of the floating ice tongue that buttressed the glacier5. Here we present hydrographic data that show a sudden increase in subsurface ocean temperature in 1997 along the entire west coast of Greenland, suggesting that the changes in Jakobshavn Isbræ were instead triggered by the arrival of relatively warm water originating from the Irminger Sea near Iceland. We trace these oceanic changes back to changes in the atmospheric circulation in the North Atlantic region. We conclude that the prediction of future rapid dynamic responses of other outlet glaciers to climate change will require an improved understanding of the effect of changes in regional ocean and atmosphere circulation on the delivery of warm subsurface waters to the periphery of the ice sheets.
Quote end.

They seem a bit worried... Should we..?

[harlemriverman]

Originally Posted by juiceclark

Oh...are we talking about the US Prez. election again? If so, Obama's narrow lead would indicate we whites are going to have to learn how to dance:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL4MbTGjB7U

camp town ladies sing that song, do dah...do dah...i'm practicing already.

[schakel]

Originally Posted by Pericles

http://wattsupwiththat.com/?s=Greenland%27s+ice



schakel, you cretin,
Can't you ***king read, you stupid person?
The same to you: you can’t read what I wrote: I pointed out that the opinion over carbon dioxide as stated by Al Gore and Barrack Obama is without regard of what colour of skins.

"Nobel price award winning Al Gore isn't black. Does that make him incompetent to signing the Kyoto protocol like the rest of the world, if he was running the campaign for the democrats this year?" What the hell does that mean? What the hell do you mean?
In the Kyoto protocol that was not signed by the USA carbon-dioxide emissions are regulated world wide. You are not in the subject.


You make no sense at all! Twerp.'
Keep constantly miss - interpreting and you are garanteed you do not have a discussion nor that that you take part in a forum. And stop calling names it's non engineering like nor politically correct nor gentleman like. But that seems to be you trademark so far.

"When Greenland melts, all harbour towns in world will have to move to higher ground for 6 meters." You actually believe this, you tosspot? You are an ignoramus! I wanted to write ignoranus, but you are definitely too illiterate and mathematically dumb to understand the jibe.
Do you have a masters of science degree in petroleum engineering and a proven curriculum of 20 high complex industrial facilities in the world?
I will be very lenient with you since you seems to be not in this subject but what you are saying is unreasonable.

Greenland's ice is not in danger of melting away, the oceans are not rising and you couldn't find your arse with both hands.
The curve of the carbon dioxide goes exactly as stated in inconvenient truth by Nobel price award winning Al Gore. It is calculated that this improves the absorption of solar rays and that this will rise the temperature of the earth. After the polar ice the land ice will melt and the expected rise of the seawater around the world will be 6 metres.
Those scientist of the Nobel academy shouldn’t be able to find their arse with both hands as well?
http://nobelprize.org/


As for the rest of the drivel in your post, I invite others to point out your errors, for your information. I haven't got time for you. Drop dead

And the rest is international politics but from what you discussed so far you are the ignorant one.

Nice framework

[harlemriverman]

Originally Posted by Pericles

America's next president needs to do and know two things.

1) Tell the American people that for over a generation they have been living on credit, fuelled, by ever increasing house prices. They will not want to hear that. It's not comforting, but leadership is about telling people what they don't want to hear and then, securing their agreement to knuckle down and use their intellectual curiosity to understand the reality of the situation they are in and what it will take to mend it. It's very likely to get much worse before they see results, but by doing their duty they should be able to lead their nation to greatness once again. My concern would be that America already has more dunces and ditherers than doers amongst the population and that this decline is terminal and non reversible. We shall see.

2) Do any of you know how this £700 billion bailout is supposed to work? I don't, because fear and panic are endemic in the stock market just now and that money is not enough to bring steadiness and courage back amongst the investors. They are frightened and are even prepared to sell the world's future prosperity just so they can salvage a few bucks. We don't need these parasites and the sooner they are totally broke and on the scrap heap, the sooner sense and sensibility will return to the global markets. Now it would be nice to have a president in the White House who really understands how these things work. It's entirely possible that one of the candidates understands what has been going on and that the other doesn't, but right this minute, I have not been able to discern from their speeches so far, which one that is! I could really do with a little help here please.
America needs a president who can restore America. Not looking too good is it?

Perry

now that's the truth!

something on the order of 70% of our debt is financed by foreign sources, thank you very much for supporting the american economy. a lot of that is attributable to portfolio theory, something american's also don't understand. historically our sovereign risks have remained relatively small compared with, say, china or russia. or croatia-serbia for that matter. but all this might be changing folks, so get ready to shuffle the deck. no fun relegated to second fiddle but can't say we don't deserve it.

speaking of land locked isles, fear not all!

according to the national democratic committee and obama / biden campaign, a world crisis now looms in april 2009, the carbon emitting likes of which we have not seen before. so move to high ground with your boats, the water is coming to ya!

someday i got to get me one of those crystal balls.

[juiceclark]

Raftman,
Here's the Stern clip you referred too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5p3OB6roAg

Can there be any question Obama and statist liberals always appeal to the least educated and least intelligent in society? (least educated including liberal arts degreed momma's boys) Style, not substance, will win this election. I just hope the sinking intellect in this country will not fall for empty socialist promises forever more.

