Early human marine exploration of North America and their vessels

[viking north]

I would like to make this a factual chat on this subject where posts have to be backed by proven documented reference material if questions arise on a statement made in a post. Example, the vikings explored the north american coast as far south as the Carolinas, Sorry no not a proven truth only speculation. So lets take it from the first known peoples to arrive here,(north america) was it the Siberians,the Iberians ----- Geo.

[gonzo]

Define Europeans so we can narrow the discussion.

[viking north]

Just knew when i wrote that "european" thing it was muddy, So let me see if i can edit to reduce confusion. Early Human exploration of North America and their vessels. Geo.
P.S.North America present day to include, Canada, United States,Mexico,----Geo.

[wardd]

define human

[viking north]

That would be more difficult than defining european but i can safely say like us on this side of the pond some are human. That is, some animals are more human than humans and some humans are more animal than animals. What ye think regardless of what was in those exploring craft who were the first, not an easy answer considering recent released info.--- Geo

[wardd]

I'm wondering if some early explorers stumble on new lands because they got lost

[hoytedow]

History isn't clear what happened to Nearchus, A the G's admiral. Maybe he made it to the New World.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nearchus

[kach22i]

I can see from the outline that we don't want to get distracted by the Phoenician's and others. However, I have to ask; from an academic viewpoint or standard can anything we find on the Internet be counted on as being reliable or valid?

Are we looking for a published thesis or something?

[hoytedow]

Originally Posted by kach22i

I can see from the outline that we don't want to get distracted by the Phoenician's and others. However, I have to ask; from an academic viewpoint or standard can anything we find on the Internet be counted on as being reliable or valid?

Are we looking for a published thesis or something?

Some of it. You have to pick.

And no.

[Ike]

Example, the vikings explored the north american coast as far south as the Carolinas, Sorry no not a proven truth only speculation

What is speculation? That they were here? or how far they explored? See L'anse Aux Meadows http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L'Anse_aux_Meadows

Ther is substantial evidence they were here. To me the only speculation is how far did they get.

A study has been recently release of DNA of families in Iceland that show they have

a type of DNA that is found only in Native Americans or East Asians

http://www.ancestor.com/dna/vikings-...000-years-ago/

[viking north]

Ok finally found this post again been looking for it for a week, funny postings here are not flagged on my e mail. Anyhow Ike exactly, we have to be careful with how we word a speculation otherwise it becomes thought of as a proven truth. The wording on this re the Carolinas, states it is possible they explored that far south, It is actually possible they explored further south but no proof exists to back up the speculation so from a pure history point of view they did not. In fact from a detail study of their problems with the Beothuck it is unlikely they would have chanced being too far from their fortified base camp. However having said that, from the Greenland sagas it does describe an encampment further south along the west coast of Nfld. From it's geographical description and being familiar with that coast i suspect it to be in Bonne Bay or Bay of Islands area. Not to repeat a long post i made on another thread under this heading (Open Discussion)(Vikings Travel Evidence, post # 9) I also have a theory that i intend to pass on to the Icelantic DNA searchers on where they might look to locate that missing native tribe that holds the dna they are looking for. I have an extensive liberary on the Beothuck. On that post i have also answered my opening question, Siberian or Iberian, actually the verdict is still out on who was first, but it now seems 100% for sure North America had both a west coast, Siberians via. Bering Straight, and an east coast, Iberians via the Atlantic ice bridge, in migration of first peoples. I ask you read that post to get a fuller view of this post. Tnx. Geo

In Nevada and Kennewick, WA, there are 9,000 year old remains clothed in what would have been European textiles and with caucasion bone structure. The present day natives have fought tooth-and-nail to prevent DNA testing, for obvious reasons, so for now, we don't know how they got there. The fact that the natives there now are fighting the tests indicates that they think they are European (or at least don't want to take the chance of being pre-dated). Haven't spotted their boats yet. I can't take time to research right now but didn't a farmer find a rock with a Viking symbol carved on it that was dated "old" in the NorthEast US?

[hoytedow]

Originally Posted by mark775

In Nevada and Kennewick, WA, there are 9,000 year old remains clothed in what would have been European textiles and with caucasion bone structure. The present day natives have fought tooth-and-nail to prevent DNA testing, for obvious reasons, so for now, we don't know how they got there. The fact that the natives there now are fighting the tests indicates that they think they are European (or at least don't want to take the chance of being pre-dated). Haven't spotted their boats yet. I can't take time to research right now but didn't a farmer find a rock with a Viking symbol carved on it that was dated "old" in the NorthEast US?

"History belongs to those who show up."
I don't remember who said that, maybe Rush Limbaugh.

The eliest record of Seafaring Ships show that they were developed by Irish lad using skins of animules
that they streated while still wet over bows of willow.

These dried tight as a drum from the wind in the willows and although circular in shape they
were very evectice in Circumnavigation the ancient world which all know was flat at the time.





Phoenician's and others. However were distrcted by mind altering substances and not able to document their boat building skills.
These is proven by the theroy of although Hooked on Phonics Noah told all who survived the mesurements of his ARK in Cubits.
Of course as the only other survivor was his wife and two daughters they did not understand engineering at the time ans simply
repeated the tale whicjh is all that can be found on the Internet today.

Simply that and the propensity to put large Elephants on top of their boats
diminished the vessels stabilty to the point that seaworthyness was comprimised.









from an academic viewpoint or standard the circular boats witstood the rigors of falling off the face of the Earth and ened up in New Amerdam
when they popped out of the haystacks near Hells Gate. Which was way too cold back then due to Global Warming
and they had to drag their boat south over the ice & Snow until they crossed out of Georgia into Florida.

They planted some Jamerson Wiskey Trees and called the new land "FLAUSA" after the Captian who led them there. Norwegian dialect flanta to wander and Usa translated as Land of Opportunity

[viking north]

Mark just a quick rely as i have to dig the details from my Viking texts but you are correct on the stone, it was researched and found the wording and was modern in form and not of an anchient text in use 1000yrs. ago. I.E. some of the words did not exist at that time. Thus was listed as a hoax. Similar to a so called Viking Tower (in Mass. i think,).For years it was rumored and then progressed to speculation that it was erected by Vikings until finally a researcher took it on and traced it to a building date in the early 1800's. There were several more Viking discoveries but again all were disproved being so. I do recall the clothing discovery and it certainly warrents a further"detailed" investigation one that could prove or disprove the whole discovery. Before continuing with the North American Viking period is there anyone out there that has any more info on the Iberian crossing. I think it would be good to have a further discussion on it. The early settlement of the Americas seems to be in a state of flux right now re the dates and peoples and this latest, what now seems to be confirmed Iberian first peoples has shaken up the so called neat and tidy documented way it happened theory. --Geo.