Speaking of socialists, this clip explains why anyone involved in the marine industry would be a damned fool to vote for a democrat. Our industry is screwed in the very near future:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1Mazjm_A5k

[Pericles]

Knut,

I get the feeling that amongst the Global Cooling fraternity, the reputation of "Nature" has been somewhat tarnished by their unremitting support for AGW and the IPCC. This is supported by their editorial decision, not to publish peer reviewed studies that contradict the scientific conclusions of AGW. Their view is that the "science is settled" whereas any proper scientist will tell you that is never the case. There are always new facts to discover.

As such, "Nature" is perhaps a flawed vehicle for the unbiased publication of discoveries related to progress in climate research, allegedly! That's my opinion. Of course, your mileage may vary.

Perry

[Pericles]

HRM,

"according to the national democratic committee and obama / biden campaign, a world crisis now looms in april 2009, the carbon emitting likes of which we have not seen before. so move to high ground with your boats, the water is coming to ya!"

In April 2009 AD, a degree of probability of extremely close to zero. In 3883 AD, that is 75 human generations down from us. Who cares?

"If simple arithmetic is beyond them, how can they work it out that when the sea levels were rising by about by 3.2 mm per year as they were back in 2003, it would have taken 10 years to rise by 32 mm (just a little over one inch) and 100 years to rise by 320 mm or slightly under 13 inches, or 1,875 years to rise by the 6 metres that schakel claimed in #624."

2008 + 1875 = 3883 A generation is calculated at 25 years, therefore there are 40 generation per 1000 years. That's for schakel.

Regards,

Perry

[schakel]

Originally Posted by Pericles

HRM,

"according to the national democratic committee and obama / biden campaign, a world crisis now looms in april 2009, the carbon emitting likes of which we have not seen before. so move to high ground with your boats, the water is coming to ya!"

In April 2009 AD, a degree of probability of extremely close to zero. In 3883 AD, that is 75 human generations down from us. Who cares?

"If simple arithmetic is beyond them, how can they work it out that when the sea levels were rising by about by 3.2 mm per year as they were back in 2003, it would have taken 10 years to rise by 32 mm (just a little over one inch) and 100 years to rise by 320 mm or slightly under 13 inches, or 1,875 years to rise by the 6 metres that schakel claimed in #624."

2008 + 1875 = 3883 A generation is calculated at 25 years, therefore there are 40 generation per 1000 years. That's for schakel.

Regards,

Perry

Yes, very educational but the point is it is 5 past twelve as we say in Holland.

The fairy brakes his spell and the ball is over the garos changed into a pumpkin and the horses into mice. Just like in the fairy tail. Only one glass shoe remain.

Since you are from London did you notice in The Economist first page that since September this year the American debt has grown from 400.000.000.000
to 1.000.000.000.000 and they had to add a digit at Wallstreet.

What to do about that? Obama will save the day?

To be more specific about what you stated: "The world crisis looms in april 2009" You mean we didn't had the worst part?

To be more specific about your calculation of sea level rise: You stated: "it would have taken 10 years to rise by 32 mm (just a little over one inch) and 100 years to rise by 320 mm or slightly under 13 inches, or 1,875 years to rise by the 6 metres that schakel claimed in" Did you see the movie an inconvenient truth. and did you see the scrambled information I recently received:

source:
http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/

[masalai]

If there is any significant ocean level rise it will not be from expanding water due to temperature rise or from the melting N pole ice regions - - - BUT - - - some estimations based on the volume of the icecap on Greenland would give rise to a 4 metres rise in global sea level if IF it all melted and MORE than 6 metres for the ANTARCTIC ice resting on ASL land.... some say up to 70metres in melt of global ice - but I feel that is a somewhat exuberant "over the top" estimation....

[Fanie]

Dear Perickles,

That is what is called politics. They don't care about the percentages... they just don't care. Word is out it's polution and they want to collect.

Exhaust gass is but one example. Solder (lead) is also under fire. Been working with the stuff for 30 years, never seen cripled babies born from this, or anyone with brain damage (and even if most of us get serious brain damage nobody would probably notice in any case) but there is an opportunity for politics to make money from this. Never heard of them attacking yachts because they have lead in the keels... I guess that makes them safe eh

Here's the joke on the solder one. Lead free solder flux emits very dangerous fumes, so you have to install special extractor fans for this Already it was reported that lead free solder becomes cracked after time and could result in dry joints. Someone is enjoying riding this because they score, fcuk the environment and those who pay up, good grief who cares.

Here in SA, the beach angler gets accused of the deminishing fish population, but just off-shore is a trailer netting THOUSANDS of TONS of fish for the day.
So they make the poor beach angler pay for every breath he takes. Besides, it's easy to kick the small guy in the groin good grief, you're not going to look for **** with the big boys are you

Again, just another simple way to abuse everyone to squeeze their hard earned buck from them.

There is a reason why abuse is so easy though. Firstly people just accepts crap coming from the so called 'leaders' because they are uninformed and secondly they are too **** scared to confront these idiots preaching their own. So the DFI who can shout the loudest score, the rest pays up.

That nuclear ship from the US was here a while ago. Man, there are like 5000 US people on the ship, in good health. The general public here, as dumb as the preverbial doornail blurted all kind of stupidity out on TV about what will happen to the people here if the ship enters harbour. God, I'm sometimes ashamed I'm a f human if I hear that crap.
__________________
Regards
Fanie